Springfield Range Officer - Hollow points?

[The Ninja]

Decided to go an try out some of my fancy new carry ammo today to make sure it works in my Springfield Range Officer, so that I would feel comfortable enough with it to make the switch over from ball to something a bit more effective.

At the range today I started out with some of my practice, 50 rounds WWB. No issues whatsoever. Then, before I got it any dirtier, I decided to go ahead and do my first test run for carry ammo, 50 rounds of Winchester Ranger-T. That's where things started to get interesting. I had 3 FTEs, each in a different magazine, and each was the last round in that magazine. One in particular gave me pause, because it really wedged itself in there trying to stovepipe, rendering the weapon completely inoperable! I had to run the slide about 20 times before I managed to force it back down into the chamber, where I could eject it (it simply wasn't coming out any other way).

Normally, I'd just chalk that up to WWB being really dirty, but I then ran another 78 rounds of WWB with 0 issues whatsoever. Granted, the gun was filthy by the time I was done. (The stainless barrel bushing was the same color as the parkerized slide!)

So, does anyone else have a Range Officer that's not partial to hollowpoints, or is this more likely to be an issue somewhere else? (e.g. magazines, grip, specific ammo, etc.)

 

[foxmustang]

Mine ran 230 gr Ranger T-Series just fine. It also fed the buffalo bore/barnes 185 gr XPB as well. I've fired thousands of 200 gr SWC that have been flawless, except for a handful of FTF that I've chalked up to bad Chip McCormick 10 Rd magazines. The factory mags and Chip McCormick have always proven reliable for me. Are you using factory magazines? Did you try loading all the magazines to one less than capacity?

 

[The Ninja]

Mine ran 230 gr Ranger T-Series just fine. It also fed the buffalo bore/barnes 185 gr XPB as well. I've fired thousands of 200 gr SWC that have been flawless, except for a handful of FTF that I've chalked up to bad Chip McCormick 10 Rd magazines. The factory mags and Chip McCormick have always proven reliable for me. Are you using factory magazines? Did you try loading all the magazines to one less than capacity?

230 gr Ranger-Ts was the exact ammo I was using. All of my 6 magazines are factory springfield 7-rounds magazines, 4 of which were brand new before today. All were loaded to 7 rounds and then had one chambered (as though 6+1).

Thought: Is it possible for magazines to have a break in period?

 

[foxmustang]

My factory springfield magazines were good from day 1. I'd see of you could find someone to loan you some different mags to see if the problem persists. My 10 round CMC mag I have to load with 8 to get it to function properly, but the other ones function just fine and they were purchased new at the same time.

 

[churchmouse]

I run a lot of different self-defense rounds in all of my springers. Most will cycle OK. The Speer gold dots (Huge hole) will sometimes give issues chambering but I am not so sure that is not me sissy gripping at the end of a 400 rd. range session.
I have never ran the rounds you mention.
It is strange that it would be the last round out of the mag.
Have you tried some Hornaday TAP or something similar.

 

[NyleRN]

Not sure where to start. Not trying to sound negative at all here so please don't take it that way. Do you have another gun that you'd consider as an EDC? The range officer is a top notch production 1911, but a 1911 is not an average gun guy's gun. It's a gunsmiths gun. Plus the factory rear sight is not carry friendly as it will probably snag on everything coming out of a draw. I hope it's as simple as a magazine problem but if you've tried several different ones then it may be something else. Possibly ammo sensitive, who knows. Other platforms tend to be not as finicky with mags and ammo. I love my 1911's, but will never carry one because of that. Just my opinion. Good luck figuring it out and congrats on the gun.

 

[The Ninja]

I'll have to run some more ranger-ts through it and see if it recurs, and if so if it seems to be localized to a couple of magazines. I wasn't keeping track today, but I only had 8 rounds left over after 1 run through each magazine, so it has to be at least 2 different magazines that had issues today.

It is strange that it would be the last round out of the mag.
Have you tried some Hornaday TAP or something similar.

These were the first hollow points I've put through it thus far. I'm perfectly willing to look at other ammo, but funds for experimenting with defense ammo are a bit tight at the moment.

Not sure where to start. Not trying to sound negative at all here so please don't take it that way. Do you have another gun that you'd consider as an EDC? The range officer is a top notch production 1911, but a 1911 is not an average gun guy's gun. It's a gunsmiths gun. Plus the factory rear sight is not carry friendly as it will probably snag on everything coming out of a draw. I hope it's as simple as a magazine problem but if you've tried several different ones then it may be something else. Possibly ammo sensitive, who knows. Other platforms tend to be not as finicky with mags and ammo. I love my 1911's, but will never carry one because of that. Just my opinion. Good luck figuring it out and congrats on the gun.

Semi-broke college student, so no other handguns yet. 1911 was my first go-to choice because it fits my hand well, I shoot it fairly well, and I like the safety setup for a carry gun. I've already got the rear sight switched out for a Harrison fixed sight, which seems to work pretty well. All I've worked with thus far are springfield magazines, so that could be it potentially.

 

[churchmouse]

I'll have to run some more ranger-ts through it and see if it recurs, and if so if it seems to be localized to a couple of magazines. I wasn't keeping track today, but I only had 8 rounds left over after 1 run through each magazine, so it has to be at least 2 different magazines that had issues today.

Next run mark the trouble mags but FTE (failure to eject) should not be mag related.
Short slide stroke, extractor to tight, possibly limp wristing. I say possibly not pointing at you.

 

[The Ninja]

possibly limp wristing. I say possibly not pointing at you.

That actually could be it. I did notice that the Ranger-Ts were hitting significantly low and left until I tightened my grip a bit, at which point the rounds shifted to about point of aim, which is where the WWB was hitting. It could be a combination of not the best grip with the increase recoil of the Ranger-Ts, perhaps?

Next time I go out I'll try focusing on my grip and mark any magazines that have issues. If there's still FTEs and no pattern with the magazines, I'll have my gunsmith take a look at the extractor.

 

[churchmouse]

That actually could be it. I did notice that the Ranger-Ts were hitting significantly low and left until I tightened my grip a bit, at which point the rounds shifted to about point of aim, which is where the WWB was hitting. It could be a combination of not the best grip with the increase recoil of the Ranger-Ts, perhaps?

Next time I go out I'll try focusing on my grip and mark any magazines that have issues. If there's still FTEs and no pattern with the magazines, I'll have my gunsmith take a look at the extractor.

Yes it could be.
The case on the one pictured appears to have been caught on the barrel hood. That indicates a short stroke or the extractor held onto it.

Very hard to diagnose on the interwebs.

Where do you usually shoot.

 

[The Ninja]

Yes it could be.
The case on the one pictured appears to have been caught on the barrel hood. That indicates a short stroke or the extractor held onto it.

Very hard to diagnose on the interwebs.

Where do you usually shoot.

Yeah, it was wedged at about a 60 degree angle with the top bend into the inside of the barrel hood and the rim still caught under the magazine lips. Took quite a doing to get it loose.

I've been shooting at Pop's recently. I know, I know, but I've got some free range time tokens left and I've had good luck with the staff so far. Once BGF's range reopens, I'll probably end up going there (where I got my RO in the first place).

 

[Tombs]

My personal guess is that you aren't controlling the firearm well enough. Either that, or your ejector is too short for how the gun cycles. The former is the most likely, unless this is "reduced recoil" winchester ranger, which I have bought before and had issues with.

 

[churchmouse]

My personal guess is that you aren't controlling the firearm well enough. Either that, or your ejector is too short for how the gun cycles. The former is the most likely, unless this is "reduced recoil" winchester ranger, which I have bought before and had issues with.

I was wondering about the load out on those rounds.

OP, get after the gun. Run it like you hate it meaning grip up.

 

[The Ninja]

I was wondering about the load out on those rounds.

OP, get after the gun. Run it like you hate it meaning grip up.

Will do. The rounds were 230 gr ranger-ts at standard pressure. I didn't know winchester made a low recoil version (unless you mean relative to the +p rangers, which is the only other variety I've seen).

 

[halfmileharry]

Yes it could be.
The case on the one pictured appears to have been caught on the barrel hood. That indicates a short stroke or the extractor held onto it.

Very hard to diagnose on the interwebs.

Where do you usually shoot.

I'd like to see a few pics of the rim of the cases if not destroyed.
My RO had issues with the original mags and HPs. NO problems with HPs with Ed Brown, Wilson, or CMC mags. That was pretty much new with less than 300 roulds. It's got 5 times that now. I don't run factory mags but I do keep them loaded in case the N.Koreans try to over run Indiana.

 

[The Ninja]

I'd like to see a few pics of the rim of the cases if not destroyed.
My RO had issues with the original mags and HPs. NO problems with HPs with Ed Brown, Wilson, or CMC mags. That was pretty much new with less than 300 roulds. It's got 5 times that now. I don't run factory mags but I do keep them loaded in case the N.Koreans try to over run Indiana.

I'll take another picture focused on the rim of the case that I have and post it when I get back from work today. There's a couple of pretty deep gouges in the rim, one cutting all the way through the nickel plating and exposing the brass. One of those is visible in the picture I posted at the bottom right. That said, those possibly resulted from my manipulation of the slide to get the casing out. I collected probably the majority of my brass, so I can look through the ranger casings and see if I can identify the other 2 culprits.

 

[halfmileharry]

I meant to ask....How many rounds through the gun? I've also had trouble with plated ammo before. I just gave 150 cleaned cases up to a member here because I don't reload those cases anymore. Before I catch the dickens for it...."It's MY boogieman"

 

[The Ninja]

I meant to ask....How many rounds through the gun? I've also had trouble with plated ammo before. I just gave 150 cleaned cases up to a member here because I don't reload those cases anymore. Before I catch the dickens for it...."It's MY boogieman"

277 rounds total at this point. 50 rangers, the rest 230 gr WWB. Roughly 150 rounds total before I ran the rangers, though. No FTE in that time, and only one FTF caused by me not fully seating the magazine.

 

[halfmileharry]

I'll take another picture focused on the rim of the case that I have and post it when I get back from work today. There's a couple of pretty deep gouges in the rim, one cutting all the way through the nickel plating and exposing the brass. One of those is visible in the picture I posted at the bottom right. That said, those possibly resulted from my manipulation of the slide to get the casing out. I collected probably the majority of my brass, so I can look through the ranger casings and see if I can identify the other 2 culprits.

I noticed the case gouge in that pic. It's why I wanted to see pics from different angles. That pic may hold the key.
Also, IF you've cleaned the gun did you get recoil spring in the right direction? New springs can be tight and not let a gun fully eject properly. Not saying anything yet but would like to see the pics
I run FMJ almost exclusively in all my 1911s. It's only because of the finicky HPs. Most will run perfect but every now and then one will rear it's ugly head and jam up usually on the feed side. Your gun may just need ran a bit more. Every gun is different. I've got a Wilson Recoil spring you can have to try it. 18lb with over 4K rounds. It functions fine still but I did an overhaul on one of mine recently. That would eliminate the recoil spring question. I'm on the Southside of Indy ALMOST every day if that helps.

 

[The Ninja]

I noticed the case gouge in that pic. It's why I wanted to see pics from different angles. That pic may hold the key.
Also, IF you've cleaned the gun did you get recoil spring in the right direction? New springs can be tight and not let a gun fully eject properly. Not saying anything yet but would like to see the pics
I run FMJ almost exclusively in all my 1911s. It's only because of the finicky HPs. Most will run perfect but every now and then one will rear it's ugly head and jam up usually on the feed side. Your gun may just need ran a bit more. Every gun is different. I've got a Wilson Recoil spring you can have to try it. 18lb with over 4K rounds. It functions fine still but I did an overhaul on one of mine recently. That would eliminate the recoil spring question. I'm on the Southside of Indy ALMOST every day if that helps.

I'll try and get a couple of good pics from various angles tonight and get them posted up.

I have cleaned it a couple times. (Once after my first range trip and after this last one). I'll be entirely honest, it didn't even cross my mind that the spring was directional. I'll check and make sure it's in correctly once I get home, but even if it is now, it certainly could have been in backwards yesterday.

I currently live/work in downtown Indy, so if grip, magazines, and spring direction don't pan out I just might take you up on that. I'm really suspecting my grip, though, at this point.