I don't know if this will be of much interest to people. This post is mostly aimed at the recreational grapplers who are also interested in the ability to apply their skills in a self-defense context. Basically, I've been shifting my focus to foot sweeps and trips as my primary takedown methodology for grappling because I think they are a better fit for self-defense. I wanted to see if anyone else is of a similar mindset, or is putting any time into them, or has any thoughts.
It seems to be pretty well recognized in the serious self-defense community that standing clinch/grappling skills are important. Many unarmed fights may start with striking but quickly crash together and devolve into some kind of attachment. Close distance fights with weapons require achieving some attachment to the weapon or the limb holding it. Trainers are applying various wrestling or grappling skills to these problems. Craig Douglas, just as an example, focuses a considerable amount of his course work on using wrestling ties (underhooks, overhooks, inside ties, and wrist ties) to control limbs in the clinch. Other trainers teach various two on one attachments (baseball bat grip, Russian tie, etc) as the initial basis for controlling weapons or initiating disarms.
I haven't seen many trainers seriously teaching or advocating for any kind of takedowns or takedown system in their courses. I am not familiar with everyone's approach. So there probably are. If so, hopefully you guys can point me to them. If there aren't, it's probably for good reason. They are not something you can easily learn and apply inside of a weekend seminar. There are also good reasons to avoid many takedown techniques in "the streets". Most wrestling-based takedowns involve giving up control of the arms to control the legs or hips. They may require level changing and potentially ending up underneath the opponent, or at the least, going to the ground with them. Judo and Greco style throws are powerful and can leave you standing, but many require you to turn your back to the opponent and/or have the potential to be rolled through if/when you hit the ground. They are high reward but also high risk.
That said, I think there is a significant advantage in having the option to take someone to the ground. I think foot sweeps may be a good, low risk answer. Foot sweeps and trips can be used from pretty much any upper body tie up position. They are very likely to leave you standing or on top when the opponent hits the ground. They can be attempted without giving up any limb control. When they fail, they are unlikely to put you in a bad position. Even when they don't work, they can off-balance the opponent and create openings for other things (like improving grips, improving position, etc). Pretty much every grappling style I'm aware of has some kind of trips and foot sweeps. Judo, Wrestling, Sambo, Muay Thai all have great foot sweeps and trips.
The main downside is they are a very difficult skill to learn. A good foot sweep or trip requires great timing and a good sense of the opponent's balance. It could take many hours of dedicated practice to be able to hit them reliably. So, they are not for the person who is going to a weekend seminar a couple of times a year. I think they may be a good area of focus for someone who is at Judo, BJJ, Sambo, or Wrestling class multiple times a week. You're going to be working on some kind of takedowns anyway. We have people over in the drills of the week thread who spend many hours a week perfecting their sub 1 second draw to first shot, their A Zone head shots at 15 yards on the timer, and their reload times. Foot sweeps are probably in that kind of ballpark in terms of time commitment to reward ratio. But for the person already committed to grappling? Maybe it's a worthwhile pursuit. What do you all think?
I have a long way to go to be hitting them at a high percentage but I'm starting to put some time into it and they are improving. Could I hit one in the street under stress? I don't know. I don't think it would put me in a bad position to try it.
Some video examples:
It seems to be pretty well recognized in the serious self-defense community that standing clinch/grappling skills are important. Many unarmed fights may start with striking but quickly crash together and devolve into some kind of attachment. Close distance fights with weapons require achieving some attachment to the weapon or the limb holding it. Trainers are applying various wrestling or grappling skills to these problems. Craig Douglas, just as an example, focuses a considerable amount of his course work on using wrestling ties (underhooks, overhooks, inside ties, and wrist ties) to control limbs in the clinch. Other trainers teach various two on one attachments (baseball bat grip, Russian tie, etc) as the initial basis for controlling weapons or initiating disarms.
I haven't seen many trainers seriously teaching or advocating for any kind of takedowns or takedown system in their courses. I am not familiar with everyone's approach. So there probably are. If so, hopefully you guys can point me to them. If there aren't, it's probably for good reason. They are not something you can easily learn and apply inside of a weekend seminar. There are also good reasons to avoid many takedown techniques in "the streets". Most wrestling-based takedowns involve giving up control of the arms to control the legs or hips. They may require level changing and potentially ending up underneath the opponent, or at the least, going to the ground with them. Judo and Greco style throws are powerful and can leave you standing, but many require you to turn your back to the opponent and/or have the potential to be rolled through if/when you hit the ground. They are high reward but also high risk.
That said, I think there is a significant advantage in having the option to take someone to the ground. I think foot sweeps may be a good, low risk answer. Foot sweeps and trips can be used from pretty much any upper body tie up position. They are very likely to leave you standing or on top when the opponent hits the ground. They can be attempted without giving up any limb control. When they fail, they are unlikely to put you in a bad position. Even when they don't work, they can off-balance the opponent and create openings for other things (like improving grips, improving position, etc). Pretty much every grappling style I'm aware of has some kind of trips and foot sweeps. Judo, Wrestling, Sambo, Muay Thai all have great foot sweeps and trips.
The main downside is they are a very difficult skill to learn. A good foot sweep or trip requires great timing and a good sense of the opponent's balance. It could take many hours of dedicated practice to be able to hit them reliably. So, they are not for the person who is going to a weekend seminar a couple of times a year. I think they may be a good area of focus for someone who is at Judo, BJJ, Sambo, or Wrestling class multiple times a week. You're going to be working on some kind of takedowns anyway. We have people over in the drills of the week thread who spend many hours a week perfecting their sub 1 second draw to first shot, their A Zone head shots at 15 yards on the timer, and their reload times. Foot sweeps are probably in that kind of ballpark in terms of time commitment to reward ratio. But for the person already committed to grappling? Maybe it's a worthwhile pursuit. What do you all think?
I have a long way to go to be hitting them at a high percentage but I'm starting to put some time into it and they are improving. Could I hit one in the street under stress? I don't know. I don't think it would put me in a bad position to try it.
Some video examples:
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