Winchester confusion

[Leadeye]

A friend was looking at older Winchester lever guns and after giving him some info on the confusing cartridge names I thought I would post it for everybody.

Left to right are the 32-20, 30-30, 32 Special, and 32-40

The 32-20, 32 Winchester, 32 WCF is a 32 caliber small cartridge found commonly in Winchester 1873 and 1892 rifles along with both Colt and S&W hand guns. The 30-30, 30 Winchester, 30 WCF is a smaller caliber but much larger cartridge found in the Winchester 1894 and various other rifles like Marlins. The 32 Special or 32 Winchester Special is basically a 32 caliber version of the 30-30, found again in Winchester 1894 rifles. The 32-40, 32-40 Ballard, or 32-40 WCF is an obsolete cartridge found in Winchester 1894s and some period target rifles, but is uncommon, like the ammunition. It can be formed from 30-30 cases and uses 32 caliber bullets.

 

[red_zr24x4]

The 32 special can also be found in Marlin rifles.

 

[red_zr24x4]

Was looking for a pic of the one Dad had. When he passed mom gave it to an uncle. When he passed his son got it.

 

[Seancass]

32-20 = 32 cal, 20 grains of black powder. 30-30 = 30 caliber, 30 grains of powder. 32 Special could have been 32-30 but i believe it arrived much after smokeless had completely taken over. 32-40, same nomenclature, 45-70, 45-90...

Of course this naming convention was applied as randomly as any is today!

That's why we all need a copy of Cartridges of the World! And maybe i should pick my copy up and read so I'd feel more confident in my post!

 

[NKBJ]

Don't forget the over penetrator 25-35.

 

[Broom_jm]

Then you have the 38-40...which is not a 38 caliber and does not hold 40 grains of black powder.

 

[Leadeye]

Then you have the 38-40...which is not a 38 caliber and does not hold 40 grains of black powder.

An excellent, although often overlooked cartridge!

 

[Seancass]

And, right along with 38-40 is the 44-40!

 

[Broom_jm]

And, right along with 38-40 is the 44-40!

No, the 44-40 actually follows the formula, shooting a 44 caliber bullet with 40gr of black powder.

The 38-40 seemingly uses the inverse, with 38gr of powder under a 40 caliber bullet.

 

[dooshie]

didn't they also make a 32 rim fire

 

[Seancass]

No, the 44-40 actually follows the formula, shooting a 44 caliber bullet with 40gr of black powder.

The 38-40 seemingly uses the inverse, with 38gr of powder under a 40 caliber bullet.

Danget you're right! I mixed up those two, thinking of fotay caliber! At least the 44-40 stays weird by specing 427 bullets instead of 429. In a "44"...

 

[Mgderf]

A friend was looking at older Winchester lever guns and after giving him some info on the confusing cartridge names I thought I would post it for everybody.

Left to right are the 32-20, 30-30, 32 Special, and 32-40

The 32-20, 32 Winchester, 32 WCF is a 32 caliber small cartridge found commonly in Winchester 1873 and 1892 rifles along with both Colt and S&W hand guns. The 30-30, 30 Winchester, 30 WCF is a smaller caliber but much larger cartridge found in the Winchester 1894 and various other rifles like Marlins. The 32 Special or 32 Winchester Special is basically a 32 caliber version of the 30-30, found again in Winchester 1894 rifles. The 32-40, 32-40 Ballard, or 32-40 WCF is an obsolete cartridge found in Winchester 1894s and some period target rifles, but is uncommon, like the ammunition. It can be formed from 30-30 cases and uses 32 caliber bullets.

So, would any of the above mentioned rifles be a sufficient candidate to be rechambered in .327 Federal magnum?

 

[Leadeye]

So, would any of the above mentioned rifles be a sufficient candidate to be rechambered in .327 Federal magnum?

Interesting project, a Winchester 1892 certainly has a strong enough action and can be easily found in 32-20. I'm not familiar with the 327 magnum, but a 32-20 in a model 1892 can be driven pretty hard with a good load, it just can't be used in a vintage Winchester 1873 which also chambered it. My books say 1800+ fps with bullets around 100 grains.

My 32-20 rifle is an 1892, really doesn't move much with lower velocity loads and cast bullets, but after reading your post I'll see if I can scare up some jacketed stuff and do a short test.

 

[mac45]

Marlin did their 94 in .32 HRM. I suspect a .327 would work, it's shorter than the .44 mag, which is also chambered in the 94

 

[Mgderf]

Interesting project, a Winchester 1892 certainly has a strong enough action and can be easily found in 32-20. I'm not familiar with the 327 magnum, but a 32-20 in a model 1892 can be driven pretty hard with a good load, it just can't be used in a vintage Winchester 1873 which also chambered it. My books say 1800+ fps with bullets around 100 grains.

My 32-20 rifle is an 1892, really doesn't move much with lower velocity loads and cast bullets, but after reading your post I'll see if I can scare up some jacketed stuff and do a short test.

My two biggest concerns with this idea are O.A.L. and chamber pressures.
I'm unfamiliar with the .32-20's and .32H&R magnum rifles. Not sure if there is room on the carrier for the longer round.
That, and chamber pressures in the diminutive .327fed/mag can exceed 42,000psi!
That's a lot to ask from a lesser caliber receiver.

 

[Leadeye]

My two biggest concerns with this idea are O.A.L. and chamber pressures.
I'm unfamiliar with the .32-20's and .32H&R magnum rifles. Not sure if there is room on the carrier for the longer round.
That, and chamber pressures in the diminutive .327fed/mag can exceed 42,000psi!
That's a lot to ask from a lesser caliber receiver.

32-20 is a larger case and consulting one of my modern books shows considerably higher potential velocity than the 327 HRM with 100 grain bullets. Unless a person had a stake already in the 327 I think the 32-20 would give you more power and versatility at least on paper. Winchester 1892s made after 1900 are pretty solid guns, the Rossi is copied from the design and you can find both Colt and SW revolvers from the 1900-1940 era chambered in 32-20 as well. Starline makes excellent brass which I use. This idea has my curiosity up, so I ordered some 100 grain JHP bullets. I have a Colt New Model Army DA revolver from 1927 in addition to the Winchester, we'll see how things work out.

 

[451_Detonics]

One other oddball is the .348 Winchester, chambered only in a single rifle, the Model 71 Winchester. It is also the basis for the 450 Alaskan wildcat in the same rifle. Another would be the .256 Winchester Magnum, the oddest firearm chambered for it would have to be the Hawkeye, a single shot Ruger Blackhawk.

 

[AmmoManAaron]

One other oddball is the .348 Winchester, chambered only in a single rifle, the Model 71 Winchester. It is also the basis for the 450 Alaskan wildcat in the same rifle. Another would be the .256 Winchester Magnum, the oddest firearm chambered for it would have to be the Hawkeye, a single shot Ruger Blackhawk.

A Coonan .357 Mag (1911-type) pistol with a spare barrel in .256 Win Mag would be a sweet cased set. I would add .22 Jet as well, but with the extreme body taper I don't think it would stack in the mags correctly. The .256 Win Mag has a much sharper shoulder and a mostly straight sided body, so it would probably work.

 

[oldpink]

One other oddball is the .348 Winchester, chambered only in a single rifle, the Model 71 Winchester. It is also the basis for the 450 Alaskan wildcat in the same rifle. Another would be the .256 Winchester Magnum, the oddest firearm chambered for it would have to be the Hawkeye, a single shot Ruger Blackhawk.

Great examples there.
The .348 is even to this day a real monster of a cartridge, certainly suitable for anything on the North American continent, as well as nearly all of the African continent.
Isn't it true that the Model 71 is possibly the finest quality lever gun that Winchester ever made, at least in terms of fit and finish?
I believe I read that somewhere, but it would be nice to hear from someone who actually owns one.