CIHPRS Atterbury Long Range, now with Electronic Targets!

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  • natdscott

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    As some of you are already aware, your friendly local Highpower shooters at Camp Atterbury in Indiana have elected to lead the way as a small-ish range going forward with the next generation of target system: Electronic scoring/monitoring.

    Previously, much of the technology available was cost-prohibitive for ranges and groups with less than the financial backing of a place as magnificent as Talladega. However, with the advent of Silver Mountain's acoustic plug-and-play target systems, the status quo changed.

    Central Indiana Highpower (CIHRPS.org) has secured first 4, and now 6 complete Silver Mountain systems, and we are working with Wayne, and all of the CIHPRS membership, under our fearless leader's guidance, to prepare for our first matches of the season. A large part of this preparation occurred Saturday the 6th during our annual workday, and we have the following to report:

    It works, and it's awesome!

    Reporting accurate bullet placements, scores, temperature, speed of the bullet at the target, group center location, and ongoing plot, all accessible from a standard WiFi connection on the firing line, we anticipate extreme gains in match efficiency on the military base, ability to coach juniors and possibly run clinics, and overall enjoyment of the shooting experience at Atterbury.

    For those of you concerned with the system, and it's logistics, I understand. My OCD is raging a little as well, but I can assure you that everything will work out fine, and we will all figure out how to shoot as many X's on the new system--but now, while sipping lemonade at the firing line--as we would have on paper.

    Facts and Notes:

    --The target frame's white will remain the familiar 6-foot square, but will now be white, instead of buff, as it is constructed of polyboard.

    --The aiming blacks are regulation-sized, and are LITERALLY paper targets pasted to additional poly backer "pizza pans".

    --The blacks are index-marked at the edges at 12/3/6/9-o'clock to match to a red quadrant centered on the aiming point of the white, such that the blacks can be reliable transitioned on/off their Velcro-Brand fasteners.

    --Aiming blacks are centered exactly 2" above the center of the white frame (why yes, we did chalk-line them). All Aiming blacks, regardless of size from 200 through 1,000 yard centers, are centered on the same point.

    --ACOUSTIC center of the frames is located exactly 10.0" BELOW the Target center, and it is to THIS point that your rifle zeroes must be adjusted to put a bullet through the paper and score an "X". This may become more clear in a second when you see the photo of the frames.

    --Simply put, the Acoustic center of the target is located 10" low to also put the bottom SENSORS 10" lower than the bottom of the aiming white. Plainly: we want as much of the sensors and equipment as possible to be BELOW the berm. There's little to be done about the top 2 sensors, and their corresponding wires, and we will be securing additional replacements, but as much as we can do to protect the investment is being done.

    --Prior to the season's matches, we are going through a live-fire calibration of individual frames, their sensors, and their individual wireless router/Kindle. These sets of equipment will then be kept together as a single-target unit and will NOT be swapped between frames to account for small differences from frame-to-frame and match-to-match.

    --For those of you on optics, or on match sights, the negative zero change to score centered hits on this target system will possibly be fairly simple. For those Cross-Course shooters on A2 or similar Service Rifles, it is still simple: turn the front sight out 1 full turn (pretty close to 5 MOA). Corrections for everybody to bridge that 10" gap are as follows:

    200 Yards: -4.75 MOA
    300 Yards: -3.25 MOA
    500 Yards: -2.00 MOA
    600 Yards: -1.50 MOA
    800 Yards: -1.25 MOA
    900 Yards: -1.00 MOA
    1,000 Yards: -1.00 MOA
    1,200 Yards: -0.75 MOA

    ...if you are one of the ELR or Sniper match guys, you can figger it for yourself beyond that...
    laugh.png


    Now for the fun part, images:

    1) Target frame showing offset of aiming white vs. sensor array brackets (the little black bits at the corners of the frame).



    2) Authentic NRA aiming blacks on their "pizza pans" drying on the floor after gluing, waiting for Velcro.


    3) Closer photo of the center of a virgin frame, showing Aiming center 2" North of White Center (the top little "x" on the upper chalk line), and 10" North of the Acoustic Center (bottom little "x" on the lower chalk line).



    4) One of our fearless leaders, the inimitable Shawn Agne, assembling the lower sensors on the array. Over his shoulder, you can see the secured 600 yard aiming black for initial calibration yesterday by F-Class shooter Dwayne Dragoo.


    5) The resulting screenshot of Jeff Hopkins' testing at 600 yards, showing all impacts, current impact, velocities, and the yellow circle reflecting group center (this feature will be disabled during matches).



    I'm quite sure I've missed some things, and there may be a hiccup here and there, but we will work through them. Whatever questions you all have, throw them at us, and please put a match at Atterbury on your calendar just as soon as you can. It looks to be a really exciting 2016 match season with CIHPRS!

    -Nate
     

    Twangbanger

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    How cool is that! Can this replace scorers in the pits at a sanctioned match? Or is this for club matches only?
     

    natdscott

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    Hey, sorry guys, busy week.

    These targets have the potential to completely remove the need for pit service at all. The morning range setup tasks will be similar (but obviously need to be completed a little more delicately than with paper targets), but once that is complete and targets are in the air, there is likely to be no reason for ANY individual to be in the pits at all until pit cleanup/stowage at the end of the day.

    This should have the collateral effects of reduced time to complete a match/stage, more equitable weather effects from relay to relay, and hopefully, increased participation from some of those that were no longer/not yet able to run pit service in a manner acceptable for shooting in sanctioned matches.

    Now on that other note (thank you for bringing it up), ALL CIHPRS matches, unless noted otherwise, are sanctioned by and reported to the NRA or the CMP, as applicable. There are but a few exceptions, but these targets are legal for use in either of the above rulebooks, and no kidding, the targets are actually real paper centers in the first place...it just means that the "rings" are scored virtually.

    Regarding Public vs. Match: the ranges at Camp Atterbury Joint Maneuver Training Center (CAJMTC)--and I specificially differentiate that from the truly public access Johnson County "Camp Atterbury" 100-yard ranges, etc. across the highway from the base--are accessible to those members of the civilian public that

    1) have consented to certain non-invasive vetting measures by base security, and
    2) are there on a specified day under the blanket (and insurance policies) of a recognized and registered civilian organization.

    CIHPRS, Appleseed, and maybe Revere's Riders are the .civ groups I am aware of that utilize the base.

    Now, for clarification, CIHPRS will be the only one of those .civ groups with these electronic targets, simply because we own them and they are really expensive. We shoot at least 2 weekends (both days) a month for 7-8 months a year, pending approval of military command. WITH the advent of these targets, we DO anticipate being able to offer less-structured "practice time" before/after our sanctioned matches on the weekends we have paid for the range. What this obviously would allow is that a registered shooter that may not have any particular interest in competition could still come in for the afternoon and zero a hunting rifle, or maybe shoot a heavy rifle they'd not want to shoot for a full match, or...fill in the blank.

    The only real restriction we have is NO cartridges larger than .33 caliber magnums. No, we're not skeered, but it's not allowed. Some things on military installations aren't negotiable.


    Thanks for the questions, and keep them coming!

    -Nate
     
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    Twangbanger

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    In the $3K range. It is a game changer. I was impressed with how it runs.

    Again excuse my ignorance...is it 3 grand per firing point, regardless of number of points? Or is there three grand worth of equipment in the first firing point, then a lesser dollar amount of sensors for each additional firing point, which can piggyback off the first one? I wasn't clear if you need to buy the "whole shootin' match" for every firing point.

    I have been trying to talk myself out of setting up a HP gun and getting dragged back into this, "do I really want to go to that trouble," do I need another sport in addition to the ones I already shoot, etc. You guys are making this difficult.
     

    indyjohn

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    Again excuse my ignorance...is it 3 grand per firing point, regardless of number of points? Or is there three grand worth of equipment in the first firing point, then a lesser dollar amount of sensors for each additional firing point, which can piggyback off the first one? I wasn't clear if you need to buy the "whole shootin' match" for every firing point.

    I have been trying to talk myself out of setting up a HP gun and getting dragged back into this, "do I really want to go to that trouble," do I need another sport in addition to the ones I already shoot, etc. You guys are making this difficult.

    I don't know. Each firing point operates independently but you can watch any active target from the Kindle assigned to your firing point.

    I bet you can scrounge up everything you need for a Highpower campaign this year. Look forward to seeing you out there.
     

    natdscott

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    Shoot, we're all ignorant right now. But uh, it is approximately $3,000 PER firing point.

    But why does that matter for you coming back down to Atterbury and shooting with us? They're bought...and you don't have to buy them. :)

    I'm with John: Get a rifle set back up and come shoot!

    -Nate
     

    ShawnAgne

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    Currently all four targets that we were using the other day each act as independent targets (they are essentially webpages). However they have the ability to see the other webpages over the Silver Mountain Network that you log into with your wireless device. There are 2 more targets coming this week. One of them is coming with the S3 server on it so viewing the other targets works a little smoother and makes administering the matches a little easier.

    The cost is $3,000 per target, MUCH cheaper than when the system first came out ($5,000) and still way cheaper thank the Kongsberg system that the CMP uses at Anniston.

    As it was stated before there won't be anybody in the pits during the matches. Everyone will be on the line. Only time people will go down to the pits is to swap out the aiming faces. Literally you can sit in a chair drink lemonade, shoot, score, drink more lemonade till you have to shoot again. Also if it is going to be hot we will be putting tents up to shoot under. We've been doing this for the Long Range matches for the past 2 years, and with the extra bodies on the line to help move them from yardlines no reason we can't for course matches either.

    The range at Blakely Georgia went to this system last year and they were getting 3x600s done in 3 hours or less.

    Match schedule and information can be found at Central Indiana Highpower Rifle Shooters
     
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    indyjohn

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    Currently all four targets that we were using the other day each act as independent targets (they are essentially webpages). However they have the ability to see the other webpages over the Silver Mountain Network that you log into with your wireless device. There are 2 more targets coming this week. One of them is coming with the S3 server on it so viewing the other targets works a little smoother and makes administering the matches a little easier.

    The cost is $3,000 per target, MUCH cheaper than when the system first came out ($5,000) and still way cheaper thank the Kongsberg system that the CMP uses at Anniston.

    As it was stated before there won't be anybody in the pits during the matches. Everyone will be on the line. Only time people will go down to the pits is to swap out the aiming faces. Literally you can sit in a chair drink lemonade, shoot, score, drink more lemonade till you have to shoot again. Also if it is going to be hot we will be putting tents up to shoot under. We've been doing this for the Long Range matches for the past 2 years, and with the extra bodies on the line to help move them from yardlines no reason we can't for course matches either.

    The range at Blakely Georgia went to this system last year and they were getting 3x600s done in 3 hours or less.

    Match schedule and information can be found at Central Indiana Highpower Rifle Shooters

    Glad to see you here, Shawn. LMK if there is anything I can do to help.
     

    Litlratt

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    Well done to all those involved.
    I'm assuming that range commands have been modified to account for the stationary targets.
    How do they handle the RF stages? Can the software be programmed for start and stop times for late hits?
    I'm guessing an XC match will take 3 hours less to complete.

    Makes me want to shoot long guns again even more now:rockwoot:
     

    natdscott

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    Hey Rat,

    Good to see ya. The range commands may not need to be changed a great deal, but I predict it will become more critical that people follow the rules as to when they are in non-firing prep, versus just staging equipment and so forth. As the targets obviously won't come down, I'm sure you've thought of some other ramifications of the whole thing.

    I don't know about the programming for rapids. That's a VERY good question. Ideally, to me, any early/late hits wouldn't even be SHOWN on the screen, much less scored. I also don't know what it means for the "hero shot" at 71 seconds as the target is going down. I suppose, if it is electronic, then you will have--quite literally--60.0/70.0 seconds to get things done.

    Shawn, you want to speak to that, here and on the NM Forums?

    I am interested to see what the white poly backers do to sight picture in varying light conditions. I do believe that if if were a north shooting range, the white poly could be a problem. I've now shot a little Palma and 1,000 with the little gun, and I'm qualified to confirm that everyone's cautions about the sight picture are true, particularly late in the day. Maybe the white will help...a little. (I will take whatever I can get!)

    John would say that I am building my repertoire of excuses. :):

    -Nate
     

    ShawnAgne

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    The e-target matches will work pretty much like walk and paste matches.

    Targets will be up in the air. All the mumbo jumbo will be given as far as ready on the right/left etc.

    Then the command will be, "Shooters on my command you may begin fire" person running the line will either say fire or blow a whistle

    When time is expired command will be given to indicate time has expired.

    As you shoot the shot will be plotted. If a shot is fired while time expires the scorer can see which shot it is and nullify that value.

    As far as the white it will make shooting much easier. There is more color distinction between the black and white than black and buff. If the range was north facing it would be amazing the clarity difference. On the work day I was one of the last shooters to fire and it was around 5:10pm sun was low and to the right not ideal. But I could see the black because of the white backer, if it was a buff paper backer I wouldn't have been able to pick it out.

    The only question I'm not sure of is on the time limits. The CMP at their range has been adding 4 seconds to simulate the time it takes for the targets to go up. The originally didn't do this, but now are. I need to talk with Sheri Judd about a couple of things and I'm going to see what she things about it. At this point I'm inclined as to doing it since the CMP has done it at their range for a good reason. But I'll see what Sherri says.
     

    Litlratt

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    Does the software allow for caliber? If so, I'm assuming it only plots a larger/smaller hole regardless of the hit. How will you handle crossfires of a different caliber?

    I agree with the additional time, it more accurately reflects pit operations.
     

    ShawnAgne

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    Yes you can set the software to to register different caliber holes, default is .30cal. I'm not sure how the code works but it will plot the center and then draw the appropriate size hole around it.

    Crossfires are rather interesting the target plots the velocity of your shot at impact so say at 300yds your 223 is hitting at 2050fps or there about. Your shots will register at this speed. If a shooter from a target over crossfires since the bullet is coming in at an angle it registers at a higher speed. Farther away the shot comes the higher the velocity it registers at. Since the majority of crossfires will happen at 200/300 during rapids the angles will be the greatest so you should easily be able to tell which shot(s) weren't those that you fired. So if you receive 15 shots making it a 145-8X you can look at the speeds determine which one wasn't your shot and delete that from your string. So if you shot 99-7X and Earl dumped a 46-1X on your target we will know which of those 5 shots are his. So it doesn't really matter what caliber it is that crossed as you will be able to tell the difference from the speed. I worked up the equation but we can also looking at the velocity tell where the crossfire came from approximately. SO no more not admitting to a crossfire.

    I emailed Dennis and Sherri, Dennis said the NRA rules don't support the extra time, but he said you also want to be able to register a shot fired at 59.99/69.99. He said the Kongsberg and Mega systems have a built in timer and they set the values to 60.99 and 70.99. I emailed the SMT people about adding the timer to the software for us, it will be added along with some other features we've asked for. We will adjust the time to what is fair to the shooters and what they are use to.
     

    natdscott

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    Anybody following this thread...

    Things seem to be going fairly well with our transition to the SMT Electronic Targets. We have had a hiccup here and there, some related only to user error, and some due to need for heavier wireless equipment (which has now been acquired) to get back to 1,000+ yards, but all is going fairly smoothly at this point, and the targets have reduced time to conduct a match, much as we'd anticipated would be the case.

    What I'm getting to is that if you've been waiting to shoot a match at Atterbury with CIHPRS, for whatever reason, you should do so now. It's not too late to sign up for this weekend's USMC Match, but it will be soon.

    CIHPRS - Events

    Quit your waiting around for "next month" or "next year when I'm better"...because you'll never feel prepared enough for your first match, and you'll also never run out of excuses (Yes, you can sit around on your butt and barbecue or mow the yard any OTHER weekend, or even when you get home from the range)...

    ...but at the end of it all, next week, next month, next year...that time is not guaranteed to you.

    Do it now.

    -Nate
     
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