.357 self defense ammunition

[BehindBlueI's]

Great information and insight, very much appreciated. i hadn`t even considered .38 Special, I guess I wanted a full .357 magnum load for stopping performance. My Python has adjustable sights, so that wouldn`t be an issue other than taking the time to adjust them for the bullet weight I settle on. I`m guessing the difference in impact for a .357 with sights adjusted for say a 158 grain round, would be significantly different for a 125 grain round.

It'll be different. How significant will depend on the exact loads of each, of course, and the range.

My opinion is that much of the vaunted 'stopping power' of the .357 Magnum is real but is psychological. Especially pre-flash suppressed powder. Physically, there's no reason it would vastly outclass any number of other duty rounds given tissue destroyed and other objective measurements when comparing similar bullet construction (hard cast to hard cast, HP to HP, etc). The generally...blastiness just makes it more disorienting and psychologically impactful. Since having that thought I've discoverd many others with exposure to real world revolver shootings, some over a couple of decades when revolvers were *the* gun, who've independently conjectured the same. It remains theory, though, given how difficult some sort of controlled test would be.

Given the blast works in both ways, that's why I suggest you prepare yourself to know what it feels like before it's relevant.

 

[Leadeye]

Firing a .357 indoors is one of those things you feel more than hear, because you won't hear much for a while after shooting. You won't see much if it was dark.

 

[mcapo]

While I won't begin to place my opinion as remotely equal to BBI's real depth of knowledge, I will say that a long long time ago I retired 357 mag from indoor SDfor 38.

Every self defense choice is a series of compromises and while 357 mag is probably my favorite handgun caliber, my self defense environment led me to 38. I have since moved to another platform but I won't digress further from the OP's topic.

 

[dbrier]

Tons of info here.

.38 Special and .357 Magnum Self-Defense Ammo Ballistics Test - LuckyGunner.com Labs

We conducted ballistics gelatin tests for 38 self-defense revolver loads in 38 Special and 357 Magnum. Here are the full results along with photos and video

www.luckygunner.com

 

[Trebor657]

The lighter & faster bullet vs heavier & slower bullet arguments have been beat to death in gun magazines and forums. There's no clear winner. The first assumption is hollow point bullets will open up in the target. Herein lies the problem ... they don't. Lighter & faster 125 gr bullets are more likely to open up, but statistics prove that doesn't always happen or expansion may happen prematurely. Heavier 158 gr bullets have more momentum and are more likely to create a deeper wound channel, even if they don't open up.

In winter 125 gr bullets tend to open prematurely when they hit winter clothing and do not perform as well. 158 gr bullets tend to punch through clothing and still penetrate well. Most ballistic experts agree ... 125 gr JHPs are best for summer or warm climates but 158 gr bullets are best for winter climates. There's a good compromise ... 140 gr JHPs. They have almost as much momentum as 158 gr bullets and almost as much velocity as 125 gr bullets. They also perform better from snubbies than either 125 or 158 gr bullets because they take advantage of combined weight, velocity, and momentum attributes. So ... if you want an "all season" bullet, the mid-weight 140 gr JHPs are an excellent choice.

 

[gregr]

Well, here`s a new twist, at least for me...

I just dug through my ammo box, and lo and behold, I found several boxes of Federal low recoil 130 grain .357 Magnum ammo. Something like 120 rounds! So. From the research I`ve done online, although admittedly, only cursory, it appears that the ballistic difference in .357 ammo, from 130 grain to the 158 grain I had my mind set on is relatively insignificant, I`ll adjust the sights on my Co;t Python for the 130 grain Federal Low Recoil loads I have.
Knowing that bullet weight is relatively objective as far as efficacy, I`m actually fine to use the 130 grain vs the 158 grain for carry purposes.
Now, I just need to get to my shooting range and go though the task of zeroing my new Colt Python and adjusting the sights from a bench.

 

[gregr]

Tons of info here.

.38 Special and .357 Magnum Self-Defense Ammo Ballistics Test - LuckyGunner.com Labs

We conducted ballistics gelatin tests for 38 self-defense revolver loads in 38 Special and 357 Magnum. Here are the full results along with photos and video

www.luckygunner.com

That is a TON of great information. Let me ask you this...based on those charts, would you use a lower bullet grain .357 magnum bullet on deer sized game?

 

[Bigtanker]

Is this a new product Colt?

 

[gregr]

Is this a new product Colt?

Yes sir. Brand new Stainless Steel Colt Python.

 

[gregr]

As I`m searching the internet for .357 130 grain ammo, it seems like this is not a common bullet weight. Perhaps I`d be better served to shoot this particular anno, but look also for the more apparently common 125 grain.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Well, here`s a new twist, at least for me...

I just dug through my ammo box, and lo and behold, I found several boxes of Federal low recoil 130 grain .357 Magnum ammo. Something like 120 rounds! So. From the research I`ve done online, although admittedly, only cursory, it appears that the ballistic difference in .357 ammo, from 130 grain to the 158 grain I had my mind set on is relatively insignificant, I`ll adjust the sights on my Co;t Python for the 130 grain Federal Low Recoil loads I have.
Knowing that bullet weight is relatively objective as far as efficacy, I`m actually fine to use the 130 grain vs the 158 grain for carry purposes.
Now, I just need to get to my shooting range and go though the task of zeroing my new Colt Python and adjusting the sights from a bench.

I think you'd likely be fine with those, but keep in mind they are not bonded and will shed the jacket, effectively making them lighter. IIRC, they mushroom pretty nicely but penetration was on the low side and they are definitely not barrier blind. So, not ideal but likely in 'good enough' territory.

Since your next post suggests you'll be looking for different ammo, I'd suggest taking a look at Gold Dot as it's bonded in both 125gr and 158gr. Availability may be spotty these days, though. Critical Duty often seems to be an easier one to come by, but I've not looked this year.

 

[gregr]

I think you'd likely be fine with those, but keep in mind they are not bonded and will shed the jacket, effectively making them lighter. IIRC, they mushroom pretty nicely but penetration was on the low side and they are definitely not barrier blind. So, not ideal but likely in 'good enough' territory.

Since your next post suggests you'll be looking for different ammo, I'd suggest taking a look at Gold Dot as it's bonded in both 125gr and 158gr. Availability may be spotty these days, though. Critical Duty often seems to be an easier one to come by, but I've not looked this year.

Again, thank you so much for your experience, knowledge and expertise. I`m thinking I may look hard for the Gold Dot 125 grain, and that will be so close to the 130 grain bullet weight, it ought not need any tweaking at the range.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Again, thank you so much for your experience, knowledge and expertise. I`m thinking I may look hard for the Gold Dot 125 grain, and that will be so close to the 130 grain bullet weight, it ought not need any tweaking at the range.

No problem.

Good luck on your search, all my normal places to look show it backordered so I won't be of any help there.

 

[gregr]

I think you'd likely be fine with those, but keep in mind they are not bonded and will shed the jacket, effectively making them lighter. IIRC, they mushroom pretty nicely but penetration was on the low side and they are definitely not barrier blind. So, not ideal but likely in 'good enough' territory.

Since your next post suggests you'll be looking for different ammo, I'd suggest taking a look at Gold Dot as it's bonded in both 125gr and 158gr. Availability may be spotty these days, though. Critical Duty often seems to be an easier one to come by, but I've not looked this year.

Incredibly, I also found a couple boxes each of Hornady Critical Defense 125 grin .357 ammo, and a couple boxes of Speer Gold Dot 125 grain. So I`m thinking anything I find in 125 grain out to be close to the same POI, but obviously Ill try to find some of one of those.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Incredibly, I also found a couple boxes each of Hornady Critical Defense 125 grin .357 ammo, and a couple boxes of Speer Gold Dot 125 grain. So I`m thinking anything I find in 125 grain out to be close to the same POI, but obviously Ill try to find some of one of those.

It's like an Easter egg hunt for revolver toting adults at your house.

 

[Squid556]

It was posted earlier but this is going to give you a lot of actual information. Not just anecdotal stories. Make what you will of it.

.38 Special and .357 Magnum Self-Defense Ammo Ballistics Test - LuckyGunner.com Labs

We conducted ballistics gelatin tests for 38 self-defense revolver loads in 38 Special and 357 Magnum. Here are the full results along with photos and video

www.luckygunner.com

For those who don’t want to bother with the link.


I think it’s important to note how critical barrel length is for this caliber.
Notice how they shoot the same load in both barrel lengths to illustrate. Specifically the 125 gold dot performs quite poorly in the snubbie. Put that same load in a 4 inch and now you really got something!

Then you see Speer realized this and created the 135 grain gold dot that bridges the gap and performs well in BOTH barrels.

 

[gregr]

It was posted earlier but this is going to give you a lot of actual information. Not just anecdotal stories. Make what you will of it.

.38 Special and .357 Magnum Self-Defense Ammo Ballistics Test - LuckyGunner.com Labs

We conducted ballistics gelatin tests for 38 self-defense revolver loads in 38 Special and 357 Magnum. Here are the full results along with photos and video

www.luckygunner.com

For those who don’t want to bother with the link.
View attachment 214833
View attachment 214834
I think it’s important to note how critical barrel length is for this caliber.
Notice how they shoot the same load in both barrel lengths to illustrate. Specifically the 125 gold dot performs quite poorly in the snubbie. Put that same load in a 4 inch and now you really got something!

Then you see Speer realized this and created the 135 grain gold dot that bridges the gap and performs well in BOTH barrels.

Just makes me so much happier that I got the 4.25" over the 3".

 

[Squid556]

Just makes me so much happier that I got the 4.25" over the 3".

Absolutely. With the magnum cartridge you really gotta give it some room to run. Snubbie should be left to 38+P in my opinion. A lot of those loads are designed to expand and the marginal speeds that 38 ever gets up to. The 357 has such a broad range of speeds. Especially when you load it in an 18 inch barrel! It would be difficult to produce a bullet that performs well at speeds as low as 900 in a snubbie all the way up to 2000 in a carbine.

 

[snapping turtle]

I still have federal hydro shock in my stockpile. Don’t know how old they are. Back in the day they were the gold standard in self defense rounds.

Boy today they are proud of them bullets nearly 2 buck each pop.

 

[gregr]

Absolutely. With the magnum cartridge you really gotta give it some room to run. Snubbie should be left to 38+P in my opinion. A lot of those loads are designed to expand and the marginal speeds that 38 ever gets up to. The 357 has such a broad range of speeds. Especially when you load it in an 18 inch barrel! It would be difficult to produce a bullet that performs well at speeds as low as 900 in a snubbie all the way up to 2000 in a carbine.

There is just so much knowledge and information here and it`s so great that you all share so freely.