HALF OF OFFICERS SHOT IN 2013 WERE KILLED BY PEOPLE BARRED FROM GUN POSSESSION

[maver1ck]

FBI stats show that 26 police officers were shot and killed with guns in 2013. Of these, half were killed by people who were completely barred from gun possession. More on store here. Half of Officers Killed by People Barred from Gun Possession

 

[HoughMade]

sssssssssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhocking

 

[TaunTaun]

But...but...but....imagine how many dead would be littering the streets if background checks WEREN'T there! We saved thousands! The police themselves often say that OC'ers are the first targeted...

 

[Alpo]

So, 26 officers killed by firearms. Hardly a reason for all the fear tactics to justify MRAP acquisitions.

 

[TaunTaun]

So, 26 officers killed by firearms. Hardly a reason for all the fear tactics to justify MRAP acquisitions.

Well those green tip AP's scare them...

 

[chipbennett]

So, barring people from possessing firearms is really effective, eh? It's almost as if laws have little deterrent effect for criminals...

 

[ArcadiaGP]

I'm more surprised that 13 of these were people not barred from gun possession? I didn't read the whole story, but I'm guessing it just meant they could possess, but didn't necessarily?

Essentially: normal, non-criminal people?

In that case, wouldn't the moment they illegally obtained a firearm and shot at an officer, they were immediately criminals and barred from gun possession?

I dunno, the story feels like a stretch

 

[Alpo]

Not to get too hung up on the topic and look like a Kirk fan-boy, 4 of the deaths were in tactical assault situations, which would normally be where an MRAP would be used. Running the math, that would be approximately 5/1000 % probability of an officer mortality as a result of a tactical assault situation. With 600 MRAPs in communities at $600,000 per, that is----well, let's just say it is very expensive protection. Ordinary accidental death rates are higher than this.

You can't roller skate in a buffalo herd.

 

[JollyMon]

 

[JettaKnight]

I'm more surprised that 13 of these were people not barred from gun possession? I didn't read the whole story, but I'm guessing it just meant they could possess, but didn't necessarily?

Essentially: normal, non-criminal people?

That's my feeling too. So 13 officers were shot by people with no felony records?



Ah, 26 is a really low sample size to draw conclusions.

 

[MPD742]

So, barring people from possessing firearms is really effective, eh? It's almost as if laws have little deterrent effect for criminals...

Agreed.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Not to get too hung up on the topic and look like a Kirk fan-boy, 4 of the deaths were in tactical assault situations, which would normally be where an MRAP would be used. Running the math, that would be approximately 5/1000 % probability of an officer mortality as a result of a tactical assault situation. With 600 MRAPs in communities at $600,000 per, that is----well, let's just say it is very expensive protection. Ordinary accidental death rates are higher than this.

You can't roller skate in a buffalo herd.

What community paid $600k for an MRAP? The MRAPs are already paid for. That's sunk costs and it doesn't matter if a PD uses them or they are dropped to the bottom of the ocean, that cost is already paid.

What are the numbers for officers shot who survived and officers shot at but missed? Perhaps things like body armor, the presence of tactical teams, etc, helps keep these numbers as low as they are?

 

[Denny347]

What community paid $600k for an MRAP? The MRAPs are already paid for. That's sunk costs and it doesn't matter if a PD uses them or they are dropped to the bottom of the ocean, that cost is already paid.

What are the numbers for officers shot who survived and officers shot at but missed? Perhaps things like body armor, the presence of tactical teams, etc, helps keep these numbers as low as they are?

I know that in the 18yrs as an LEO in Indianapolis (here and my previous PD) there have been 6-10 instances in this city, that I recall, that armor was life saving. There might be more but that is all I can remember off the top of my head. Several of my friends are alive because of their protection.

 

[Leadeye]

Some years back I posted on the futility of expecting gun laws to have any positive affect when a convicted career criminal buys a hand gun from another convicted career criminal with illegal drug and used it to shoot a police officer. For all the good they do you could probably erase every gun law from the books and get no change.

 

[Tanfodude]

I'm curious what the other half is.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Some years back I posted on the futility of expecting gun laws to have any positive affect when a convicted career criminal buys a hand gun from another convicted career criminal with illegal drug and used it to shoot a police officer. For all the good they do you could probably erase every gun law from the books and get no change.

Well, here's the issue. How many serious violent felons got caught with a gun before they killed anyone with it and then went to prison, preventing them from murdering anyone for how many ever years? The answer is...I have no idea. It's easy to argue the law isn't having any effect, but let's also remember that we can't judge that based solely on the failures. Murder is against the law, too. Yet some people murder. Many others do not, though, even if they were inclined to do so because they know the punishment that awaits. Laws are not all about deterrent, although that's a component. A way to segregate the dangerous away from society is a component as well.

I will tell you that many armed robbers are actually using bb guns. I've had some admit its because they know they'll get more time for the gun than for the robbery based on their history. That means the law does have some effect. Some use them because they are cheap and buying a real gun is less money available for their drug of choice, too, but there are some guys who do it as a job and they have the forethought to consider what happens when they get caught. They look at jail time like we look at taxes. Its inevitable and its part of the job, but you want to minimize it.

 

[Alpo]

What community paid $600k for an MRAP? The MRAPs are already paid for. That's sunk costs and it doesn't matter if a PD uses them or they are dropped to the bottom of the ocean, that cost is already paid.

What are the numbers for officers shot who survived and officers shot at but missed? Perhaps things like body armor, the presence of tactical teams, etc, helps keep these numbers as low as they are?

What community paid that much? I PAID THAT MUCH!!!

Please don't tell me you need these things. You've got nothing on your side for that. We would be better off giving them to roofers to drive to work.

I'm generally on the side of 5-0. Not on this boondoggle.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

What community paid that much? I PAID THAT MUCH!!!

Please don't tell me you need these things. You've got nothing on your side for that. We would be better off giving them to roofers to drive to work.

I'm generally on the side of 5-0. Not on this boondoggle.

How did you pay that much?

 

[SSGSAD]

FBI stats show that 26 police officers were shot and killed with guns in 2013. Of these, half were killed by people who were completely barred from gun possession. More on store here. Half of Officers Killed by People Barred from Gun Possession

From the FBI report on officer deaths in 2013 to the May 9 shooting deaths of Deen and Liquori, the lesson is the same–gun control does not stop criminals from acting out their criminality. Leaving such criminals loose on the streets while trusting gun control to magically curtail their behavior only puts the lives of officers and other innocents at risk.

Don't tell S Watts .....

 

[Leadeye]

Well, here's the issue. How many serious violent felons got caught with a gun before they killed anyone with it and then went to prison, preventing them from murdering anyone for how many ever years? The answer is...I have no idea. It's easy to argue the law isn't having any effect, but let's also remember that we can't judge that based solely on the failures. Murder is against the law, too. Yet some people murder. Many others do not, though, even if they were inclined to do so because they know the punishment that awaits. Laws are not all about deterrent, although that's a component. A way to segregate the dangerous away from society is a component as well.

I will tell you that many armed robbers are actually using bb guns. I've had some admit its because they know they'll get more time for the gun than for the robbery based on their history. That means the law does have some effect. Some use them because they are cheap and buying a real gun is less money available for their drug of choice, too, but there are some guys who do it as a job and they have the forethought to consider what happens when they get caught. They look at jail time like we look at taxes. Its inevitable and its part of the job, but you want to minimize it.

Interesting point, I remember back in the days of the MCSD gun auctions asking where they picked up most of the guns. Was told it was mostly traffic stops of cars that had felons or people with no LTC. A smaller percentage was recovered from search warrants.