Penalty for violating "Oath of Office"

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  • flightsimmer

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    Hi guys and girls;

    I would like to know if there is a penalty for violating the oath of office concerning the "Constitutional Oath of Office" in particular? My guess is that there is not, otherwise there wouldn't be so many politicians doing it. I think I would like to see a very stiff penalty for doing so, say "The death penalty", no no that would never get passed I guess. How about 10 years confinement in a Federal prison or something like that or maybe deportation to the country of choice? I don't know what would be appropreiate or acceptable to the masses but something needs to be done before we loose the "Constitution" altogether. I'm getting sick and tired of politicians getting voted in, taking the "Oath of Office" and then turn right around and violate that very oath. What say ye?

    10mm, when you care enough to send the very best.
     

    CarmelHP

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    Oh goody, I get to recycle my reply to the other thread:

    It never ceases to amaze me that some call themselves "libertarians," and go about with "liberty" on their lips, but these threads reveal the lust for a reign of terror that lurks in their hearts. "Committees of Public Safety" masquerading as "juries" conducting political purges whenever the winds of public opinion change. Draconian punishments being meted without regard for actual malice for doing one's job in good faith, lawful acts that tomorrow a kangaroo court decides is "unconstitutional." Star chambers, arbitrary and ex post facto decisions of law, cruel and unusual punishments administered, all in the supposed "defense of the Constitution." Lord, save us from our self-appointed saviors.
     

    jbombelli

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    Oh goody, I get to recycle my reply to the other thread:

    It never ceases to amaze me that some call themselves "libertarians," and go about with "liberty" on their lips, but these threads reveal the lust for a reign of terror that lurks in their hearts. "Committees of Public Safety" masquerading as "juries" conducting political purges whenever the winds of public opinion change. Draconian punishments being meted without regard for actual malice for doing one's job in good faith, lawful acts that tomorrow a kangaroo court decides is "unconstitutional." Star chambers, arbitrary and ex post facto decisions of law, cruel and unusual punishments administered, all in the supposed "defense of the Constitution." Lord, save us from our self-appointed saviors.

    You know what never ceases to amaze ME? The number of people that come along, with the words "freedom" and "liberty" on their lips, but have no problem letting the government step on those freedoms and liberties with impunity, under the guise of "good faith".
     

    Blackhawk2001

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    The problem we all have is that the Supremes have decided what the Constitution means, in typically lawyerly fashion for all these years. The Judicial Branch has colluded in twisting our legal system and constitutional freedoms completely out of recognition. When I was a temporary technician with the Guard, part of in-processing was taking a class on the Constitution. When I brought up the 2nd Amendment, all the HR guy could say (literally- all he was allowed to say) was that the Supreme Court decides what the Constitution means.

    You guys who are convinced that all cops are jack-booted thugs based on internet stories and news articles are just as wrong in thinking that cops are a symbol of government oppression as others of us in believing that they do a good job. Oppressive cops aren't a symbol of the busted system, they are a symptom of it. They've got their own rules (general orders) that prescribe how they're supposed to conduct business; rules that are dictated by the government appointed leaders that YOU elected.

    Until you educate a majority of the population to believe in individual freedom and responsibility for long enough to elect leaders who will stop the trend toward tyranny, you can expect more of the same. But I guess b*itching about it all the time helps you blow off steam.
     

    CarmelHP

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    You know what never ceases to amaze ME? The number of people that come along, with the words "freedom" and "liberty" on their lips, but have no problem letting the government step on those freedoms and liberties with impunity, under the guise of "good faith".

    So, instead, we'll turn things over to non-government bloodthirsty goons, having "non-government" goons rule makes it feel so much better. Let's see, do I want the 3000 tyrants 1 mile away, or the 1 tyrant 3000 miles away?
     

    dross

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    You know what never ceases to amaze ME? The number of people that come along, with the words "freedom" and "liberty" on their lips, but have no problem letting the government step on those freedoms and liberties with impunity, under the guise of "good faith".

    Who is "letting" them do anything? What are you proposing? Because these fantasy intellectual freshmen dorm beer and pizza conversations aren't doing anything.

    You can work within the system or you can work at destroying it and creating a new system. I don't think the second one is viable at the moment, personally.

    Disclaimer: By "destroying" I'm not advocating anything forbidden by the board rules.
     

    jbombelli

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    So, instead, we'll turn things over to non-government bloodthirsty goons, having "non-government" goons rule makes it feel so much better. Let's see, do I want the 3000 tyrants 1 mile away, or the 1 tyrant 3000 miles away?

    First off I never suggested any sort of non-governmental goon squad solution. Second, distance makes no difference when that one tyrant can pick up a phone and have his agents kicking in your door within hours anywhere in this country.
     

    jbombelli

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    Who is "letting" them do anything? What are you proposing? Because these fantasy intellectual freshmen dorm beer and pizza conversations aren't doing anything.

    You can work within the system or you can work at destroying it and creating a new system. I don't think the second one is viable at the moment, personally.

    Disclaimer: By "destroying" I'm not advocating anything forbidden by the board rules.

    We ARE Letting them do it. The real problem is that the vast majority in this country are more than happy relinquishing their freedoms and liberties in return for some illusion of safety and security. All it takes is for their representatives to tell them it's for the greater good. We can fight them at the ballot box, which is what we've been doing for a long time, and watch things get steadily worse, as has been happening, or we can do those things the board rules prevent us from discussing. But I will agree we're not to that point. Yet
     

    CarmelHP

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    We ARE Letting them do it. The real problem is that the vast majority in this country are more than happy relinquishing their freedoms and liberties in return for some illusion of safety and security. All it takes is for their representatives to tell them it's for the greater good. We can fight them at the ballot box, which is what we've been doing for a long time, and watch things get steadily worse, as has been happening, or we can do those things the board rules prevent us from discussing. But I will agree we're not to that point. Yet

    You can't beat them at the ballot box, but you're going to beat them with bullets? Does this insanity know no bounds? Going out and convincing your fellow Americans is the EASY path, but you want to take the other way? Ridiculous.
     

    dross

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    You can't beat them at the ballot box, but you're going to beat them with bullets? Does this insanity know no bounds? Going out and convincing your fellow Americans is the EASY path, but you want to take the other way? Ridiculous.

    Why is that so hard to see?

    "We can't convince our fellow citizens to vote our way, but we'll be able to convince them to risk life and limb."

    This stuff is fantasy. Settle in, do the hard, boring and long work of getting things done through the system.

    If the day ever comes when a more drastic solution is required we will have endured many dark years that make our problems now seem laughable. I for one hope my family never lives to see such a thing.
     

    jbombelli

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    I've been working within the system for over 25 years. No need to tell me about it. I've done all I can personally do. And I will continue to do so as long as I have a chance at success.

    The Bill of Rights and the Constitution were supposed to protect us from our government. It was never intended that those documents just be considered suggestions, or that our government find creative ways around those protections by disguising what they do as being "for the greater good" or "for the children" so as to not be held accountable by the millions of fools in this country who line up and vote for the same guys over and over.

    Look at Charlie Rangel. Read up on his part in the Hughes Amendment being passed. Read up on all the other shady things he's done that are public knowledge, and then think about how he wins reelection anyway. Now tell me his constituents can be educated and convinced to elect a conservative candidate that will take away their entitlements, eliminate their social programs and give us all our machine guns back.

    That's what we're up against. You cannot educate someone who refuses to listen and simply votes for the guy promising him the most from YOUR pocket, and is scared of his own shadow.

    Do you have any idea how many people are scared of freedom? Try convincing any random group of people that the NFA registry should be opened back up. You know what you'll hear from nearly all of them? "Oh my god you're crazy. Lalalalalala. Nobody should own machine guns! Lalalalalala. You're a terrorist! Lalalalalala." It's freaking pathetic. And after 25 years it gets old, and when all you've managed to do is slow the downfall, you begin to realize you haven't fixed anything at all, you've just dragged out the inevitable. At that point it starts to get very frustrating, and you begin to look forward to "that" day.

    You'll note I did say we're not to the point yet regarding things unmentionable on INGO. I am just convinced there will eventually be the day when we have large-scale rioting, followed by a bloodbath of epic proportion, and the causes will be many.

    But thinking nobody will ever fight and that this is all just fantasy makes me wonder if you even really believe in the reason we have the 2nd Amendment in the first place. It makes me question your loyalty to the very concepts upon which this nation was founded.

    Do you just pay it lipservice? If and when the time comes, will you be willing to stand up and put everything on the line? Don't answer that by evading the question and calling it fantasy, or saying it won't happen. Answer what I asked. Will you stand, or will you cower in your homes, assuming you're lucky enough at that point to still have one?

    By the way, I'm not the one who took the conversation in this particular direction. I'm just responding to assertions made by other certain posters.
     

    dross

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    I've been working within the system for over 25 years. No need to tell me about it. I've done all I can personally do. And I will continue to do so as long as I have a chance at success.

    The Bill of Rights and the Constitution were supposed to protect us from our government. It was never intended that those documents just be considered suggestions, or that our government find creative ways around those protections by disguising what they do as being "for the greater good" or "for the children" so as to not be held accountable by the millions of fools in this country who line up and vote for the same guys over and over.

    Look at Charlie Rangel. Read up on his part in the Hughes Amendment being passed. Read up on all the other shady things he's done that are public knowledge, and then think about how he wins reelection anyway. Now tell me his constituents can be educated and convinced to elect a conservative candidate that will take away their entitlements, eliminate their social programs and give us all our machine guns back.

    That's what we're up against. You cannot educate someone who refuses to listen and simply votes for the guy promising him the most from YOUR pocket, and is scared of his own shadow.

    Do you have any idea how many people are scared of freedom? Try convincing any random group of people that the NFA registry should be opened back up. You know what you'll hear from nearly all of them? "Oh my god you're crazy. Lalalalalala. Nobody should own machine guns! Lalalalalala. You're a terrorist! Lalalalalala." It's freaking pathetic. And after 25 years it gets old, and when all you've managed to do is slow the downfall, you begin to realize you haven't fixed anything at all, you've just dragged out the inevitable. At that point it starts to get very frustrating, and you begin to look forward to "that" day.

    You'll note I did say we're not to the point yet regarding things unmentionable on INGO. I am just convinced there will eventually be the day when we have large-scale rioting, followed by a bloodbath of epic proportion, and the causes will be many.

    But thinking nobody will ever fight and that this is all just fantasy makes me wonder if you even really believe in the reason we have the 2nd Amendment in the first place. It makes me question your loyalty to the very concepts upon which this nation was founded.

    Do you just pay it lipservice? If and when the time comes, will you be willing to stand up and put everything on the line? Don't answer that by evading the question and calling it fantasy, or saying it won't happen. Answer what I asked. Will you stand, or will you cower in your homes, assuming you're lucky enough at that point to still have one?

    By the way, I'm not the one who took the conversation in this particular direction. I'm just responding to assertions made by other certain posters.

    If you can't convince someone to vote for freedom, how will you convince them to fight for it? It's a simple question. Please answer it.
     

    dross

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    Well the answer to that is quite simple, if abhorrent. Just ask the Vietnamese how they did it. Or the Nicaraguans.

    Well, exactly.

    Just to be clear, I don't think anyone is advocating anything forbidden here. My point is that while I recognize that it is possible someday that our society may degenerate to the point of confilct - as many societies have in the past - that day is a very long way off. Many people on this site are fed up with the way the system works and what it has produced. The main reason for their dissatisfaction, however, boils down to the inability to persuade their fellow citizens. If the system hasn't degenerated to the point where people are voting for freedom - and they are not - then it certainly hasn't gotten to the point where conflict is going to break out.

    Freedom is operating in our country right now. We have the power to vote out people we don't like. Libertarians run for almost every office in the country. If our fellow citizens agreed with us, we could have small government, pro freedom people in every office. The problem isn't the politicians, it's our fellow citizens. Unless we're going to take the vote from those who don't agree by force, we are left with the job of convincing them - which we haven't been able to do.

    Yes, I agree we face tyranny in some of the actions of our leaders. Yet, many of our fellow citizens are satisfied, even pleased with this form of tyranny. That is our problem, and it can only be fixed by working within the system.

    Last I checked, we still have freedom of speech, this forum being just one example. Persuasion of our fellow citizens is the appropriate action right now. It must get must worse before the other becomes an option. Let's avoid that if we can.
     

    jbombelli

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    If you can't convince someone to vote for freedom, how will you convince them to fight for it? It's a simple question. Please answer it.

    I see you evaded the question in favor of asking your own, in an attempt to be clever.

    I'll answer yours, since you evidently are incapable of answering mine.

    Simple. When it's truly the right time, the people that have the balls to stand up, and who believe in the ideals upon which this country was founded, won't need to be convinced. They'll be sufficiently tired and angry at being stepped on. That's one of the ways we'll know when it's time, and how we know that time is not now.

    Now answer MY question, if you're capable.

    But again, please note, I specifially stated prior to this that I do not advocate non-governmental goon squad solutions to this problem. You and others extrapolated this conversation out to an extreme position that nobody advocated that I can recall. I can't help but wonder why.
     

    dross

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    I see you evaded the question in favor of asking your own, in an attempt to be clever.

    I'll answer yours, since you evidently are incapable of answering mine.

    Simple. When it's truly the right time, the people that have the balls to stand up, and who believe in the ideals upon which this country was founded, won't need to be convinced. They'll be sufficiently tired and angry at being stepped on. That's one of the ways we'll know when it's time, and how we know that time is not now.

    Now answer MY question, if you're capable.

    But again, please note, I specifially stated prior to this that I do not advocate non-governmental goon squad solutions to this problem. You and others extrapolated this conversation out to an extreme position that nobody advocated that I can recall. I can't help but wonder why.

    I thought your questions were rhetorical. I also kindly ignored you getting personal when it was uncalled for.

    So I'm capable AND clever, though I don't think you appreciate the true worth of my cleverness, since you picked an example where I wasn't being clever at all.

    In answer to your questions, yes, should the time come I am ready to stand up and do my part. I just don't see that time coming in my lifetime. Things would have to get much worse than they are now before I thought the time had come.

    When they try to take my means to defend myself, and they try to take my means to convince my fellow citizens through my free speech, I will consider the time to have come. Right now they're nibbling at those things, but are to this point ineffective.
     

    jbombelli

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    I thought your questions were rhetorical. I also kindly ignored you getting personal when it was uncalled for.

    So I'm capable AND clever, though I don't think you appreciate the true worth of my cleverness, since you picked an example where I wasn't being clever at all.

    In answer to your questions, yes, should the time come I am ready to stand up and do my part. I just don't see that time coming in my lifetime. Things would have to get much worse than they are now before I thought the time had come.

    When they try to take my means to defend myself, and they try to take my means to convince my fellow citizens through my free speech, I will consider the time to have come. Right now they're nibbling at those things, but are to this point ineffective.

    What's funny, is we're arguing, and unless I'm either misunderstanding you or I'm not communicating very clearly, we're both in agreement, more or less. I agree we're nowhere near that point. I agree that things would have to get much worse. I'm not necessarily convinced it won't happen in *my* lifetime, but it very well might. It may very well happen in my kids' lifetimes. But it will happen eventually, because we as a nation have gone into horrendous debt to fund our lifestyle. It's going to have to come to an end eventually. So I don't call it a fantasy.

    I apologize if I got personal; I just felt condescended by the tone of your writing, and your choice of words.
     
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