Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 16
  1. #1
    Marksman Rocket57's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    In denial
    Posts
    524

    Bad day at the range

    Today I had my new Rock Island GI compact at the range for the second time. First time out it had 1 fte out of 50 rounds of Federal ball, leaving the brass halfway in the chamber. Today I had 5 fte out of 70 rounds with Win WB and PMC ball, all being the last round in both the RIA suplied ACT mag and a brand new Wilson Combat mag. All rounds were jammed into the top of the mag with the slide locked back normally.



    As you can see, the brass is jammed into the top of the mag and the front end is damaged from either the barrel or the slide. (sorry for poor cell phone pic)
    The brass was even dinged up in some that ejected normally.





    I noticed when I first stripped and cleaned the pistol that the extractor is rotated a bit from where it probably should be.





    This is where the extractor ends up after the firing pin retainer is installed even if I straighten the extractor first. I also noticed brass marks in front of the ejection port on the slide. Brass was ejecting in every direction, some landing 6 feet away at 1:00!



    To me this looks like an extractor problem except for the fact that it was always the last round in the mag. I also can't figure out how it damages the front end of the case and still locks back the slide normally and why it would jam the empty brass back into the top of the mag. It even bent the top of the new Wilson mag.

    Any thoughts? I really wanted this to be my EDC after I get a few hundred rounds through it. My full size Rock Island has been faultless in 1000 rounds and I know compacts can be finicky but?!

    Update: 9-18
    I checked the extractor tension, seems OK. Definitely not too loose. Removed the extractor and checked for missalignment between the retainer slot and the end of the extractor. Again everything looks good. Then removed the retainer and extractor from my full size to do some comparison. While all the parts appear identical the full size extractor was too tight to fit in the compact. In the end I managed to re install the extractor and get it clocked correctly. The Retainer and extractor are VERY tight so the extractor rotating during use is probably not happening.
    I will try to get some range time in this weekend and see what happens.
    Last edited by Rocket57; 09-18-2012 at 17:55.
    Stop the world, I want to get off.

  2. #2
    Expert PGRChaplain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Waynedale (FT Wayne)
    Posts
    1,738
    The slide is locked open after the last round, so it's going all the way back. Looks like the rounds are bouncing around in the slide during ejection thus the brass marks on the slide. To me it seems the ejector is not holding the case till it throws it out the slide. The marks on the front of the cases looks like they are "Riding piggyback' on top of the next round going in the chamber. When it hits the barrel, it flips over and the primer end leaves the Brass marks on top of the slide. Call R/I or email them your pics for their input.

  3. #3
    Sharpshooter Fixer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Fort Wayne Area
    Posts
    773
    I had similar FTE problems with a Para 3" 1911. I took the ejector out of the gun and cleaned it and the passage and put it back together. It ran fine after that. Might also need the ejector tuned to hold the cases a little tighter.
    We live in a society where pizza gets to your house before the police.

  4. #4
    Grandmaster churchmouse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Speedway area
    Posts
    34,352
    Great pics to go with the issue. You have to remember that is an entry level gun and I have seen some issues with these. A good friend sells a lot of these and more than a few will burp or fart on occasion. The extractor is definitely an issue and I would start there. It should not be able to rotate in this fashion.

  5. #5
    CCF
    CCF is offline
    Plinker
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    96
    As said, it is an extractor issue. At the very least it will need a new firing pin stop fitted and the extractor tuned. As churchmouse said, the extractor should not turn in the tunnel when the firing pin stop is installed.

    Since the extractor is not tensioned properly (and or is rotating) it is allowing the last empty case to drop down into the mag and forcing it into the mag lips. The rounds sitting in the mag previous prevents those rounds from dropping and is why it is only happening on the last round.

    Hope this helps.....

  6. #6
    Master jgreiner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Linden, VA
    Posts
    4,872
    When i had last round issues....that then turned into mag release issues...turned out i had a worn Mag Release button on my MP. New button installed and hte gun was as good as new.
    “We must hang together, gentlemen…else, we shall most assuredly hang separately.” – Benjamin Franklin

  7. #7
    Teufelshund TopDog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    5,605
    This is a great thread. Good pics to go along with the problem and then excellent explanations of what is happening. INGO has some really experienced people willing to help out others.

    I have a lot of experience with full size 1911's, never owned or even shot a 1911 in any other platform than full size. I do know that some 1911's usually higher end models can be a bit finicky with regards to ammo and magazines.

    So that is my experience (limited to full size 1911's) here is my question:

    Are not the compact 1911's more prone to malfunctions that the full sized guns?
    INGO has an excellent resource for safety recalls. Check it out: http://ingunowners.com/forums/genera...l-listing.html


  8. #8
    CCF
    CCF is offline
    Plinker
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    96
    Quote Originally Posted by TopDog View Post
    Are not the compact 1911's more prone to malfunctions that the full sized guns?

    Shorter guns have a shorter stroke and therefore have to do everything in a shorter period of time (in most cases with a very fat round). Basically, as the gun gets shorter, the need for proper specs/numbers/fit increases. Factories only do this so well unfortunately. Also, the potential for the slide to outrun the magazine spring is increased. Compound that with the heavier springs that come stock is shorter guns and you have potential for even bigger problems. Heavier springs actually speed up the cycle time and with some shooters, the extra weight of the spring causes limp wristing/short strokes etc....

    Fact is, a heavier recoil spring does not help the slide slow much at all, and the opposite is true. If you want to give the gun more time you need to go lighter.

    Here is a video that (while talking about muzzle control for faster follow up shots) shows via high-speed video what lighter recoil springs actually do. They slow down the cycle time considerably. Going lighter will actually help many problems of shorter guns.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3UVLm2GajI

  9. #9
    Grandmaster SERparacord's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Amish Mafia Bar
    Posts
    5,510
    Quote Originally Posted by churchmouse View Post
    Great pics to go with the issue. You have to remember that is an entry level gun and I have seen some issues with these. A good friend sells a lot of these and more than a few will burp or fart on occasion. The extractor is definitely an issue and I would start there. It should not be able to rotate in this fashion.
    +1 the firing pin stop should keep an extractor from clocking.

  10. #10
    Plinker
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    hamilton county
    Posts
    123
    Quote Originally Posted by CCF View Post
    As said, it is an extractor issue. At the very least it will need a new firing pin stop fitted and the extractor tuned. As churchmouse said, the extractor should not turn in the tunnel when the firing pin stop is installed.

    Since the extractor is not tensioned properly (and or is rotating) it is allowing the last empty case to drop down into the mag and forcing it into the mag lips. The rounds sitting in the mag previous prevents those rounds from dropping and is why it is only happening on the last round.

    Hope this helps.....
    my thoughts as well.

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •