2010 IN Legislation: SB 0025 Firearms in Locked Vehicles

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  • IUGradStudent

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    Firearms in Locked Vehicles is back for 2010.

    Senate Bill 0025

    Click "Latest Printing" to see the bill's current form.

    State Senator Johnny Nugent has submitted a bill similar to the one he introduced last year. This bill would allow anyone who can legally possess and carry a firearm to keep a firearm locked in his vehicle. Businesses and private persons could not prohibit this. There are a exceptions written into the bill for a few school-type facilities (schools, preschools, colleges), prisons, and anywhere prohibited by federal law.

    This bill would allow you to keep a gun in your car while parked at your place of employment, even if your employer does not allow you to carry while working.

    The bill has been assigned to the Committee on Corrections, Criminal, and Civil Matters. The members of that committee are M. Young R.M., Bray, Delph, Head, Waterman, Waltz, Hume R.M.M., Lanane, Tallian, Taylor.

    That committee passed a similar bill last year (actually the bill last year had fewer exceptions and thus was a "harder" bill to pass) and should pass it again this year. The senate is also almost certain to pass it as well.

    The challenge will come, again, in the House. Last year House Speaker Pat Bauer sent the bill to a committee that he was sure would kill it. I have every reason to expect he will do the same this year and that the bill will die in house committee. Once the bill passes out of the senate and is assigned to a house committee, we will post the names of the members of that committee so that you can tell them how you feel.

    My guess is that it will die in house committee regardless of how much pressure we bring. It will die every year, as will every pro-gun measure, until we replace Pat Bauer as the house speaker. The easiest way to do that is to vote enough Republican representatives into office that the Rs pick the speaker instead of the Ds. At that point, we will be able to pass almost gun legislation that we want. If you have a Democrat for a state rep, consider volunteering to help their Republican opponent get elected in 2010. That is probably the best thing you could do to see this bill, and similar ones, get passed during the next few years.
     
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    rambone

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    Good post. Lets keep an eye on this.

    Oh, and contact your State legislators and tell them what you think!!
     

    bigiron

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    It was Senator Johnny Nugent but hey...

    it sounds pretty nice with any Nuge at the wheel. ;)

    i caught it too. i died laughing when i first read it. although, if teddy was in our senate i would be pushing for a bid for 2012! maybe we can get teddy to move a little south and run for us one of these years!
     

    Scutter01

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    INDOT property -- There's a "no firearms" sign on the campus where I work.

    Signs have no force of law in Indiana. That might be corporate policy but that doesn't make it illegal. That said, cities can restrict carry on certain city-owned property. I'd be interested in how INDOT thinks they can restrict firearms on state-owned property.
     

    Indy317

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    There are a exceptions written into the bill for a few school-type facilities (schools, preschools, colleges), prisons, and anywhere prohibited by federal law.

    This bill would allow you to keep a gun in your car while parked at your place of employment, even if your employer does not allow you to carry while working.

    Typical of government over stepping their boundaries. Smoking bans, forcing guns be allowed on private property, etc.. When will it end? Oh, it won't. Too many "me, myself, and I" socialist with various political beliefs who are A-OK with socialism so long it benefits them.

    I love how everything government related is exempt. Typical. If anything, the business should get blanket immunity from any criminal and/or civil findings of wrongdoing. If taxpayers want this, taxpayers should be on the hook should a jury find a business was negligent in allowing a workplace shooting where one guy went out to his car, got his legal firearm, and went back in and shot the place up.
     

    rambone

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    If taxpayers want this, taxpayers should be on the hook should a jury find a business was negligent in allowing a workplace shooting where one guy went out to his car, got his legal firearm, and went back in and shot the place up.

    I think the business could avoid a negligence lawsuit by posting a sign that says "No Murder on Company Property."

    Seriously, what sign is going to stop a killer? :rolleyes: And why should a sign, or lack thereof, change whom the guilty party is?

    I don't know where you learned the law, but where I'm from, the murderer is the one who goes before the jury. Not the business owner.
     
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    IUGradStudent

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    It was Senator Johnny Nugent but hey...

    it sounds pretty nice with any Nuge at the wheel. ;)

    i caught it too. i died laughing when i first read it. although, if teddy was in our senate i would be pushing for a bid for 2012! maybe we can get teddy to move a little south and run for us one of these years!

    ummm.... LOL whoops. Fixed. Freudian slip or something.

    Typical of government over stepping their boundaries. Smoking bans, forcing guns be allowed on private property, etc.. When will it end? Oh, it won't. Too many "me, myself, and I" socialist with various political beliefs who are A-OK with socialism so long it benefits them.

    I love how everything government related is exempt. Typical.

    This is actually an excellent point. This is not an unambiguously pure bill. It I agree it would make far more sense to start with allowing carry on all state property (except for places secured by metal detectors and armed guards), and if at all, only secondarily private property. This does affect people's control of their property.

    If anything, the business should get blanket immunity from any criminal and/or civil findings of wrongdoing. If taxpayers want this, taxpayers should be on the hook should a jury find a business was negligent in allowing a workplace shooting where one guy went out to his car, got his legal firearm, and went back in and shot the place up.

    Here I find myself agreeing with Rambone. It ain't gonna happen. If they want to kill someone and their gun isn't in their car, they'll just bring it tomorrow.
     

    rvb

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    Something I've wondered about IN law since moving here....

    how are parking lots handled with regard to all other IN public law?

    Example: In some states the state and local law enforcement can enforce traffic regulations within parking lots... ie if parking lot has a stop sign, you can get pulled over for running it. Other states the state and local law enforcement has no juristiction in parking lots since it is private property. How does IN handle this?

    I'm asking because this precidence affects my opinion of such a bill. If the state already has juristiction to enforce public regulation in parking lots, then I am for this bill. If the property ownder retains all rights and responsibility for their parking lots, then I am against it.

    I'm sure my terminology such as "juristiction" etc is not necessarily correct, but hopefully my question is clear.

    -rvb
     

    antsi

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    The easiest way to do that is to vote enough Republican representatives into office that the Rs pick the speaker instead of the Ds.

    How far away is this goal? How many do we have to unseat?

    Who is up for re-election in divided districts and might be good targets?
     

    antsi

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    I love how everything government related is exempt.

    I agree that the government should have a higher standard of respecting individuals' rights than a private entity like a business. Constitutional rights are, after all, restrictions on what the government can do. So the government has least right of anyone to interfere with a citizen's right to carry.

    I don't agree with your characterization of attempts to protect RKBA from the cowardly CYA antics of employers' lawyers as socialist. There are numerous precedents for which rights an employer must respect and which rights an employer may interfere with. You may believe that the RKBA is a right that employers should be allowed to interfere with; if so, argue that point. Just throwing out the label "socialism" like kids calling each other names on the playground doesn't prove anything.

    Also, it is important to recognize that there are different kinds of "private property." A person's private home is certainly their private property. The parking lot of my employer... I'm not so sure. My employer is a hospital whose revenue is upwards of 80% derived from Medicare/Medicaid. Government agencies to a large degree set our policies and procedures through accreditation of health care facilities. We get special government grants to build new buildings and new additions to old ones. We get special roadwork and traffic planning from the government, free of charge. Our physician training programs are almost entirely paid for with taxpayer money. Seems to me that the hospital's claim to "private property rights" is specious. If you allow an almost entirely government-supported entity like a hospital to declare themselves "private property" and run roughshod over individual rights, then you have basically given the government a blank check to violate whatever rights they want to violate, simply by hiring a "private company" proxy to do the dirty work for them.
     

    IUGradStudent

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    How far away is this goal? How many do we have to unseat?

    According to the uber-accurate Wikipedia there are currently 52 Ds and 48 Rs. So, only a few away. If that is wrong, you'll have to sue me :D

    Who is up for re-election in divided districts and might be good targets?

    Every rep is up for reelection every 2 years. So, every rep is up for election in 2010.

    As far as target districts, I do not know (though I should). Google is probably your friend. Some places that might have links are hoosierpundit and frugal hoosiers.
     

    Hornett

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    This is great! A really good idea.

    But... I noticed that there is (again) an exception for schools.
    So if you go pick up your kids from school and have to go in to see the teacher, there is still NO LEGAL WAY to secure your gun.
    Great.:xmad:
     

    antsi

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    According to the uber-accurate Wikipedia there are currently 52 Ds and 48 Rs. So, only a few away. If that is wrong, you'll have to sue me :D



    Every rep is up for reelection every 2 years. So, every rep is up for election in 2010.

    As far as target districts, I do not know (though I should). Google is probably your friend. Some places that might have links are hoosierpundit and frugal hoosiers.

    I don't know enough about Indiana state politics - haven't been back here that long. Here's what I'm envisioning, though:
    Pick 10 democratic incumbents who will face a strong R challenger, or who are representing a district that has a large conservative or gun-owning constituency. Mount a concentrated INGO campaign to send donations to all the challengers. Send letters to all the incumbents that basically say, "nothing against you personally, but Bauer is a tool. I'm giving money to the other guys to get control of the House out of his hands."
    There's a chance this could help unseat a couple of D's and get Bauer out of the Speakership. If nothing else, it would at least let all those Democrat incumbents know that they are paying a price for putting an anti gun owner moron in the Speaker chair.

    Edited to add:
    Just emailed the State GOP. They should know where the close races are - Rs who need help, and Ds who are most "defeatable."
     
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    lashicoN

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    I'm a little confused about this bill. Does it make it lawful for a person to store a firearm in their vehicle even if they don't have a LTCH? Or does it simply give us LTCH holders the right to keep a firearm in our locked vehicle at our place of employment? If that is the case, is anyone here worried that maybe private businesses will start calling in to IN State Police inquiring if their interviewee has a LTCH before they offer him/her the job? It could result is us not getting a job, just because the business owner wants to go around this new bill...if it passes. You can't keep a firearm on the property if you don't get the job, afterall. I don't know how many business are that seriously anti-gun in IN, but it's something to think about.
     

    antsi

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    I'm a little confused about this bill. Does it make it lawful for a person to store a firearm in their vehicle even if they don't have a LTCH? Or does it simply give us LTCH holders the right to keep a firearm in our locked vehicle at our place of employment? If that is the case, is anyone here worried that maybe private businesses will start calling in to IN State Police inquiring if their interviewee has a LTCH before they offer him/her the job? It could result is us not getting a job, just because the business owner wants to go around this new bill...if it passes. You can't keep a firearm on the property if you don't get the job, afterall. I don't know how many business are that seriously anti-gun in IN, but it's something to think about.

    I don't think the business owners really care. There's no real principle of safety at stake here. They've been told by their lawyers that having such a policy could protect them from civil liability.n If their lawyers told them to make all employees tattoo the Obama logo on their backsides, they'd make that a company policy too. Nobody really thinks these policies actually accomplish anything.
     
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