1911-cocked, half cocked or butterscotch?

[Bummer]

I just went and got my Kimber- It has a firing pin block that is released by the rear grip safety. ...

That's interesting. The traditional 80 series block is activated by the trigger.

 

[Bummer]

No holster...

Jacket pocket?

 

[JetGirl]

That's interesting. The traditional 80 series block is activated by the trigger.

Not Kimber. They use the Schwartz system.

 

[JetGirl]

Jacket pocket?

Ear/shoulder prop while multi-tasking.

 

[TomN]

Oh, and Tom where are my 50 bucks for your new sig lines?

The check is in the mail!

 

[JetGirl]

That's interesting. The traditional 80 series block is activated by the trigger.

Annie's Stuff: Firing Pin Block

 

[Bummer]

Annie's Stuff: Firing Pin Block

Thanks for the link. Interesting firing pin block variation.

I noticed one quibble that I've seen elsewhere. Based upon what I've read, the actual change made ca. 1970 (hence the Series 70 name) was the spring type barrel bushing. That would mean that there's a pre-70 (solid barrel bushing and no firing pin safety - everything from 1911 to 1970), a 70 (spring type barrel bushing and no firing pin safety - 1970 to 1980 or so), and an 80 (back to the solid barrel bushing but with the addition of the firing pin safety - from 1980 or so). Since today nobody uses a spring type barrel bushing everything without a firing pin safety is a pre-70.

I'm still not an authority, but...

 

[JetGirl]

Thanks for the link. Interesting firing pin block variation.

Thanks for the read.

 

[Double T]

I've also read that overuse of the half cock notch can wear the hammer sear relationship down, and ruin trigger pull.

Half cock was originally a safeguard to protect against hammer follow.

If you are worried about the safety getting "flicked" by anyone but you, perhaps a holster hand molded for your gun with the safety on? Or make sure it takes a bit of force to disengage.

Or lock it up.

The hammer sear are mated primarily at the fully cocked position. Half cock is a tiny little nub to catch in case of hammer follow...I trust the thumb safety + full hammer sear engagement over half cock semi-engagement.

 

[JetGirl]

I've also read that overuse of the half cock notch can wear the hammer sear relationship down, and ruin trigger pull.

I don't doubt that...but where did you read it?

Also, @ Bowman (again); Have you ever just holstered an empty/unloaded 1911 fully cocked and locked - just to test your theory (about getting bumped and knocking the safety off) ?

 

[Double T]

I don't doubt that...but where did you read it?

Also, @ Bowman (again); Have you ever just holstered an empty/unloaded 1911 fully cocked and locked - just to test your theory (about getting bumped and knocking the safety off) ?

Pretty sure it was 1911 tuner. He works a lot with GI types, but knows a bit about the internals of 1911's.

Yeah, I did a google search for "1911 tuner half cock" and a couple postings on the second page of the results showed him warning against allowing a hammer to fall to the half cock or to "nick" the sear at the half cock as it could change the geometry of the hammer hooks or cause undue wear.

He also mentions a lot of the newer sear models have a nub, or shelf for the half cock engagement surface rather than an actual channel.

YMMV but I read a crapload of posts relating to the mechanics of a 1911 before I even bought one, and I also read through (some confusingly) most of the Kuhnhausen manuals.

You can see the difference between the angles on an STI model hammer. I would think that undue wear could happen, and the half cock is another integral safety feature within the gun to prevent hammer follow and burst fire. using it as such could allow a shot or multiple shots to "happen" if other parts are out of spec or are worn.

 

[sparkyfender]

Some left handed soldier's carried half cocked during WWII instead of using the right handed safety.

My late father joined the Army a few months before Pearl Harbor. He was trained by the military to carry the 1911 service sidearm in the half-cock position, and he did so until he reached an advanced age where handgun carry was no longer an option or priority. As a side note, his carry pistol was a Colt made in 1918.........
Why he was trained in such a manner, I have no idea, but it seemed to work okay for him.

Just for the ledger, I carry a 1911 cocked and locked in a good holster, am carrying a Kimber as I type this.........

 

[down3green]

Butterscotch my friend. Butterscotch.

.

I'll butterscotch a Glock, but the 1911 is always cocked and locked. Always.



.

 

[army bratt]

Full battery!!! No safety, it takes 1/10th of a second to release the safety. Do you think that when it counts that you can afford 1/10th of a second. Train yourself to never trigger your index finger untill your are ready to destroy what is in front of you. I assure you that you will be just as accurate with this disapline. The 1911 was designed to be carried with the hammer in full battery. Only jerkoffs shoot themselves! Right AJ?

 

[iChokePeople]

Full battery!!! No safety, it takes 1/10th of a second to release the safety. Do you think that when it counts that you can afford 1/10th of a second. Train yourself to never trigger your index finger untill your are ready to destroy what is in front of you. I assure you that you will be just as accurate with this disapline. The 1911 was designed to be carried with the hammer in full battery. Only jerkoffs shoot themselves! Right AJ?

Purple implied? Yes, it takes (some amount of time) to flick the safety, but it's happening in parallel with other actions, not in series.

 

[JetGirl]

it takes (some amount of time) to flick the safety, but it's happening in parallel with other actions, not in series.

This ^.
Safety is OFF by the time the muzzle clears the holster.

 

[Bummer]

.. allowing a hammer to fall to the half cock or to "nick" the sear at the half cock as it could change the geometry of the hammer hooks or cause undue wear.

...

Ok, now I understand what you're referring to. If the sear strikes the half cock notch as the hammer falls it can damage the sear. That can happen with an improperly set adjustable trigger. Quite a few gunsmithing sources, including Kuhnhausen, warn about this and tell how to adjust to prevent it.

However, I don't see this as "using" that notch. To me using the notch would be simply pulling back on the hammer until it clicks. There really shouldn't be any reason for that to cause damage.

 

[Bummer]

Purple implied? Yes, it takes (some amount of time) to flick the safety, but it's happening in parallel with other actions, not in series.

Part of the flow of the draw.

 

[rgrimm01]

What is the "butterscotch" a reference to?

 

[JetGirl]

What is the "butterscotch" a reference to?

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pU2IOTEZlU[/ame]