How do you hold someone at gunpoint?

[pmpmstrb]

Indiana Code 35-41-3

Here it is in black and white

IC 35-41-3-2
Use of force to protect person or property
Sec. 2. (a) A person is justified in using reasonable force against another person to protect the person or a third person from what the person reasonably believes to be the imminent use of unlawful force. However, a person:
(1) is justified in using deadly force; and
(2) does not have a duty to retreat;
if the person reasonably believes that that force is necessary to prevent serious bodily injury to the person or a third person or the commission of a forcible felony. No person in this state shall be placed in legal jeopardy of any kind whatsoever for protecting the person or a third person by reasonable means necessary.
(b) A person:
(1) is justified in using reasonable force, including deadly force, against another person; and
(2) does not have a duty to retreat;
if the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to prevent or terminate the other person's unlawful entry of or attack on the person's dwelling, curtilage, or occupied motor vehicle.
(c) With respect to property other than a dwelling, curtilage, or an occupied motor vehicle, a person is justified in using reasonable force against another person if the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to immediately prevent or terminate the other person's trespass on or criminal interference with property lawfully in the person's possession, lawfully in possession of a member of the person's immediate family, or belonging to a person whose property the person has authority to protect. However, a person:
(1) is justified in using deadly force; and
(2) does not have a duty to retreat;
only if that force is justified under subsection (a).
(d) A person is justified in using reasonable force, including deadly force, against another person and does not have a duty to retreat if the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to prevent or stop the other person from hijacking, attempting to hijack, or otherwise seizing or attempting to seize unlawful control of an aircraft in flight. For purposes of this subsection, an aircraft is considered to be in flight while the aircraft is:
(1) on the ground in Indiana:
(A) after the doors of the aircraft are closed for takeoff; and (B) until the aircraft takes off;
(2) in the airspace above Indiana; or
(3) on the ground in Indiana:
(A) after the aircraft lands; and
(B) before the doors of the aircraft are opened after landing.
(e) Notwithstanding subsections (a), (b), and (c), a person is not justified in using force if:
(1) the person is committing or is escaping after the commission of a crime;
(2) the person provokes unlawful action by another person with intent to cause bodily injury to the other person; or
(3) the person has entered into combat with another person or is the initial aggressor unless the person withdraws from the encounter and communicates to the other person the intent to do so and the other person nevertheless continues or threatens to continue unlawful action.
(f) Notwithstanding subsection (d), a person is not justified in using force if the person:
(1) is committing, or is escaping after the commission of, a crime;
(2) provokes unlawful action by another person, with intent to cause bodily injury to the other person; or
(3) continues to combat another person after the other person withdraws from the encounter and communicates the other person's intent to stop hijacking, attempting to hijack, or otherwise seizing or attempting to seize unlawful control of an aircraft in flight.
As added by Acts 1976, P.L.148, SEC.1. Amended by Acts 1977, P.L.340, SEC.8; Acts 1979, P.L.297, SEC.1; P.L.59-2002, SEC.1; P.L.189-2006, SEC.1.

[SavageEagle]

Originally Posted by pmpmstrb

(f) Notwithstanding subsection (d), a person is not justified in using force if the person:
(1) is committing, or is escaping after the commission of, a crime
[/i]

So basiclly while that BG is Raping, Robbing, Looting, Beating, etc, you can't use force to stop them? That's A BIG LOOPHOLE dontcha think?

[BloodEclipse]

Originally Posted by SavageEagle

So basiclly while that BG is Raping, Robbing, Looting, Beating, etc, you can't use force to stop them? That's A BIG LOOPHOLE dontcha think?

No it means that if a BG is committing a crime or escaping a crime THEY cannot legally use force. For example you couldn't claim self defense if you robbed someone and they pulled a gun on you to stop the robbery and you shot them down.

[SavageEagle]

Originally Posted by BloodEclipse

No it means that if a BG is committing a crime or escaping a crime THEY cannot legally use force. For example you couldn't claim self defense if you robbed someone and they pulled a gun on you to stop the robbery and you shot them down.

LMAO Ok I missread that! That's what I get for pulling an allnighter again! SlEeP?!?! WhAt SlEeP?!?!

[JosephR]

Yes, exactly that. The BAD GUY can't use the usual reasons for using deadly force if he himself is in the middle of committing a crime or fleeing from committing a crime.

[shooter521]

Originally Posted by esrice

Question #2: What is the proper way to hold someone at gunpoint?

The way I was taught to do it was to issue commands in a loud, clear voice (they call it the "command voice" for a reason - not the same as screaming) and use as few words as possible:

1) HANDS UP

2) TURN AROUND (assuming he was facing you to start with)

3) GET ON YOUR KNEES

4) GET ON YOUR BELLY

5) ARMS OUT

6) PALMS UP

7) CROSS YOUR ANKLES

8) DON'T MOVE

Then, you take up a covering position as far away as you can, at his "foot end" and angled away from whichever side his head is turned to. That is, if his head is at 12:00 and he's facing to the left, I'd be positioned at about 4:00.

As I understand, this is very similar to the "felony stop" procedure that a lot of PD's use. I've never had to do it for real (though it worked in the sims class!), but it seems like a pretty solid technique.

HTH!

[Pami]

*boggle*

No offense meant, so please don't take any..
You can remember that much when you're stressed out in a life-or-death situation?

[shooter521]

Originally Posted by Pami

You can remember that much when you're stressed out in a life-or-death situation?

For me at least, it's pretty intuitive, and that helps. I want the BG in a position where he can't see me, and where ANY move he makes is going to require some effort on his part and isn't going to go unnoticed. What is that position gonna look like, and what's the simplest and most direct sequence to get him there?

But really, the trick isn't "remembering that much," it's training to do it enough that you don't have to remember – i.e. that it becomes reflexive. Just like your drawstroke, or moving off the line of attack, or your post-shooting "checklist" (back off, get to cover, threat scan, reload, plan your next move) - you shouldn't be thinking about those things in a confrontation, you should just be DOING them because you've trained to do them a gazillion times. I was able to successfully give those commands under the stress of a force-on-force training environment, and lots and lots of cops are able to do it every day under considerably more stress than that. FWIW.

[Lars]

Heh.... Yelling "Stop" at phase one of my draw is about as much as I think they'll get.

sure beats the alternative.....

"Die Mo#@$#H F#@$#@!!!!"

[RogerB]

Originally Posted by W9ZEB

Heh.... Yelling "Stop" at phase one of my draw is about as much as I think they'll get.

sure beats the alternative.....

"Die Mo#@$#H <A href="mailto:F#@$#@!!!!"[/quote">F#@$#@!!!!"

I think I'd be in the same boat. <damn I need some training>

Are there any low cost training classes available such as the "Discount Karate" classes? <j/k>