Would you intervene in an armed robbery?

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  • Robertpetry

    Plinker
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    Apr 27, 2013
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    I assume this has been discussed but after 4 pages of search results I gave up.

    Just a quick scenario: Let's say you are in a Village Pantry or gas station and a guy comes in holding a gun. He threatens the person at the counter and asks for cash. He is yelling and threatening the cashier. You are only a few feet away but you are behind the guy and can get to your EDC quickly. Do you draw and shoot? Draw and tell him to drop it? Do you step back and stay out of the way assuming most of these situations end with no one getting shot?

    My my gut says option 3 but I would feel awful if the cashier is injured by a gunman I could have taken out.

    Thoughts?
     

    femurphy77

    Grandmaster
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    Mar 5, 2009
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    S.E. of disorder
    Nobody knows until it happens.

    Armchair quarterbacking I'd say that if it was apparent that it was about to become violent then yes, intervention would likely occur.

    If it's a quick smash and grab, find cover and be prepared for the worst and let the BG lam out.

    Again armchair quarterbacking.
     

    chezuki

    Human
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    48   0   0
    Mar 18, 2009
    34,151
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    Behind Bars
    I assume this has been discussed but after 4 pages of search results I gave up.

    Just a quick scenario: Let's say you are in a Village Pantry or gas station and a guy comes in holding a gun. He threatens the person at the counter and asks for cash. He is yelling and threatening the cashier. You are only a few feet away but you are behind the guy and can get to your EDC quickly. Do you draw and shoot? Draw and tell him to drop it? Do you step back and stay out of the way assuming most of these situations end with no one getting shot?

    My my gut says option 3 but I would feel awful if the cashier is injured by a gunman I could have taken out.

    Thoughts?
    Way too many variables to make that decision without actually being there. I hope I never have to find out.
     

    BiscuitNaBasket

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 98.6%
    73   1   0
    Dec 27, 2011
    15,855
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    Greenwood
    Way too many variables to make that decision without actually being there. I hope I never have to find out.
    This. Angle of shot. Getting the BG to point away from the clerk without sweeping somebody else. Where your shot will land after it passes through the BG. etc. etc. etc...
    Wow another "what if thread", so refreshing.
    images
     

    MickeyBlueEyes

    Sharpshooter
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    8   0   0
    Jan 29, 2009
    326
    18
    BFE, Indiana
    So, in that situation, I would have my family move to the coolers away from the perp, maybe into the bathrooms if they can do so without becoming victims. I would then, put one in the base of his skull because a forcible felony is a justifiable reason in Indiana with IC35-41-3. The base of his skull, because I don't want anybody causing harm to the attendant after the action occurs. The attendants life and mine were the only ones in jeopardy, so I wouldn't want an errant round taking out anyone else or causing harm to the attendant. There is no center of mass clause for defense in Indiana, so that is also why I say that. Lastly, the chances of recovery from that wound put it right into the no more crime files. It's a bit difficult to judge what would actually happen, until it does, but that is one of the scenarios we need to be mindful of. A robbery, in any stage, is a justifiable use of deadly force in Indiana. In public, in the defense of myself, of my family, of a third party, anywhere I have a legal right to be. So, my question is, if you carry concealed or open, why wouldn't you protect an innocent bystander with deadly force? Isn't this the whole reason law abiding gun owners carry guns?
     

    chezuki

    Human
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    48   0   0
    Mar 18, 2009
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    Behind Bars
    So, my question is, if you carry concealed or open, why wouldn't you protect an innocent bystander with deadly force? Isn't this the whole reason law abiding gun owners carry guns?

    No. I carry a gun to protect my family and myself, and that is my top priority. All other scenarios will be assessed on a case-by-case basis.

    Not saying I wouldn't defend an innocent bystander if the situation called for it, but that is NOT the "the whole reason I carry a gun".
     

    Trigger Time

    Air guitar master
    Rating - 98.6%
    204   3   0
    Aug 26, 2011
    40,112
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    SOUTH of Zombie city
    I only carry a gun because it looks cool.....
    :lmfao:

    exactly! Why do we carry if we are just gonna do nothing.

    So the guy is infront of the counter threatening the cashier with a weapon or gesturing that he possibly had a weapon and is demanding money. I'm somewhere else in the store behind the guy and he hasn't seen me? Umm I'm taking a knee and shooting the ****tard.
     

    Drail

    Master
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    0   0   0
    Oct 13, 2008
    2,542
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    Bloomington
    It would be tempting to follow him out the door with the money and then rob him. See how he likes it..... (just kidding boys and girls) I would not engage him unless I was pretty sure he was going to hurt someone else.
     

    MCgrease08

    Grandmaster
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    37   0   0
    Mar 14, 2013
    14,373
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    Earth
    Let me throw a monkey wrench into the mix...

    Say you intervene and fire on the bad guy... only his buddy, or brother, is outside serving as lookout. BG #2 hears the shots and runs inside only to fire back at you. Now you're in a full blown gun fight.
     

    stephen87

    Grandmaster
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    22   0   0
    May 26, 2010
    6,658
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    The Seven Seas
    If he hasn't drawn and is gesturing, the plan is to get myself and my family to safety. If he has drawn and is in my way of safety, I'm drawing and ordering him to stop.

    That's the plan anyway.


    The reality is:: **** myself and hope he won't mess with me because of it.
     

    Que

    Meekness ≠ Weakness
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 98%
    48   1   0
    Feb 20, 2009
    16,373
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    Blacksburg
    I carry a gun for SELF-defense, which included me and my family. If I am alone and I believe the guy will leave without harming anyone, I may stay still. However, there comes a time when the rubber meets the road and I may have to care for another, beyond my self-preservation. I'm not sure if this would be the time, based on the information provided, so I guess my answer is "maybe".
     

    88GT

    Grandmaster
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    0   0   0
    Mar 29, 2010
    16,643
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    Familyfriendlyville
    I only carry a gun because it looks cool.....
    Awesomesauce. I carry because I'm an attention whore!

    Let me throw a monkey wrench into the mix...

    Say you intervene and fire on the bad guy... only his buddy, or brother, is outside serving as lookout. BG #2 hears the shots and runs inside only to fire back at you. Now you're in a full blown gun fight.
    Highly unlikely. Douchebags have a high self preservation drive (despite the contradictory behavior of pointing a firearm at the po-po). If the guy outside hears shots, I'd lay money he's scramming.

    I assume this has been discussed but after 4 pages of search results I gave up.

    Just a quick scenario: Let's say you are in a Village Pantry or gas station and a guy comes in holding a gun. He threatens the person at the counter and asks for cash. He is yelling and threatening the cashier. You are only a few feet away but you are behind the guy and can get to your EDC quickly. Do you draw and shoot? Draw and tell him to drop it? Do you step back and stay out of the way assuming most of these situations end with no one getting shot?

    My my gut says option 3 but I would feel awful if the cashier is injured by a gunman I could have taken out.

    Thoughts?
    I could never say for sure. I've been faced with a situation where I could have legally used my firearm. I politely declined based on the totality of the circumstances. But based on my gut reaction to that one, making the decision to shoot would be extremely difficult. I don't know if I could overcome all the other factors that have been operating in my head that say don't shoot. The more obvious and imminent the danger to the clerk, the easier it would be to make that decision though, I would think. However, after the clerk at a local gas station was shot and killed while complying with the rat bastard mother ****er's demands, I can honestly say that the act of pointing a gun and threatening someone with it alone would make it morally acceptable for me to shoot him. I wouldn't want to be willing to take a wait and see approach because by the time it was clear what the sonofa*****'s intentions were, it would be too late. Whether I could/would though......I just don't know.
     

    Paul30

    Expert
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    0   0   0
    Dec 16, 2012
    975
    43
    Wow another "what if thread", so refreshing.
    Discussing possible actions and outcomes beats living with the penalties of a bad decision. I spoke to a guy at a park last week who has a CCW. His idea was since cars were broken into often at the park, he would just fire a couple warning shots in the persons direction if he came back and someone was breaking into any of the cars. I spoke to him for a short time and made him aware of the real costs of pulling the trigger, and that it is not something to do on a whim. He now has a whole new perspective on what could result for using his CCW even if it might be justified.

    In my case there is no way to know until it happens. Your sense of the situation can be altered by many variables that simply can't be articulated here. Tone of voice, guy on the edge of a nervous breakdown giving commands, etc. A guy working at a convenience store last week had 2 guys come in and one pulled a gun on him. The BG followed him to where he was instructed to go and the store employee pulls his own gun and points it at the robber. He told the robber to put his gun down and leave the store. Later police found the gun the robber had was not a real gun. They specified that anyone would have been within their rights to shoot the guy since a normal person would believe their life was in danger, but a civil suite where the skin color of the person shot doesn't match the one doing the shooting can get expensive.
     
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