Show ID?

[bigg cheese]

Originally Posted by Beau

I'm really going to try and find more info on this. I'm from CO originally and there you do not have to provide ID. If you are not commiting a crime you can simply walk away from LE. This is the way it should be.

Having to present ID when doing nothing wrong is the same as KGB=Papers Please.

I'm not sure this makes sense. How do you know if you've committed a crime? Police pull people over all the time and are often not told what the offense is until the officer has verified ID and proof of insurance.

[Beau]

Originally Posted by bigg cheese

I'm not sure this makes sense. How do you know if you've committed a crime? Police pull people over all the time and are often not told what the offense is until the officer has verified ID and proof of insurance.

But there was an offense...When was the last time you were stopped just because LE felt the need to pull you over without a reason.

[Timjoebillybob]

If your stopped for a infraction you do have to identify yourself, name, address, dob or DL if in your possession.

IC 34-28-5-3.5
Refusal to identify self
Sec. 3.5. A person who knowingly or intentionally refuses to provide either the person's:
(1) name, address, and date of birth; or
(2) driver's license, if in the person's possession;
to a law enforcement officer who has stopped the person for an infraction or ordinance violation commits a Class C misdemeanor.

Which if your not breaking any laws/ordinances shouldn't apply if your just walking down the street. (IANAL)

[bigg cheese]

You have to admit, there are many offenses that you may commit without knowing, or a LEO who makes a bad call.

I know people who have been pulled over for speeding or not stopping at a stop sign, respectully disagreed with the officer, and did not get a ticket.

Officers can make mistakes too.

Also, don't forget that there are random breathalizer tests or checkpoints on some of the most alcohol-laden days of the year, just to make sure we're all being safe. not because they know you are drunk. They think you might be, or you're just in the wrong place at the wrong time.

[Timjoebillybob]

Originally Posted by Beau

But there was an offense...When was the last time you were stopped just because LE felt the need to pull you over without a reason.

Its not in IN but there is a state can't remember which one where the police are allowed to pull you over for good driving. To hand out "good driving certificates" And while they have you pulled over to check for dl and registration and such. They started doing it after sobriety check points were found to be unconstitutional. And I have been stopped walking down the street for no reason, other than the leo was wondering what a early 20s male with long hair was doing out at midnight or so.

[Beau]

Originally Posted by Timjoebillybob

If your stopped for a infraction you do have to identify yourself, name, address, dob or DL if in your possession.

IC 34-28-5-3.5
Refusal to identify self
Sec. 3.5. A person who knowingly or intentionally refuses to provide either the person's:
(1) name, address, and date of birth; or
(2) driver's license, if in the person's possession;
to a law enforcement officer who has stopped the person for an infraction or ordinance violation commits a Class C misdemeanor.

Which if your not breaking any laws/ordinances shouldn't apply if your just walking down the street. (IANAL)

Thank You. This was the answer I wanted. It only took four pages to get it. I will research this section of code further.
Going off of this snip alone a person does not have to present ID to LE unless an infraction has been committed.

Scenario:
Your seen carrying by LE, be it CC or OC they notice either way.

LE: I need to see your ID/LTCH.

You: Do you have reason to believe that I am or about to commit a crime?

LE: Just show me your ID or you'll go to jail.

You: Unless you have reason to believe I have committed an infraction or ordinance violation you do not have the right to demand my ID.

This could go on. And could have many different outcomes.

Peaceably carrying a firearm is not grounds to suspect a crime.

[ATF Consumer]

I just saw an episode of COPS the other day where two LEO's were on patrol through a neighborhood. The driver had indicated that he likes to be proactive on fighting crime, keeping an eye out, looking for trouble, rather than wait for it to call him.
As they were driving down one city block, there were 3 individuals on the sidewalk, one of them carrying a rifle.
Of course both LEO's exit their car with weapons drawn, approach the three citizens and proceeded to secure the sidewalk, check the rifle..........BB gun???????

They told the three citizens that they shouldn't have a BB gun out in public, as someone could mistake it for a real rifle and cause unwanted trouble.
I thought, yeah, like have LEO's totally violate you while obeying the law.

[Denny347]

Originally Posted by Beau

I am confused on IN law on if a person must present ID to LE if approached and asked.

Scenario:
Police respond to MWG call. Find person walking through store carrying. (OC of course). Does person have to show ID and LTCH?

If someone could point me in the right direction to find this info I would appreciate it.

The post has gone off in two directions, one question was the original post and the second is the scenario about police just randomly asking for ID. USSC has answered the question about random stops and us asking for ID so I will not everyone with the details. However, if I get called to a business where the caller stated that there was a person with a gun, it is a bit different. This only applies to my dept and Indianapolis in general. We normally ask what the person is doing with said firearm. If there is a disturbance and the person has a gun, but never came into play, we give that more attention obviously. If the person is just shopping and the caller noticed that the shopper was OCing, well treat that differently (usually). I speak in generalities because each incident can be different and require a different response. However, if I am there for a disturbance and see you OC...I WILL ask for LTCH and ID. You fail to provide me with LTCH, it is jewelry time. If the person is doing nothing other than OCing, we may just talk to the caller (if it is not annon) and let them know IN carry laws. I've been known to check for a LTCH from a person who was doing nothing else by simply asking "You have a permit for that correct?" and when they reply "Yes" I move on. Lasts 5 seconds. It is really a non-issue. I cannot remeber EVER getting a call of someone OC and they called us just for that reason alone. There is usually a disturbance involved with it, big difference. Now on the same note, there is no permit required to carry a rifle in Indiana but bet your butt that you will get stopped and questioned if you are walking through city streets carrying a rifle/shotgun. Of course I do work the one of the crappiest areas of the city.

[Denny347]

Originally Posted by ATF Consumer

I just saw an episode of COPS the other day where two LEO's were on patrol through a neighborhood. The driver had indicated that he likes to be proactive on fighting crime, keeping an eye out, looking for trouble, rather than wait for it to call him.
As they were driving down one city block, there were 3 individuals on the sidewalk, one of them carrying a rifle.
Of course both LEO's exit their car with weapons drawn, approach the three citizens and proceeded to secure the sidewalk, check the rifle..........BB gun???????

They told the three citizens that they shouldn't have a BB gun out in public, as someone could mistake it for a real rifle and cause unwanted trouble.
I thought, yeah, like have LEO's totally violate you while obeying the law.

Was it in Indiana? If not, it could be quite illegal for someone to carry ANY firearm in their jurisdiction. If that is the case I clearly understand. If that was here in my craphole, yup they most likely getting stopped as well. The manner of carry could be the deciding factor of stopping them. Is in in a case? Are they holding it at the low ready but still not pointing it? Are they carrying it in a manner that points it at passing traffic? It is VERY situational but worth investigating.

[ATF Consumer]

Originally Posted by Denny347

Was it in Indiana? If not, it could be quite illegal for someone to carry ANY firearm in their jurisdiction. If that is the case I clearly understand. If that was here in my craphole, yup they getting stopped as well. They manner of carry could be the deciding factor of stopping them. Is in in a case? Are they holding it at the low ready but still not pointing it? Are they carrying it in a manner that points it at passing traffic? It is VERY situational but worth investigating.

Not sure, as some episodes jump around to various locations...I totally understand the situation with rifles...I would be drawing my weapon on those individuals as well...

It must have been a bit on the embarrassing side to find it was only a BB gun.

I love to watch COPS...it is the only true reality TV.