The massacre at Fort Hood and Muslim soldiers with attitude

[haldir]

u

pdated 1:24 p.m. ET, Tues., May 22, 2007
WASHINGTON - One in four younger U.S. Muslims say suicide bombings to defend their religion are acceptable at least in some circumstances...

25% is a pretty high percentage of US Muslims that would be of military age who see the murder of innocents as an acceptable method of dissent. The apologists keep saying they are just like the rest of us. I don't believe you could get 25% of Christians to agree on much of anything similar.

[techres]

Originally Posted by haldir

u

25% is a pretty high percentage of US Muslims that would be of military age who see the murder of innocents as an acceptable method of dissent. The apologists keep saying they are just like the rest of us. I don't believe you could get 25% of Christians to agree on much of anything similar.

This is a great factoid! Thank you for finding it. We can work with this.

Ok, so what we have here is proof of my shared belief that Muslims are more susceptible to terrorist mindsets than other modern religions. HOWEVER, that is a level of susceptibility rather than a determined end.

So, how do we reach out and get to those in the Muslim community to change the source of accepting that which should never be acceptable (terrorism)? Do we do it by banning all Muslims or rounding them up? No. Do they have a special problem with this? Oh, yes, they do. And most important, Do they have a choice to make with being a modern people and religion that has to shake their medieval ways of the past in mind and body? You bet.

But I do not think it is a lost cause, a waste of time, or a predetermined end. And those who do and want to act accordingly will only take that 25% and turn it into 100% and thereby quadrupling the numbers of potential terrorists.

When McVey came out of the gun community and militia community to commit a horrendous act of terrorism, our communities were quick to be clear and open that we did NOT stand beside him. At the same time we expected others to accept us at our word when we said that he was not "one of us" or "spoke for us".

I would ask two things as a result:

1. For Muslims to work hard to denounce the terrorists and terrorist minded inside their own community.

2. For us to help them root out their 25% instead of rounding up to 100%.

I don't think that is apologist. I think it is fair and practical.

[ihateiraq]

Originally Posted by techres

I would ask two things as a result:

1. For Muslims to work hard to denounce the terrorists and terrorist minded inside their own community.

2. For us to help them root out their 25% instead of rounding up to 100%.

I don't think that is apologist. I think it is fair and practical.

that will never happen. they will never side w/ a non muslim over a muslim on a large enough scale for us to root out terrorism. you dont quite understand their mindset. its very archaic.

[techres]

Originally Posted by ihateiraq

that will never happen. they will never side w/ a non muslim over a muslim on a large enough scale for us to root out terrorism. you dont quite understand their mindset. its very archaic.

I know only the many I have met and known. They were mostly Americans and those I have hopes for and are talking about here.

Do they know how to circle the wagons, refuse to criticize their own in public, and put up with crap from members of the group that they should not? Yes! And the same actions are true of American Jews as well.

What is different though, is that there are many American Muslims who are genuinely afraid of their own and do not speak in part out of fear. Or so they have told me. And this is my biggest frustration: they have to choose in the end - modernity or old family. One or the other, that is the choice.

But it is their choice to make and we get to react to that choice.

What gets me is talk that sounds like no interest in giving them that choice but instead deciding for them and preventatively acting against them based solely on their religion. That is neither Christian or Constitutional.

[Al B]

Originally Posted by techres

What is different though, is that there are many American Muslims who are genuinely afraid of their own and do not speak in part out of fear. Or so they have told me. And this is my biggest frustration: they have to choose in the end - modernity or old family. One or the other, that is the choice.

Very good example of terrorism. Sad that is their own people. Never heard of this in any other "religion" that I have come in contact with.

[ihateiraq]

Originally Posted by techres

I know only the many I have met and known. They were mostly Americans and those I have hopes for and are talking about here.

Do they know how to circle the wagons, refuse to criticize their own in public, and put up with crap from members of the group that they should not? Yes! And the same actions are true of American Jews as well.

What is different though, is that there are many American Muslims who are genuinely afraid of their own and do not speak in part out of fear. Or so they have told me. And this is my biggest frustration: they have to choose in the end - modernity or old family. One or the other, that is the choice.

But it is their choice to make and we get to react to that choice.

What gets me is talk that sounds like no interest in giving them that choice but instead deciding for them and preventatively acting against them based solely on their religion. That is neither Christian or Constitutional.

Theyre supposed to be in the majority though, right? they shouldnt have anything to be afraid of.

Call me what you will, but i have not interest in protecting their freedoms. The silence from the imams speaks louder than the explosions of suicide bombers to me. Only they can end this madness, and they have not shown a desire to do so.

[Fletch]

Originally Posted by ihateiraq

Theyre supposed to be in the majority though, right? they shouldnt have anything to be afraid of.

The rest of the majority isn't always around to help defend you against savages with machetes. I daresay it isn't the radical crazies in public that they're generally scared of; it's the radical crazies who show up in the middle of the night and drag you out of your bed for a beheading that keep them from speaking out.

[SavageEagle]

Originally Posted by Fletch

The rest of the majority isn't always around to help defend you against savages with machetes. I daresay it isn't the radical crazies in public that they're generally scared of; it's the radical crazies who show up in the middle of the night and drag you out of your bed for a beheading that keep them from speaking out.

I don't behead people!!! I don't even OWN a machete!!!

sorry, I couldn't help it. It's been a grim night and I needed to smile...

[ihateiraq]

Originally Posted by Fletch

The rest of the majority isn't always around to help defend you against savages with machetes. I daresay it isn't the radical crazies in public that they're generally scared of; it's the radical crazies who show up in the middle of the night and drag you out of your bed for a beheading that keep them from speaking out.

if the majority of muslims wanted to put a stop to terrorism, they could. if they stood up and said enough is enough, we arent funding this anymore. you arent stashing weapons and wanted people in our homes. you arent using our children as weapons. it would be done.
i think the problem is that "majority" isnt really a majority. its people paying us lip service. the iraqis i worked with were not stupid. they were primitive, but not stupid. they were quick to cook their books, or tell you what they think you want to hear. or try to give you the run around until you would just give up.

[CarmelHP]

Originally Posted by techres

What is different though, is that there are many American Muslims who are genuinely afraid of their own and do not speak in part out of fear. Or so they have told me. And this is my biggest frustration: they have to choose in the end - modernity or old family. One or the other, that is the choice.

Well, that speaks volumes right there, doesn't it? Islam contains a heavy political component in its teachings. It's a political belief system, couched as being commanded by Allah. If someone entered the military espousing Nazism, White Supremacy, or any other violence demanding political belief system, would you have a similar problem with the Army taking a second look.

The implication that examining more closely a Muslim military recruit is a step away from firing up the ovens is a fallacious non-sequitor meant only to frighten away any opposing debate. If you are an adherent of a violent political ideology, it doesn't make it OK just because you call your Fuhrer "god" or "Allah."