The US military needs something more accurate, lethal and reliable than the M4

[Sylvain]

Im not sure if that has been posted already and where to post it.
Sorry if its already in INGO.

The US military is looking for a new rifle "which should be more accurate, lethal and reliable than the M4".

I didnt know it was not accurate and lethal enough?

Arms makers call hired guns as U.S. shops for new rifle - USATODAY.com

 

[SEIndSAM]

Let the games begin. This should be interesting to watch. We are talking some serious money here.

Maybe some nice surplus M4's will come on the market if the Army switches? We can only hope.

 

[jeremy]

Maybe some nice surplus M4's will come on the market if the Army switches? We can only hope.

Only to LEAs...

 

[Cemetery-man]

The US military is looking for a new rifle "which should be more accurate, lethal and reliable than the M4"

They already have one, the M14!

 

[jeremy]

They already have one, the M14!

You can carry that bad boy all day on Patrols if you want I'll stick with my little M-4 in 5.56...

 

[CombatVet]

My main gripe with the M-4 is it's inability to withstand sand. I've actually had it jam on me when I needed it not to because of sand. Don't start in with "if you keep your weapon clean ..." I know that, but when you've been on missions all day with lots of sand storms you don't always have time to clean your weapon. Break-free only makes it worse too.

 

[EPD1102]

I still think the main problem with the M4 is the 5.56 cartridge. It was explained to us in Boot Camp that the round was designed to wound instead of kill since wounding someone would take three people off of the battlefield as the enemy attended to their wounded. I would like to see something more like the 7.62X51 (.308) for our soldiers. My soldiering days are behind me, unless we get invaded.

 

[jeremy]

I still think the main problem with the M4 is the 5.56 cartridge. It was explained to us in Boot Camp that the round was designed to wound instead of kill since wounding someone would take three people off of the battlefield as the enemy attended to their wounded.

Whoever told you that was an idiot and very misinformed...

I would like to see something more like the 7.62X51 (.308) for our soldiers. My soldiering days are behind me, unless we get invaded.

You can take that idea and stash it with you Soldiering days...

 

[jeremy]

My main gripe with the M-4 is it's inability to withstand sand. I've actually had it jam on me when I needed it not to because of sand. Don't start in with "if you keep your weapon clean ..." I know that, but when you've been on missions all day with lots of sand storms you don't always have time to clean your weapon. Break-free only makes it worse too.

I think CLP (Break-Free) and not understanding how to Lubricate is the biggest problem there is with the M-4...

 

[firehawk1]

Asking as a COMPLETE novice, any kind of liquid (oil) will attract dust, dirt, sand, etc.... Has any type of dry lubricant ever been tried like graphite? Would it in fact work?

 

[in625shooter]

I think CLP (Break-Free) and not understanding how to Lubricate is the biggest problem there is with the M-4...

Generally with lube in the desert less is better. The problem is the sand in the middle east is a fine talcum powder type consistancy. I found it in my gear for 6 months and multiple cleanings after both times I was deployed there. EVERYONE had issues with EVERY weapon system there.

As far as a more "lethal" round that depends on if our leaders (both civilian and military) will break away from NATO standardization for general across the board issue.

 

[jeremy]

Asking as a COMPLETE novice, any kind of liquid (oil) will attract dust, dirt, sand, etc.... Has any type of dry lubricant ever been tried like graphite? Would it in fact work?

Yes Dry Graphite has been used to mixed results...

 

[LCSOSgt11]

Our military used to have at least two weapons better than the M16/M4 platform. They were:

1. M1 Garand. A man's rifle. If too long, shorten it, like the "tanker".
2. M14. Another man's rifle.

Both of them in caliber .30. The M1 in the venerable 30-06, the M14 in
7.62x51, or basically the .308 Winchester. As we all should know, the 30-06 and the .308 are both outstanding rounds as to stopping power, accuracy, and longer range.

As far as reliability, that issue is usually administrative, as in training. Basically, as soon as possible after firing the weapon, clean the thing. Completely. Fully. A clean weapon is a happy weapon.

 

[jayhawk]

I vote for an intermediate cartridge: 6.8 spc. If they're going to switch it up, do it big.

 

[xmas_asn]

Let the games begin. This should be interesting to watch. We are talking some serious money here.

Maybe some nice surplus M4's will come on the market if the Army switches? We can only hope.

Nope, Class IIIs. Witch means the Military will stockpile the good ones and cut up the receivers of the not so good ones. Just like they did for the M14s.

 

[xmas_asn]

Asking as a COMPLETE novice, any kind of liquid (oil) will attract dust, dirt, sand, etc.... Has any type of dry lubricant ever been tried like graphite? Would it in fact work?

Graphite is no bueno! Never put that in a M4 or AR.. It shot like crap and EVERYTHING was dirty when I got done..

 

[jblomenberg16]

Nope, Class IIIs. Witch means the Military will stockpile the good ones and cut up the receivers of the not so good ones. Just like they did for the M14s.

Ah, but a man can dream of the days when he can go up to the CMP north store and pick up a M16 or M4, even if it has the lower swapped out with a semi-auto unit.

 

[printcraft]

Didn't they come up with something in the SCAR competition?

 

[Rampdog]

Our erstwhile "allies" in Iraq, Afghanistan, and elsewhere would more than likely get all the surplus M4s.

 

[jeremy]

Our military used to have at least two weapons better than the M16/M4 platform. They were:

1. M1 Garand. A man's rifle. If too long, shorten it, like the "tanker".
2. M14. Another man's rifle.

Really based on what information?!
Both those rifles are the reason we went to the M16/M4 Series of weapon systems chambered in 5.56. Both of those rifles are trash. Oh they are great range shooters, however in the realm of combat they are truly undeserving of mention. So try again...

Both of them in caliber .30. The M1 in the venerable 30-06, the M14 in
7.62x51, or basically the .308 Winchester. As we all should know, the 30-06 and the .308 are both outstanding rounds as to stopping power, accuracy, and longer range.

The .30 Caliber Super killer rounds again?! You do realize that 90% of Servicemembers cannot even take advantage fully of the limited range of the 5.56 don't you?! Probably not do to your posting. Fratricide Stats from the Wars is the reason we stepped down to the little 5.56 round. Would not expect you to know that. So why don't you just leave War and the picking of War Toys to those of us that know WTH we are talking about and you stay in the Armchair in your squad...

As far as reliability, that issue is usually administrative, as in training. Basically, as soon as possible after firing the weapon, clean the thing. Completely. Fully. A clean weapon is a happy weapon.

LOL...
Myth. I have personally taken M16s and M4s up into the 10,000 round realm without cleaning them with ZERO malfunctions in the CZ.