Armed citizens running out of ammo in real life?

[mcjon77]

Hi guys,

I am always impressed by the depth of knowledge and experience of guys on this forum, so I thought I would pose a question. Has anyone heard of ANY situation where an armed citizen (NOT a police officer) lost the fight because they ran out of ammo?

If you do not know of that type of situation, have you heard of one where an armed citizen had to go to hands/knives to survive an attack BECAUSE they ran out of ammo? What about an armed citizen having to reload and continue firing after running out of ammo? What about an armed citizen having to resort to a backup gun because they ran out of ammo?

I am not trying to prove any point this question (such as all you need is a 5 shot snubby). Rather, I constantly hear about capacity, reload, and backup issues within the gun community, but haven't actually heard of a person needing it to fight off a human attacker. I have heard of someone needing to shoot and reload twice to stop a mountain lion with a revolver, but that is it.

I am assuming that this had to have happened at least once, I just have never heard about it. What have you guys heard?

 

[MohawkSlim]

Add my name as being curious too. A lot of "experts" have told me to carry extra mags and stuff. It would be neat to see the evidence for their position.

 

[worddoer]

Sorry...I don't have access to any documented evidence. But something to think about....

In the classes I have attended, the instructors have said the number one reason you carry extra magazines...especially with a semi-auto pistol...is not because of magazine capacity. It is for malfunctions.

If you have a bad round in a mag or a damaged magazine that causes a double feed malfunction...often the far, far quickest way to get your pistol back in the fight is with another magazine. This is otherwise known as a type 3 malfunction. You have to completely remove the magazine... cycle the pistol a couple of times to attempt to clear it... insert a fresh magazine... cycle the pistol to chamber a fresh round... and as long as the pistol itself has not broken, you should be up and running again.

We have some really intelligent people on here who could give you specifics I'm sure. But it is my educated guess... that you have statistically higher odds of needing that extra magazine due to a malfunction on your 1st or 2nd round versus you have to fight off 27 midget's with chainsaws who are looking to kill you because you said something nasty about their sister.

Just take my word for it, leave the midget's sister out of it!

 

[Que]

I can't say I've ever heard of anyone running out of ammo or having to resort to a backup gun. I think the suggestion is simply a preventive/cautionary measure. It's kind of like the idea of carrying a gun: it's better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it. However, I have no knowledge of extra mags or backup pistols ever being needed.

 

[actaeon277]

Here is a Bad Guy running out. One of the Boston Bombers.
I know, it's not defense. And I'm not advocating firing on the law.
Tamerlan Walked Toward Police Firing ? Ran out of Ammo: Dzhokhar Drove Over Tamerlan as Cops Were Handcuffing Him ? Drug HimThrough the Street | Maggie's Notebook

 

[actaeon277]

Homeowner Runs Out of Ammo Firing Warning Shots - The Firearm Blog

 

[SSGSAD]

Homeowner Runs Out of Ammo Firing Warning Shots - The Firearm Blog

Well, there ya go, NEVER fire a warning shot .......

I have NOT, btdt, but I have read a lot, in the past.....

The "experts" say, that "most gunfights", are over in less than 5-6 shots .....

 

[actaeon277]

Drug Dealer Convicted of Killing 3 Says He's Sorry He Ran Out of Bullets | Fox News
Another bad guy. I know you're looking for defense. But if an attacker can run out, so can a defender.

 

[actaeon277]

Well, there ya go, NEVER fire a warning shot .......

I have NOT, btdt, but I have read a lot, in the past.....

The "experts" say, that "most gunfights", are over in less than 5-6 shots .....

If the average is set at 5-6, and some are over in 1-2, then mathematically some are over in +6.

 

[KG1]

Sorry...I don't have access to any documented evidence. But something to think about....

In the classes I have attended, the instructors have said the number one reason you carry extra magazines...especially with a semi-auto pistol...is not because of magazine capacity. It is for malfunctions.

If you have a bad round in a mag or a damaged magazine that causes a double feed malfunction...often the far, far quickest way to get your pistol back in the fight is with another magazine. This is otherwise known as a type 3 malfunction. You have to completely remove the magazine... cycle the pistol a couple of times to attempt to clear it... insert a fresh magazine... cycle the pistol to chamber a fresh round... and as long as the pistol itself has not broken, you should be up and running again.

We have some really intelligent people on here who could give you specifics I'm sure. But it is my educated guess... that you have statistically higher odds of needing that extra magazine due to a malfunction on your 1st or 2nd round versus you have to fight off 27 midget's with chainsaws who are looking to kill you because you said something nasty about their sister.

Just take my word for it, leave the midget's sister out of it!

All sound reasoning. Another reason to carry a spare loaded mag would be in case the loaded magazine already in your pistol has somehow been accidentally dropped without knowledge of it happening. Believe it or not it does happen. Hopefully it won't cost you your life before you can realize what happened. That is also another reason why IMO a semi-auto without a magazine disconnect is preferable. At least you would be able to get a chambered round off.

 

[actaeon277]

And a back up mag is more than just ammo. Mags fail. Swap mag, problem fixed.

And for the record, I carry a model 19 usually, not a semi-

 

[bradmedic04]

Capacity isn't what I'm thinking about with an extra mag, though it is nice in case we're talking about roving packs of rabid wolves or something. Only convincing I ever needed was slapping a mag into place and having the base plate eject itself with vigor, jettisoning all the ammo and leaving me with a non-functional weapon.

 

[LP1]

How many spare tires do you carry? How many different tools do you carry in your personal vehicle? How many fire extinguishers are in your car and house? How many spare sump pumps do you have in your basement?

In other words, think ahead and be reasonably prepared, but accept the fact that it's not feasible to prepare for every possible contingency.

 

[actaeon277]

How many spare tires do you carry? How many different tools do you carry in your personal vehicle? How many fire extinguishers are in your car and house? How many spare sump pumps do you have in your basement?

In other words, think ahead and be reasonably prepared, but accept the fact that it's not feasible to prepare for every possible contingency.

2
Dozens
3
2, and I don't have a basement.

 

[Bfish]

Sorry...I don't have access to any documented evidence. But something to think about....

In the classes I have attended, the instructors have said the number one reason you carry extra magazines...especially with a semi-auto pistol...is not because of magazine capacity. It is for malfunctions.

If you have a bad round in a mag or a damaged magazine that causes a double feed malfunction...often the far, far quickest way to get your pistol back in the fight is with another magazine. This is otherwise known as a type 3 malfunction. You have to completely remove the magazine... cycle the pistol a couple of times to attempt to clear it... insert a fresh magazine... cycle the pistol to chamber a fresh round... and as long as the pistol itself has not broken, you should be up and running again.

We have some really intelligent people on here who could give you specifics I'm sure. But it is my educated guess... that you have statistically higher odds of needing that extra magazine due to a malfunction on your 1st or 2nd round versus you have to fight off 27 midget's with chainsaws who are looking to kill you because you said something nasty about their sister.

Just take my word for it, leave the midget's sister out of it!

This is very sound... A magazine for a malfunction not just for extra ammo. Plus your magazine can be the cause of the malfunctions and you may need to insert another for the gun to run. Malfunctions can be more prominent under stress, so it's great to have one. I also would like to have an extra simply for extra ammo. I know you are looking for civilian examples and things, but I think you should consider any armed encounter. Under stress you will see guys start pressing off rounds in a hurry.
This is my opinion but you should always carry and extra mag. It's just too easy not to do it. And if your mag capacity is not very high you really need carry and extra mag for more than malfunctions. I understand that if you know you will be in a gun fight you'll take every mag you own, and you can't go out every day like that. So there has to be a compromise... There once in a great while may be a situation where you have to really worry about concealment and so do what you do. But I think 1 mag is needed no matter what.

 

[OutdoorDad]

To the OP.

No. I have no first hand knowledge of anyone ever running out of ammo in a defensive situation.

In fact, other than the ones posted here, I've never heard of it happening anywhere.

Now it's possible that there are thousands of real life examples. But I haven't encountered any.

Darn good question you posed!!

 

[snowwalker]

Not once have I ever heard someone say they had too much ammo! Sounds like from the OP's point of view a two shot derringer is more than sufficient.

 

[IndyDave1776]

My point of view on the matter is that the extra ammunition within the scope of American normal is superfluous. Nevertheless, it is better to have and not need than to need and not have. I will also point out that there are parts of the world (think South Africa) where both attacks on the street and home invasions, even in 'good' neighborhoods, are carried out by groups of 20 or so criminals. All of a sudden, your G17 starts to feel like a Derringer.

 

[snowwalker]

IndyDave1776: "extra ammunition within the scope of American normal is superfluous." I rest my case.

 

[IndyDave1776]

IndyDave1776: "extra ammunition within the scope of American normal is superfluous." I rest my case.

I don't consider carrying a little extra a bad idea or anything, but we have not (at least not yet) reached the point where encountering hostile mini-mobs of criminals is common, therefore I don't see the need to carry ammunition in a way that brings Pancho Villa to mind.