Anti-gun thought police

[oldpink]

This is what you get when you have an over-educated boob - Keep guns away from mentally ill people

"The Indianapolis Star’s Sept. 13 story on the death of Alex Myers should be a reminder to all of us that people with depression should not have access to firearms. This incident demonstrates why this needs to be done as soon as it is known someone is depressed."

Gee thanks, Big Brother.

 

[kramer5702]

I was depressed yesterday, had to help my daughter move back home...no one took my gun!

 

[femurphy77]

I resisted the urge to write a letter to the editor on that story but what the hell? Right? This IS INGO after all; I read that story last weekend and after reading I had two controversial thoughts. The first one was; why did they feel it necessary to have I believe it said 24 cops show up with all of them pointing their weapons at a person that was going to commit suicide? That's kind of like suspending a kid in school for not attending classes (an unusual tradition I had never witnessed until moving to Indiana, along with RENTING textbooks, but that's another story).

I mean they get a call of a suicidal mwg, roll onto the scene, remove the only stabilizing factor, his mother, from the equation and then grant his wish by firing 35 times when he raised his gun so he could successfully perform suicide by cop!

My second controversial thought was; Where are the protestors? 24 cops shoot an innocent man, it doesn't make national news, there's no public outcry, no Al Sharpton, no looting, no blocking the interstate, etc. Why?? Why?? You know why. And now you know why I resisted the urge to write a letter to the editor.

Bring it on but I'll probably ignore you because, what's the use?

 

[printcraft]

I was depressed yesterday, had to help my daughter move back home...no one took my gun!

Man that was CLOSE!! I'm glad you are still with us.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

The first one was; why did they feel it necessary to have I believe it said 24 cops show up with all of them pointing their weapons at a person that was going to commit suicide?

Probably because when the first cop showed up, the guy on the porch racked a round into his rifle and told him something along the lines of he better bring enough guys to get the job done because someone was going to die that day.

When he raised the gun he'd announced he was going to shoot at the officers at the end of his count down.

What do you think should have been done instead?

 

[Drail]

Artillery strike......... or an A 10.

 

[Bill of Rights]

I make no equivocation here: I am not a LEO. I don't expect you to know the ins and outs of the medications I might have to give, and likewise, I don't know all about what you do. With that preface, I'd answer your question with one or two of my own: Why not less-lethal? It seems to me that if you disrupt his nervous system or if you knock him down with beanbags, or even obscure his vision with spray, you have the opportunity to drop him without a fatality. Now... I may be way off base here; I don't expect LL of the general public, mostly because we typically do not carry multiple forms of self-defense about our persons, at least not like those. Our LEOs DO carry them, though, and use them. So what am I missing? Why would that not be considered an option?

Blessings,
Bill

Probably because when the first cop showed up, the guy on the porch racked a round into his rifle and told him something along the lines of he better bring enough guys to get the job done because someone was going to die that day.

When he raised the gun he'd announced he was going to shoot at the officers at the end of his count down.

What do you think should have been done instead?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I make no equivocation here: I am not a LEO. I don't expect you to know the ins and outs of the medications I might have to give, and likewise, I don't know all about what you do. With that preface, I'd answer your question with one or two of my own: Why not less-lethal? It seems to me that if you disrupt his nervous system or if you knock him down with beanbags, or even obscure his vision with spray, you have the opportunity to drop him without a fatality. Now... I may be way off base here; I don't expect LL of the general public, mostly because we typically do not carry multiple forms of self-defense about our persons, at least not like those. Our LEOs DO carry them, though, and use them. So what am I missing? Why would that not be considered an option?

Blessings,
Bill

Our officers do not carry bean bag rounds. SWAT does, but SWAT takes time to get there.

I'm holding an M1 that I just racked and announced I'm willing to kill people with. You have a bottle of OC. A bottle of OC that an officer carries on his belt might spray about 8' or so if the wind is just right. I'm sure you see the issues with getting close enough to use spray. A taser reaches 21'. How do you close that distance?

When you use less lethal, you've escalated the situation. If it doesn't work, it may be the trigger that starts the fight. So, when a guy is still talking, do you use less lethal and force the encounter, or do you try to keep him talking knowing the longer they talk the less likely they are to harm themselves or others? When SWAT standoffs with suicidal subjects with guns to their OWN heads, the studies show that when the subject makes the decision to turn the gun on the officers they have about .40 seconds to react before the first shot from the subject. What's your option there?

 

[Leadeye]

Strange really, what's going to be the determining factor to mark a person as "depressed"? When you consider how widely anti depressants are prescribed, how much EAPs at employers are pushed, grief counselors to every school at every crisis. The country is full of people who meet some definition of "depressed".

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Strange really, what's going to be the determining factor to mark a person as "depressed"? When you consider how widely anti depressants are prescribed, how much EAPs at employers are pushed, grief counselors to every school at every crisis. The country is full of people who meet some definition of "depressed".

I would figure it's a sliding scale. Sort of like the "could lose a few pounds to "DAYYYYUMM, WHERE'D THE SUN GO???" spectrum of being overweight.

 

[Bill of Rights]

Our officers do not carry bean bag rounds. SWAT does, but SWAT takes time to get there.

I'm holding an M1 that I just racked and announced I'm willing to kill people with. You have a bottle of OC. A bottle of OC that an officer carries on his belt might spray about 8' or so if the wind is just right. I'm sure you see the issues with getting close enough to use spray. A taser reaches 21'. How do you close that distance?

When you use less lethal, you've escalated the situation. If it doesn't work, it may be the trigger that starts the fight. So, when a guy is still talking, do you use less lethal and force the encounter, or do you try to keep him talking knowing the longer they talk the less likely they are to harm themselves or others? When SWAT standoffs with suicidal subjects with guns to their OWN heads, the studies show that when the subject makes the decision to turn the gun on the officers they have about .40 seconds to react before the first shot from the subject. What's your option there?

And this is the reason I asked the question. Thanks for a dose of perspective.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[Leadeye]

I would figure it's a sliding scale. Sort of like the "could lose a few pounds to "DAYYYYUMM, WHERE'D THE SUN GO???" spectrum of being overweight.

At least there you have some numbers to work with, psychiatry isn't far removed from guesswork. I have to wonder who will make the call to strip people of their firearms after somebody reports them and what the criteria will be.

Personally, I see that as a really tough call. It's more likely that the "depression" angle is being used as a stalking horse for general disarmament, you can't really tell if and how crazy a person is so just remove the firearms and then it's moot in their book.

 

[Dead Duck]

I get terribly depressed every time I see a deal on a gun but I still can't afford it!!!

 

[foszoe]

I get terribly depressed every time I see a deal on a gun but I still can't afford it!!!

Don't do it! DON'T DO IT! Until you publically will the rest to me.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

And this is the reason I asked the question. Thanks for a dose of perspective.

Blessings,
Bill

No worries, that's the spirit I answered in. I'm always open to a "why" question. It's the "I would have done this" from people with no idea what's involved that gets old. Now, if you'll excuse me I see some guys building a bridge and I think they are doing it wrong...

 

[Bill of Rights]

No worries, that's the spirit I answered in. I'm always open to a "why" question. It's the "I would have done this" from people with no idea what's involved that gets old. Now, if you'll excuse me I see some guys building a bridge and I think they are doing it wrong...

Is Chris Christie involved?

 

[Hammertime]

Our officers do not carry bean bag rounds. SWAT does, but SWAT takes time to get there.

I'm holding an M1 that I just racked and announced I'm willing to kill people with. You have a bottle of OC. A bottle of OC that an officer carries on his belt might spray about 8' or so if the wind is just right. I'm sure you see the issues with getting close enough to use spray. A taser reaches 21'. How do you close that distance?

When you use less lethal, you've escalated the situation. If it doesn't work, it may be the trigger that starts the fight. So, when a guy is still talking, do you use less lethal and force the encounter, or do you try to keep him talking knowing the longer they talk the less likely they are to harm themselves or others? When SWAT standoffs with suicidal subjects with guns to their OWN heads, the studies show that when the subject makes the decision to turn the gun on the officers they have about .40 seconds to react before the first shot from the subject. What's your option there?

This has been something I've been curious about. Now, I'm not one to ever say someone should use less-lethal or lethal because I wasnt involved in the situation. I dont know what was going on at that exact situation. That being said, this does provide some good insight as to why someone may use lethal instead of less-lethal.

Thanks for that insight.

 

[Spear Dane]

Depression does not equate to suicidal. If it did people would be offing themselves daily by the tens of thousands.

 

[Bill of Rights]

Depression does not equate to suicidal. If it did people would be offing themselves daily by the tens of thousands.

If you believe Blue Oyster Cult, 40,000 do, every day.

Wonder how many more are only depressed, not suicidal?

 

[1911ly]

I get terribly depressed every time I see a deal on a gun but I still can't afford it!!!

It's obvious you shouldn't be owning any guns!!