Told by FWPD illegal to OC in Indiana

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  • T-DOGG

    I'm Spicy, deal with it.
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    262   1   0
    Feb 4, 2011
    17,402
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    New Haven
    Today while eating lunch at China Buffet by Getz & Jefferson in Fort Wayne I was spoke to buy a FWPD officer who informed me that OC was illegal. Here is a rough draft of a letter to the FWPD addressing the issue. It explains the incident. Anything that you guys think I should add or remove please let me know and would be greatly appreciated (spelling/grammar mistakes of course). If there are any FWPD on here your input is also welcome.

    To whom it may concern,
    ....My name is Travis ____ and would like to provide to you clarification on a current Indiana gun law. First, I am going to tell you the reason why I am writing this letter to you. Today while eating lunch with my family at the China Buffet at Getz Road and Jefferson Boulevard I was approached by FWPD Officer ____. I was open carrying my handgun in a holster securely fastened to my belt. Officer ____ asked if I was an officer, to which I replied "No I am not". He then informed me that he was and that I was illegally carrying my firearm because it was not concealed. I replied that I was well within my rights to open carry. He then asked for my carry permit, which I provided, and he showed me his ID (being that he was not in uniform). He then asked me to step outside to further discuss the matter. We walked to his patrol car and he insisted that open carrying was illegal and was not polite about the subject. I informed him that I had researched my rights to carry in such manner and that I was doing nothing wrong. He then asked for my handgun while he made a phone call in his marked patrol car. After five minutes he handed me his cell phone and asked that I speak to his Sergeant on the matter. I spoke to Sergeant ____ (spelling may be slightly incorrect on his last name). The Sergeant also incorrectly informed me that I could be arrested for illegally carrying my firearm. He insisted that somewhere on my handgun permit it "should" say concealed carry ( It does not by the way, I hold a lifetime License To Carry Handgun in Indiana).

    .... I was let go with a verbal warning, which was improper at the time and was threatened that if I had been arrested it could negatively affect my ability to hold a handgun permit in the future. After our phone conversation ended, Officer ____ handed my handgun back to me and informed me again incorrectly that people can't just walk around carrying firearms out in the open. I then covered up my handgun on my right side with my polo shirt ( while leaving 2-3 inches of the gun exposed) and showed the Officer who said that was fine with him. I then informed him that I had recently walked around the Three Rivers festival and saw plenty of FWPD officers and had no incidents whatsoever. He replied that, if he had seen me, things would have been different. I would like to note that during my visit to the China Buffet and while speaking with the Officer, I was calm and respectful, even though the Officer was not.

    ....My question to the City of Fort Wayne would be: Is a citizen who has a License to Carry Handgun going to be harrassed while "open" carrying a handgun? There is no law or code that states that a law abiding citizen who is legally carrying a handgun has to carry it concealed. The reason I ask is because there is nothing stated at the Indiana State Police website (http://www.in.gov/isp/files/firearms_FAQ_02_08.pdf) in reference to any law requiring concealed carry nor open carry being illegal. I realize that any place of business can ask me to conceal my handgun or leave, that is not in question. I pay attention to business signage to verify firearms are allowed, I am aware some have a sign that reads " No firearms allowed ". I honor those establishments wishes. Nobody from the above mentioned restaurant spoke to me about my firearm. I was told by the two Officers that people get scared when they see guns and that's why nobody open carries, yet nobody in the restaurant seemed scared nor did anyone speak to me about my firearm. I would like some clarification on this matter. I would like some sort of documentation on any bylaw that may exist in Fort Wayne that I am unaware of. If there is such a bylaw obviously this is in direct violation of IC 35-47-11.1-2. I will then retain an attorney and file a lawsuit against the city for damages.

    Thank you for your time,
    Travis ____
     
    Last edited:
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Jul 3, 2008
    3,619
    63
    central indiana
    IC 35-47-11.1-2
    Political subdivision regulation of firearms, ammunition, and firearm accessories prohibited
    Sec. 2. Except as provided in section 4 of this chapter, a political subdivision may not regulate:
    (1) firearms, ammunition, and firearm accessories;
    (2) the ownership, possession, carrying, transportation, registration, transfer, and storage of firearms, ammunition, and firearm accessories; and
    (3) commerce in and taxation of firearms, firearm ammunition, and firearm accessories.
     

    indybuell

    Marksman
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    2   0   0
    Feb 22, 2012
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    Bargersville
    IC 35-47-11.1-2
    Political subdivision regulation of firearms, ammunition, and firearm accessories prohibited
    Sec. 2. Except as provided in section 4 of this chapter, a political subdivision may not regulate:
    (1) firearms, ammunition, and firearm accessories;
    (2) the ownership, possession, carrying, transportation, registration, transfer, and storage of firearms, ammunition, and firearm accessories; and
    (3) commerce in and taxation of firearms, firearm ammunition, and firearm accessories.

    The City of FW has no right to limit the carrying of firearms by LTCH holders.

    I would also go to the PD and file a formal complaint.
     

    Rookie

    Grandmaster
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    14   0   0
    Sep 22, 2008
    18,155
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    Kokomo
    You might clarify that you aren't asking for opinion, you're asking for the IC that pertains to concealed carry. You could also point them to ISP website which covers this matter.
     

    Lammchop93

    Master
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    35   0   0
    Oct 23, 2011
    1,666
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    Floyds Knobs
    I hate it when I read about stories like this, but hopefully it will turn in to an education experience for the officers.

    Also, I saw you were trying to blank out the officers name. You forgot one in the center of your letter. Just letting you know
     

    Benny

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 66.7%
    2   1   0
    May 20, 2008
    21,037
    38
    Drinking your milkshake
    1. You don't need quotations around, " I was well within my rights to open carry"

    2. You have a license, not a permit.

    3. affect, not effect.

    4. There should be an "a" before bylaw.
     

    Classic Liberal

    Sharpshooter
    Rating - 100%
    10   0   0
    Apr 12, 2012
    716
    18
    Dumb people attempting to enforce laws in which they know nothing about.

    And, society is supposed to rely on these same individuals to protect them?

    And, Frank would be happy with 10,000 of these idiots running around Marion county alone?
     
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    backfire

    Shooter
    Rating - 100%
    9   0   0
    Nov 6, 2011
    786
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    Location
    You might clarify that you aren't asking for opinion, you're asking for the IC that pertains to concealed carry. You could also point them to ISP website which covers this matter.
    That is B.S. and I agree ^^^.

    Then, do yourself a favor and go to the Great Wall Chinese Buffet at the corner of Jefferson and Ardmore in the Parkwest Plaza next time. MUCH better/fresher food with a MUCH greater selection.. ;)
     

    mrjarrell

    Shooter
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jun 18, 2009
    19,986
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    Hamilton County
    Personally, I would have told the cop to arrest me, if it was against the law. Then I would proceed to sue everyone and their cousin. They were the ones trying to violate your rights, OP. File a complaint, don't send a letter to know nothings asking for clarification.
     

    Hornett

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    15   0   0
    Sep 7, 2009
    2,579
    84
    Bedford, Indiana
    As a suggestion, don't just say you have "researched online".
    Researched online has bad connotations because you can find any answer you want to if you look long enough.

    Instead of this line,
    The reason I ask is because I have done research online that does not show in the State of Indiana that it is illegal to open carry.,
    State the Indiana Code. They are all listed in the FAQ
    https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...16185-ingunowners_faqs_sticky.html#post187168
    Say here's the code, where does it say concealed?

    And be sure to list the one that singlestacksig suggested or they will say "We have a special ordinance here in Fort Wayne.
     

    XSVskill

    Plinker
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Mar 21, 2012
    130
    18
    Decatur, IN
    don't ask for clarification, send them the ISP url addressing this matter and IC 35-47-11.1-2. Tell them they need to (re)educate the officers involved.
     

    rockhopper46038

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    89   0   0
    May 4, 2010
    6,742
    48
    Fishers
    The City of Fort Wayne is attempting to implement an illegal policy.

    Consult with an attorney at once.

    ...Anything that you guys think I should add or remove please let me know and would be greatly appreciated. If there are any FWPD on here your input is also welcome.

    To whom it may concern,
    ...My name is Travis ____ and would like [STRIKE]clarification[/STRIKE] to clarify for you current gun law. First, I am going to tell you the reason why I am writing this letter to you. Today while eating lunch with my family at the China Buffet at Getz Road and Jefferson Boulevard I was approached by FWPD Officer ____. I was open carrying my handgun in a belt fastened holster. Officer ____ asked if I was an officer, to which I replied "No I am not". He then informed me that he was and that I was illegally carrying my firearm because it was not concealed. I replied that " I was well within my rights to open carry". He then asked for my license, which I provided, and he showed me his ID (being that he was not in uniform). He then asked me to step outside to further discuss the matter. We walked to his patrol car and he insisted that open carrying was illegal and was not polite about the subject. I informed him that I had researched my rights to carry in such manner and [STRIKE]felt[/STRIKE]that I was doing nothing wrong. He then asked for my handgun while he made a phone call in his marked patrol car. After five minutes he handed me his cell phone and asked that I spoke to his Sergeant on the matter. I spoke to Sergeant ____ (spelling may be slightly incorrect on his last name). The Sergeant also incorrectlyinformed me that I could be arrested for illegally carrying my firearm. He insisted that somewhere on my handgun permit it "should" say concealed carry ( It does not by the way, I hold a lifetime permit in Indiana). I was let go with a "warning", which was improper under the circumstancesand was [STRIKE]told[/STRIKE] threatened that if I had been arrested it could negatively effect my ability to hold a handgun permit in the future. After our phone conversation ended, Officer Holmes handed my handgun back to me and informed me again incorrectlythat people can't just walk around carrying firearms out in the open. I then covered up my handgun on my right side with my polo shirt ( while leaving 2-3 inches of the gun exposed) and showed the Officer who said that was fine with him. I then informed him that I had recently walked around the Three Rivers festival and saw plenty of FWPD and had no incidents whatsoever. His reply was that of him not seeing me there and if he had things would have been different. I would like to note that at no time during my visit to the China Buffet or while speaking with the Officer was I outside of being calm and well mannered.
    ...My question to the City of Fort Wayne would be: Is a citizen who has a handgun permit going to be harrassed while"open" carrying a handgun? Does it legally have to be concealed? The reason I ask is because I have done research online that does not show in the State of Indiana that it is illegal to open carry. I realize that any place of business can ask me to conceal my handgun or leave, that is not in question. I pay attention to business signage to verify firearms are allowed, I am aware some have a sign that reads " No firearms allowed ". I honor those establishments wishes. Nobody from the above mentioned restaurant spoke to me about my firearm. I was told by the two Officers that people get scared when they see guns and that's why nobody open carries, yet nobody in the restaurant seemed scared nor did anyone speak to me about my firearm. I would like some clarification on this matter. I would like some sort of documentation on any illegal bylaw that may exist in Fort Wayne that I am unaware of. If there is such bylaw obviously I will retain an attorney and sue the city for damages.

    Thank you for your time,
    Travis _____


    Contact an attorney first.

    Edit: Amazingly hard to edit that letter on an iPhone. I missed some spots, but I hope you get the idea. You aren't asking for permission, you are informing them of poor training and/or incorrect actions taking place by their officers.

    I've provided my suggested changes to your letter.
     
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