445 supermag

[hammer24]

Anybody have any numbers (velocity, energy, trajectory) on this round out of a rifle barrel? Or just some experience with it? I'm kicking an idea around and trying to gather data before I get the reamer.

 

[rimfire_crazed]

Check with BFG (fireball168). He's done some extensive work with the 445sm

 

[phatgemi]

I don't have chrono to backup but my understanding is that you will see about a 3-4 hundred fps over the .44 mag. With same bullet and increased powder. I.E. both using 240 grain xtp. The .44 would use about 23.5 grains of H110 and the .445 using about 32 grains of H110. Nothing official and your mileage would vary of course. But you could easily see loads approaching a bit over 2000 fps. In addition to the 240 grain xtp, the .445 likes hornandy 265 grainers.

Besides after reaming you can still shoot the .44 loads. Do it!

 

[jy951]

I think you should be able to get 2100-2200 fps from a 240gr bullet. Just make sure you stock up on brass whiles it's available if you decide to move forward with this.

 

[Broom_jm]

Even with a 24" tube, I think 2,200fps is a mite optimistic. Still, you should be able to get 2,000fps with little trouble...and that's a lot of speed from such a heavy pill. The problem is that you're still shooting a bullet with a fairly poor BC, so it just plain hits a wall, in terms of trajectory. I shoot a 358GNR, which is the 445SM case necked down, and it has better velocity and trajectory, while still carrying plenty of bullet weight and energy to kill a deer at 250 yards. The rainbow-like trajectory of the .429" 240gr bullet means that even if you sight in 3" high at 100 yards, you're going to be over 15" low at 250. Plus, it will kick a lot more. At 200 yards or less, that heavier bullet will hit with a lot of authority, though!

It's too bad Winchester doesn't make WW680 powder anymore. That stuff was awesome for the 445, and would be dyn-o-MITE in several of the smaller 35 caliber 'cats we play with today.

 

[phatgemi]

Even with a 24" tube, I think 2,200fps is a mite optimistic. Still, you should be able to get 2,000fps with little trouble...and that's a lot of speed from such a heavy pill. The problem is that you're still shooting a bullet with a fairly poor BC, so it just plain hits a wall, in terms of trajectory. I shoot a 358GNR, which is the 445SM case necked down, and it has better velocity and trajectory, while still carrying plenty of bullet weight and energy to kill a deer at 250 yards. The rainbow-like trajectory of the .429" 240gr bullet means that even if you sight in 3" high at 100 yards, you're going to be over 15" low at 250. Plus, it will kick a lot more. At 200 yards or less, that heavier bullet will hit with a lot of authority, though!

It's too bad Winchester doesn't make WW680 powder anymore. That stuff was awesome for the 445, and would be dyn-o-MITE in several of the smaller 35 caliber 'cats we play with today.

Not going to argue a bit with your rationale. All good points. But for me personally, it all boils down to the magical $$. The .445 platform is a cheap (relatively) NEF handi rifle and it works great. Heck for that matter, a plain jane .44 or 357 would work great. I am a simple deer hunter, not that well healed and I just can't justify spending the money to jump into the wildcat area. Understand the greater range they offer but for most shots, I just never need a 250 yard rifle.

I envy guys who can afford the expensive rifles and realize that there is a lot of work, time, money involved in development. Thats what makes shooting great. I just can't join the fraternity. I am sure there are many out there like me.

Now what could be done to make a handi rifle into a long range hunting machine???

 

[jy951]

If you're set on a handi, I'd get a .357 and ream the chamber to .357 max. If you want a 445 supermag, I'd buy a CVA scout 44 mag and ream to supermag. The scout has a 1:20 twist rate which is alot better than the Handi 44 mag twist rate of 1:38 iirc.

 

[Skip]

It's too bad Winchester doesn't make WW680 powder anymore. That stuff was awesome for the 445, and would be dyn-o-MITE in several of the smaller 35 caliber 'cats we play with today.

This may be an option for you:

WC680 Original application is for the 7.62x39mm "AK-47" round. This is a ball
powder, which can be loaded using AA1680 data.
This is new ball powder.
$100/8# jug.

That is from gibrass.com. I have dealt with Jeff Bartlett before and he is top notch. The other thing to notice is that the WC680 can use AA1680 data. That MAY mean the WW680 and AA1680 may be pretty similar and it would work in the 445.

Just a thought.