Advice - tactical shotguns for home defense

[level0]

Folks, I'm in the market for a home defense shotgun. I have a 20 gauge Winchester pump that was my granddad's, I love it but it's built for hunting. No doubt it will do the trick in a home defense situation, but I am looking for something purpose built. A little rambling now and then questions:

I recently shot my buddy's Linberta tactical autoloading 12 gauge. It was pretty sweet, ate everything we put into it. Not sure that's the one I want, the truth is I'm not the biggest Bud's guy and that brand seems to be exclusive to Bud's. If the Linberta shakes out to the best value I'll do it, but not starting there.

I really want a 20 gauge so my kids (and my shoulder) can practice, practice, practice. 20 gauge delivers plenty of damage and is easier for most people to shoot relative to a 12 gauge. My daughter is 5'4 and a 12 gauge is just too much for her. My shoulder could do without the punishment of a 12 gauge after about 15 minutes of shooting. My son is a big hoss and could probably wield dual 12 gauges, but that's another thread.

On the other hand, 12 gauge ammo is everywhere in every imaginable load for every imaginable purpose. Home defense situations aren't likely to last 15 minutes.

I've settled on wanting an autoloader, but will be talked into a pump if the argument is persuasive.

I've been looking at the Weatherby SA-459, model SA4592019PGM, UPC 747115420032. Pretty well reviewed and the price is right, I've seen them for $359 at CTD.

Also looking at the Mossberg SA-20, model 75780, UPC 884110757807. That Mossberg name is nice, and this model is also pretty well reviewed.

Questions:

What can I do to a 12 gauge to make it shoot softer? I would not expect my daughter to practice with a "normal" 12 gauge, one shot and she'll be done and may never pick it up again. I don't know much about reduced recoil rounds with regard to home defense, and have no insight to different felt recoil reducing pads that may be available.

Can anyone recommend an autoloading, tactical (read: pistol grip), 20 gauge for home defense?

Any general thoughts are also welcome.

 

[SSGSAD]

JMHO, I reccomend a pump ..... If the semi auto fails, what do you do ????? Fumble for that LITTLE lever, in the dark ?????

With a pump, pull the trigger, pump, and REPEAT !!!!!

20 Ga., is fine.... just about anywhere you find 12 ga., you can find 20 ... I also use BIRD SHOT, in the house.....

LESS chance of over penetration .... harming kids, etc.....

do what YOU want ..... I am NOT an expert ....

 

[chezuki]

Brace for the wild and outlandish theorys on best HD shotgun/loads.

Whatever you choose, get some training. Pump or autoloader, learn how it patterns and penetrates with various ammo. Learn to reload it on the move and from cover/concealment. Learn and practice clearing malfunctions and bringing the gun back into the fight. THEN you can make an informed decision.


Because of this, my HD gun is a carbine.

 

[451_Detonics]

There are pros and cons to everything. I have seen many people short stroke a pump in the pressures of competition, I would imagine a home invasion would be at least as stressful. A semi auto does eat up part of the recoil impulse in cycling, a 12ga 1100 has noticeably less felt recoil than a 12ga 870. Same can be said of 20 gauge guns of both designs.

My soon to be wife needed a shotgun she could shoot for competitions and after looking around I ended up getting her a 20 gauge youth stocked Hatson Escort. I added a Benelli Nova extension tube to give her 7+1 rounds on board. This shotgun is made in Turkey and is very nicely made. So far we have about 400 rounds through it without a malfunction, rounds a mix of shotshells and Rio buck. Mary can handle the recoil quite well and shoots the shotgun very well and I don't mind the short stock that much myself. Mary is 5 foot nothing and about 110 btw.

 

[9mmfan]

I have a Mossberg 590a1 with an 18" barrel and ghost sights. 12 guage. I'm a wimp on recoil and put a recoil reducing pad on it.

 

[EvilElmo]

I went with a Mossberg 930 (semi-auto 12ga). A Nordic Components +2 tube extension brings it just shy of the 18" barrel, giving me 7+1 (8+1 if you load one on the carrier). Then I added some velcro to the side of the receiver and slapped one of these on it as an easily removable/replaceable shell carrier that doesn't require replacing screws or modifying the receiver in any way:
Esstac Shotgun Card

 

[bigelowe]

Ive been looking for a home defense shotgun myself. I am also torn between 12 or 20, pump or semi. It changes everytime i go to look at them. Sorry couldnt help in your decision, but at least you know you arent alone. I need to just bite the bullitt and live with my decision

 

[TWalker]

As far as recoil my versa max is a very soft shooting 12ga. not sure on your budget. I've shot a few autoloaders and generally they were softer shooting than pump, double barrels I've shot except a Franchi 12ga, it's recoil was rough.

I think I agree with the previous buy a youth model if it works as a family shotgun as well. Plus it's easier to maneuver. My 22" barrel VersaMax isn't the friendliest thing to clear a house with.

 

[Small's]

remington 870 in your flavor with an 18" barrel or a mossberg 590a1 18" / mossberg 500. A good auto loader will cost you alot more money. Best two pump guns you can buy for the money. You could buy a short barrel for your gun

 

[M67]

JMHO, I reccomend a pump ..... If the semi auto fails, what do you do ????? Fumble foe that LITTLE lever, in the dark ?????

With a pump, pull the trigger, pump, and REPEAT !!!!!

What is the shell fails to eject? Shell stop comes unstaked and throws the timing off or doesn't allow the next shell to pop from the magazine tube?


Any gun can fail, pump, semi auto, single shot, etc.

Just get a gun that fits you and you feel comfortable with, then shoot it and make sure it'll function.

 

[Bfish]

A lot of guys and very smart people at that will tell you a 20 gage pump is what you want for a home defense gun. It also solves your how do I get a 12 gage to recoil less issue. Buck shot or slugs IMO is the way to go. Practice with birdshot. One piece of advice I'd give is to stay away from pistol grips on shotguns oh and get a light for it. If I could have anything I'd have a 12gage benelli with an extended (8 round?) tube. But that's some money!

I recommend just what chezuki says and that is to get some training.

Heck a lot of places will supply you with a shotgun for training and after training you will have a good idea of what you want and need. It will also save you a lot of money by not buying something you find out that you don't want or need after you get trained up on how to use a shotgun... So it's money well spent twice!

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Shotguns. The keys are manipulation of the safety and reloading.

I'd want a light and I use a sling. I want ammo on the gun, side saddle or a butt cuff.

I like the 870 but that's what I grew up with. Training with one for several decades.

Gun does not matter. Your time with the gun matters.

What can I do to a 12 gauge to make it shoot softer?

Hold it properly. It's just a shotgun, not a 20mm. Oh, make sure the stupid gun fits. So many of the American guns have stupid long lengths of pull.

That's why Cledus or Jimmy Lee always cycle the action at their waist in the Hill of Geese. Most guns are made for people with 15" forearms. You don't have that. Cut that buttstock down properly.

Strong elbow up (contact is control), support elbow down, thumb on the same side as your trigger finger so it does not smack your nose, suck it in tight, breath correctly.

I don't know much about reduced recoil rounds with regard to home defense, and have no insight to different felt recoil reducing pads that may be available.

The Hornady TAP loads are pretty rocking. It does not matter. Whatever you get, go pattern it for the load you want.

Shotguns are very subjective (sorry, it's true). Not all guns like the same loads.

I recently shot my buddy's Linberta tactical autoloading 12 gauge. It was pretty sweet, ate everything we put into it.

Did it now? Never shot one.

Did you shoot it supine? Many of the Tactical Timmy guns will not run once you get out of range stances. Try it seated, prone and supine, especially if you are bantam weight or below.

 

[bwframe]

[video=youtube;-NSLxxDWpOI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-NSLxxDWpOI[/video]

 

[Kirk Freeman]

In the video that bwframe posted, the Tactical Timmy gun (which is owned by Clint's mother-in-law) will not run once Clint leaves his feet. Clint is tall and lanky and could not bring his self-described "hummingbird ass" behind the gun enough to create counter-push for the weapon to operate.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Pumps and semi-autos both have trade offs. For me, the pump has fewer and they are less likely to matter to me. So, pump. 12g vs 20g, again, pro's and con's to both. In the end, it's not likely one will fail where the other succeeded or vice versa. I use 12g because that's what I have. If I had a 20g, that's what I'd use. Don't care.

Figure out if you want a night sight. I just use a bead on pedestal because in the backlight from the weapon mounted light it works just fine. Weapon mounted light. I want to be able to ID a target, there are tactical advantages to bright light in attacker's face, and I can't figure out a better way to manage a light than to have it built into the forend.

Reloads, I don't care. Find me a home invasion that wasn't resolved one way or the other in 6 rounds of buckshot and I may change my mind.

Buckshot. Preferably plated buckshot. I've seen plenty o' thugs with birdshot injuries, some close enough to have powder burns, and they were not impressive wounds. Pain compliance, the psychological impact of the noise, flash, and pain may certainly allow you to prevail. Failing that, though, you're unlikely to have created enough wound to physically put someone down fast.

I like shotguns. Shotguns are good. Shotguns are your friend.

 

[churchmouse]

There are 2 in my home.
-Benelli Nova Pump in 12G. chambered for up to 3 1/2" shells. This gives us a very wide variety of shell options. the 3 1/2" shells will set you on your heels if you are not ready for the recoil

-930 Mossberg auto loader. We have ran a variety of loads/shells through it and not 1 failure.
We load both with 3" Remington Nitro steel.
Both have lights.

Pick your poison but pick it wisely. Pick your loads the same way.

 

[level0]

Thanks all for your insight and opinions, just what I wanted. I need to do some thinking and some handling at my local shops. Forend light, now that's something I hadn't thought about at all.

 

[churchmouse]

Thanks all for your insight and opinions, just what I wanted. I need to do some thinking and some handling at my local shops. Forend light, now that's something I hadn't thought about at all.

If you are engaging an intruder in the dark and put 400 lumens on him his eyes will near melt. Not literally but man it can be painful. That gives you the advantage.

Having flashed myself in the dark with a 300 Lumen Tlr-1 I can attest to the pain involved. We have since upgraded to over 400 on the HD shotguns Carbine and the pistols.
My handheld light packs 680 on fresh battery's.

 

[Sniper 79]

I also dig the 20ga a lot better than 12ga. Sold them all off and now only have the one 20ga pump. I like the Benelli Nova or a Rem 870.

Not my first choice for home defense. Good tool to keep around though.

 

[whiteoak]

Under high stress my bet on 99.9% reliability would be on a gas operated semi auto. Years ago when I went through the Indiana Law Enforcement Academy. I quizzed the range master Col, Weitzel (Who later became Superintendent of the ISP about shotguns) Because at the time I had a small gun shop and was just interested on the guns that went through the course. He told me that the auto's were more reliable under stress due to the recruits short stroking the guns. Now a lot of these guys and galls did not have a lot of experience with shotguns, and I am sure that was a key factor. However the auto's are harder to load and from empty, it takes more practice to come over the top drop in a round, and hit the bolt release then it does to just push the pump forward. The Benelli and various other brands were not on the market when I was there so I cant speak to the recoil impulse guns. But those range officers saw thousands of guns in use each year, and I trusted their observations.
By the way I was also told that the Mossberg 500 held up better then the Rem 870's at that time, due to the action rods breaking at the forend tube on the 870's. So I was not to surprised when the 590 was adopted for the Military over the 870 a few years later. Just my 2 cents...