New PPS

[luvall]

Anyone have any experinece with the new Walther PPS?

 

[Bigum1969]

I considered it before picking up my Kahr PM9. The Kahr and the PPS are the same width, but the Kahr is smaller overall.

I believe there is a review of four pocket 9mms in this month's issue of Shooting Times.

 

[Scutter01]

I don't care for the grip. It feels very square and not ergonomic, which is odd because the grips on the P22 and the P99 are awesome. I have not fired one, though.

 

[Ri22o]

I have played with them a couple times at various shops around town. They don't seem to be too bad. I would consider one if I was in the market for something like that.

 

[pmpmstrb]

I was in the market for a smaller 9mm a couple weeks ago. I was looking at the PPS, but for the price I would rather have a G26. I ended up with the PF9 fwiw. There are some review vids of the PPS on youtube.

 

[shooter521]

A friend of mine had a PPS for a little while, and I got to shoot it alongside my Kahr P9 a few months ago. Here are my observations as posted to another forum:

INITIAL IMPRESSIONS:
First thought that popped into my head: this is a GLOCK 26 that's been to Jenny Craig.

• Internally, the gun is VERY Glock-like, having a telescoping dual-captive spring recoil assembly identical to a G26/27, a similar cruciform trigger bar and connector arrangement, and a similar firing pin safety in the slide.

• The gun is actually a little bigger than you'd think just from reading the specs on paper; it definitely doesn't fall into the "pocket gun" category, IMO - at least not any more than a baby GLOCK does. Single-stack frame feels similar in the hand to the KT PF9, but is shorter. Gun comes with a flat-base mag and an extended-base mag; the latter allowed me to barely get 3 fingers on the grip.

• Mag release *SUCKS*. The compactness of the gun required some serious gyrations to manipulate the release lever(s) with the thumb or trigger finger of my shooting hand. Might get easier with practice, but will never be as fast as a regular button. Sure is a secure design, though; can't see it ever getting accidentally activated. The other problem I had was that because of the short frame and the fact that the mag baseplate is essentially as wide as the grip, the mags kept hitting the palm of my hand on the way out and stopping after coming out about 1/4". This would require me to reach in with the support hand and rip the mag out, greatly (and needlessly, since the mags would otherwise easily fall free) slowing the reloading cycle.

• Tolerances are TIGHT. When reassembling the gun, I didn't start the barrel into the slide "just so" and locked it up at about a 45-degree angle. Took a sharp rap to the front of the barrel to jar it loose from the slide, and a couple more tries to get the insertion angle right (I hate when that happens). Again, probably something that would get easier with practice, but a departure from other guns I own (even the Kahrs, which are regarded as having pretty tight tolerances themselves).

• "Street" price is around $599.

RANGE REPORT:
Got some range time with XXX this evening, and got to shoot his new PPS alongside my Kahr P9 for comparison.

SIGHTS
The PPS' high-profile sights with big bright white dots are easier to pick up quickly than the P9's Trijicon night sights, but they give no low-light capability.
Advantage - NONE

CONTROLLABILITY
PPS exhibits a lot less muzzle jump than I thought it would, and is easier to shoot in this regard than the P9.
Advantage - PPS

TRIGGER
PPS trigger pull is vaguely Glock-like, but much stiffer/heavier throughout its travel. Breakpoint and reset are both indistinct, making trigger management difficult. Kahr P9 has the Elite 98-style trigger, which provides a smooth and consistent DAO pull.
Advantage - P9

ACCURACY
The PPS is probably as mechanically accurate as the P9, but the Walther's trigger makes it much harder to realize the gun's full accuracy potential. I couldn't produce "one ragged hole" groups at 7 yards with the PPS like I could with the P9.
Advantage - P9

ERGONOMICS
The PPS' grip is *short* - even with the finger-rest mag in place, I found myself having to shoot with my pinky curled under, ala G26/27 with flush mag. The P9 allows me to get all my fingers on the grip for better control. The PPS had the larger of the two backstraps installed, which I found forced the web of the hand into the proper place high on the frame, but otherwise felt uncomfortable. I would probably prefer the smaller insert, but XXX didn't bring it along to try. Finally, the Walther mag release still sucks. After some practice, I could actuate the lever with my trigger finger with only a slight alteration of my firing grip and the mags would fall free fairly well, but this would require retraining of the muscle memory for those of us used to a release button in the traditional Browning location. Attempting to manipulate the lever with the shooting-hand thumb with any kind of speed or smoothness continues to be an exercise in frustration.
Advantage - P9

CONCEALABILITY
I put the P9 and PPS into the same size class - a thin, flat, concealable HOLSTER GUN. IMO, the PPS is no more a "pocket pistol" than is a P9, baby Glock or Taurus Millennium (better have big pockets!). Certainly not in the same league with the Pony/Mustang, KT P32/3AT, Beretta Tomcat, etc.
Advantage - NONE

So there you have it! Shooting the PPS was an interesting exercise, but the end result is that I'm even less excited about it now than when I first got to handle it. I certainly won't be adding one to my stable, and I recommend the P9 as a more comfortable, capable alternative in that size class (or a PM9 if you want something smaller in a service caliber).

 

[shooter521]

The Kahr and the PPS are the same width, but the Kahr is smaller overall.

The pic below is pretty revealing... Left to Right: Walther PPS, Kahr PM9, Kel-Tec PF9:

 

[Glock Lover]

The pic below is pretty revealing... Left to Right: Walther PPS, Kahr PM9, Kel-Tec PF9:

Great review thanks for the info.

 

[esrice]

Great review. That's what I like to read.

 

[pmpmstrb]

Whoa, that's an early PF9.

 

[shooter521]

Whoa, that's an early PF9.

Built in April 07, according to the folks at KTOG.org.

 

[Indy_Guy_77]

Shooter... you work at Bradis (Even it only part time, right?)?

You sound like a guy I was talking with while there a few weekends ago.

Now that my Kahr CW-40 is broken (still waiting on verdict, just arrived at the factory yesterday afternoon), I don't know that I'll be keeping it as my carry weapon. That, and I'm looking to shed the .40 all together; too expensive to shoot.

In my head, I think that I'd love to have a PPS. I already have a P-22 and a P-99 and love those products. I think that aside from the P-22, Walther makes some of the finest pistols on the planet as far as reliability is concerned.

But...but...but... I don't know that a PPS is worth the price. It's not all that comfortable to hold, grip is even more squared off than my Kahr is. And you have to take the backstrap off the frame in order to de-cock the firearm? Granted, it's a "DAO/Safe Action" type set up, but still. It seems too convaluted to me.

If I choose to stick with a Kahr product after dealing with my current situation, I do believe that I'm going to be looking after a CW-9. Can save $100 or more over the P series for "not that much less" of a package.

You can save your polyganal rifling, dove-tailed sites, and extra magazine. I can make a trip to Sportsman's Warehouse and get new mags for $24 apiece.

Thank you for posting your review of the PPS, Shooter521. I do appreciate it; and I do think that I will, reluctantly, remove the PPS from my shopping list. (unless I can find one for the same price as a Kahr CW!)

-J-

 

[shooter521]

Shooter... you work at Bradis (Even it only part time, right?)?
You sound like a guy I was talking with while there a few weekends ago.

I just write like I speak, I guess. Is that a good thing? At least nobody can accuse me of hiding behind the anonymity of my keyboard.

Now that my Kahr CW-40 is broken (still waiting on verdict, just arrived at the factory yesterday afternoon), I don't know that I'll be keeping it as my carry weapon.

Yeah, I saw (and replied to) your thread... sorry to hear about that, but I think it will end well.

In my head, I think that I'd love to have a PPS. I already have a P-22 and a P-99 and love those products.

Curtis (the young guy who works at the shop on Saturdays and who goes by the screen name shrtfllr here) is a big Walther fan, too. He likes his PPS quite a bit. Different strokes for different folks, and all that.

And you have to take the backstrap off the frame in order to de-cock the firearm? Granted, it's a "DAO/Safe Action" type set up, but still. It seems too convaluted to me.

I believe that removing the backstrap renders the gun incapable of being fired (not just de-cocked), much like a magazine disconnect. So it's not a "feature" you would routinely use in course of normal operation.

HTH!