Fair warning. Full length Squid spiel, so ya may want some coffee and popcorn .
Without a doubt, when talking AR calibers it seems everyone has their own take on “everything wrong with 5.56”. Doesn’t seem that long ago but around 2003 the 6.8 Remington Special Purpose and 6.5 Grendel cartridges came out as solutions to upgrade short action AR15 ballistics.
5.56 NATO / 6.5 Grendel / 6.8 SPC
I thought since so much time has passed it would be interesting to see just how the market has embraced these cartridges now that we are out of the fad phase.
Before I get to that I want to touch on what these rounds even are for the uninitiated.
6.8 SPC / .300 Blackout / 7.62x39
The 6.8 SPCs story starts like all good stories. Apparently some folks had no clue about how intermediate cartridges work… then were surprised that 5.56, at long range, wasn’t some Call of Duty insta-kill (Squids paraphrase)… so in a joint venture between Remington and the US Army they set out to create a longer range harder hitting round that still fit in an M4 carbine. They ended up with with a .277 diameter, 115 grain bullet doing around 2800 fps and it was glorious….. but later downloaded to around 2500 fps due to Remington, once again, dropping the ball.
So now folks are up to speed on our 6.8 , I can bring the uninitiated up to speed on 6.5 Grendel.
6.5 Grendel / 6.5 Creedmoor / 7.62x39
Again same time period and goal, gunsmith Bill Alexander and Lapua work together to stretch the most distance out of the AR15. In a slightly less foolheared endeavor they create this gem of a cartridge. .264 diameter bullet, 123 grains, at 2600 fps although its usually loaded down to 2400 fps. I’m not sure who to blame for this, but feel free to blame Remington since they are already the bad guy in the story.
——————————————————
So now that everyone is on the same page….. these both were designed with the same goals in mind. Let’s look at how they compare, and where they ended up now 20 years later.
Comparing apples to apples, from the same premium manufacturer, this is what I’ve found. I’ve provided data for as far as you SHOULD be using intermediate cartridges… and nearly MAX range.
Nosler Custom Competition
- 6.8 SPC 115 gr
300 yds, 1120 ft/lb energy, 1.5 foot drop
700 yds, 380 ft/lb energy, 16 foot drop
Nosler Custom Competition
- 6.5 Grendel 123 gr
300 yds, 1000 ft/lb energy, 1.5 foot drop
700 yds, 530 ft/lb energy, 15 foot drop
You can see how similar they are in their performance. 6.5 of course being the better round 500 yards +. Both of these rounds are a fair shake better than 5.56 at range so they accomplished their goal, but what did the market do with them now that they have been around a while?
—————————————————
I searched several places to get a feel for how popular and who’s using these rounds as of 2023
Ammoseek search engine shows 150 listings for 6.8 SPC ammo, while showing 300+ listings for 6.5 Grendel ammo.
Gunbroker shows around 300 listings for 6.8 SPC rifles, while listing 800 6.5 Grendel rifles.
Lipseys wholesaler shows 6 rifles in 6.8 SPC, while showing 17 rifles in 6.5 Grendel
Palmetto State Armory and Bear Creek Arsenal both show ZERO 6.8 rifles or uppers, and have on average about 20 uppers and rifle for 6.5 Grendel.
6.8 SPC has been picked up by LWRC and modernized into a really great rifle they call the Six8 A5. Even has optimized proprietary Magpul magazines. Wilson Combat also has several high end 6.8 rifles to sell.
wilsoncombat.com
————————————————
Suffice it to say, the 6.8 is declining in popularity but seems to have some better uses as an actual intermediate cartridge in a military context than the Grendel. It performs much better in short barrels, brass is cheaper to make, stacks better in magazines too. Allegedly Jordan and Saudi Arabia actually purchased 6.8 in large quantities so that and hog hunters are what’s keeping this one going.
6.5 Grendel seems to have found its niche in the long range target shooting community. Cost seems to stay high on ammo although there is steel case wolf out there for now anyway. It stacks kinda crappy in large AR mags but has found some new life in AK mags and rifles. So much so that Serbia has been testing and fielding them in Zastava rifles allegedly.
——————————————————
In conclusion, both rounds have their fans and critics. In a horrible plot twist I like both equally but identify as a 5.56 guy! (At least in a military context). With how inexpensive AR uppers have gotten, I encourage people to buy and try new old rounds and see how they actually do on the range and hunting.
Anyway hope you enjoyed my research project for the night. Share it if you did. Looking forward to hearing your SPC and Grendel stories down below.
Without a doubt, when talking AR calibers it seems everyone has their own take on “everything wrong with 5.56”. Doesn’t seem that long ago but around 2003 the 6.8 Remington Special Purpose and 6.5 Grendel cartridges came out as solutions to upgrade short action AR15 ballistics.
5.56 NATO / 6.5 Grendel / 6.8 SPC
I thought since so much time has passed it would be interesting to see just how the market has embraced these cartridges now that we are out of the fad phase.
Before I get to that I want to touch on what these rounds even are for the uninitiated.
6.8 SPC / .300 Blackout / 7.62x39
The 6.8 SPCs story starts like all good stories. Apparently some folks had no clue about how intermediate cartridges work… then were surprised that 5.56, at long range, wasn’t some Call of Duty insta-kill (Squids paraphrase)… so in a joint venture between Remington and the US Army they set out to create a longer range harder hitting round that still fit in an M4 carbine. They ended up with with a .277 diameter, 115 grain bullet doing around 2800 fps and it was glorious….. but later downloaded to around 2500 fps due to Remington, once again, dropping the ball.
So now folks are up to speed on our 6.8 , I can bring the uninitiated up to speed on 6.5 Grendel.
6.5 Grendel / 6.5 Creedmoor / 7.62x39
Again same time period and goal, gunsmith Bill Alexander and Lapua work together to stretch the most distance out of the AR15. In a slightly less foolheared endeavor they create this gem of a cartridge. .264 diameter bullet, 123 grains, at 2600 fps although its usually loaded down to 2400 fps. I’m not sure who to blame for this, but feel free to blame Remington since they are already the bad guy in the story.
——————————————————
So now that everyone is on the same page….. these both were designed with the same goals in mind. Let’s look at how they compare, and where they ended up now 20 years later.
Comparing apples to apples, from the same premium manufacturer, this is what I’ve found. I’ve provided data for as far as you SHOULD be using intermediate cartridges… and nearly MAX range.
Nosler Custom Competition
- 6.8 SPC 115 gr
300 yds, 1120 ft/lb energy, 1.5 foot drop
700 yds, 380 ft/lb energy, 16 foot drop
Nosler Custom Competition
- 6.5 Grendel 123 gr
300 yds, 1000 ft/lb energy, 1.5 foot drop
700 yds, 530 ft/lb energy, 15 foot drop
You can see how similar they are in their performance. 6.5 of course being the better round 500 yards +. Both of these rounds are a fair shake better than 5.56 at range so they accomplished their goal, but what did the market do with them now that they have been around a while?
—————————————————
I searched several places to get a feel for how popular and who’s using these rounds as of 2023
Ammoseek search engine shows 150 listings for 6.8 SPC ammo, while showing 300+ listings for 6.5 Grendel ammo.
Gunbroker shows around 300 listings for 6.8 SPC rifles, while listing 800 6.5 Grendel rifles.
Lipseys wholesaler shows 6 rifles in 6.8 SPC, while showing 17 rifles in 6.5 Grendel
Palmetto State Armory and Bear Creek Arsenal both show ZERO 6.8 rifles or uppers, and have on average about 20 uppers and rifle for 6.5 Grendel.
6.8 SPC has been picked up by LWRC and modernized into a really great rifle they call the Six8 A5. Even has optimized proprietary Magpul magazines. Wilson Combat also has several high end 6.8 rifles to sell.
6.8mm SPC AR-15 Rifles - Wilson Combat
Wilson Combat AR15 rifles chambered in 6.8mm SPC - an ideal hunting round for medium to heavy game and turns the AR into a serious hunting rifle.
wilsoncombat.com
————————————————
Suffice it to say, the 6.8 is declining in popularity but seems to have some better uses as an actual intermediate cartridge in a military context than the Grendel. It performs much better in short barrels, brass is cheaper to make, stacks better in magazines too. Allegedly Jordan and Saudi Arabia actually purchased 6.8 in large quantities so that and hog hunters are what’s keeping this one going.
6.5 Grendel seems to have found its niche in the long range target shooting community. Cost seems to stay high on ammo although there is steel case wolf out there for now anyway. It stacks kinda crappy in large AR mags but has found some new life in AK mags and rifles. So much so that Serbia has been testing and fielding them in Zastava rifles allegedly.
——————————————————
In conclusion, both rounds have their fans and critics. In a horrible plot twist I like both equally but identify as a 5.56 guy! (At least in a military context). With how inexpensive AR uppers have gotten, I encourage people to buy and try new old rounds and see how they actually do on the range and hunting.
Anyway hope you enjoyed my research project for the night. Share it if you did. Looking forward to hearing your SPC and Grendel stories down below.
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