Have you ever "quizzed" a business with a no-gun sign

[k1500]

You see a business with a no guns allowed sign. Obviously, a piece of paper or plastic on a window or door doesn't stop a thug from bringing in a weapon. Have you ever asked to talk to a manager how they police that sort of policy. A metal detector? A pat down? A wand at the door? After all, as a customer, you want to know that you will be "safe" from potential gun violence.

 

[stephen87]

No, but I think I will now. Thanks for the idea.

 

[Gluemanz28]

That would be a good question to ask but I'm sure it would be skirted to corporate policy if a chain. If it was a local mom and pops it would be good to walk out after the conversation to let them know that they are actually loosing business.

 

[TheSpark]

Asking the employees or managers about these policies is a waste at chain stores. They don't make the policies. As for mom and pop shops you may very well change their attitude if you talk to them, kindly, about this. When they see they lost your business over it they may think about it even more.

The main point I would make to them is the policy, if it stops anyone at all since there is no legal ramifications unless they refuse to leave when asked after the fact, will only stop people they don't have to worry about in the first place. It would never stop anyone who intends to use that weapon against them. False sense of security for the owner, employees, and other customers is all it is.

If you get them to understand that they may drop the policy.

Now, I personally have no issue with stores who would rather you not open carry. Yes, open carry is a great way to get the public use to the fact that others have guns, but as it is now it may hurt their business more if they have two or three people open carrying and 20 soccer moms running out the front door with their children thinking they are about to die.

 

[StunnedMonkey]

Now, I personally have no issue with stores who would rather you not open carry. Yes, open carry is a great way to get the public use to the fact that others have guns, but as it is now it may hurt their business more if they have two or three people open carrying and 20 soccer moms running out the front door with their children thinking they are about to die.

Right. My guess is that most of these signs (especially at establishments such as restaurants where patrons will be expected to remain on the premises for extended periods) are not a serious attempt to avert crime, but rather to eliminate discomfort among those who might not feel secure around gun-toting strangers. Let's be serious, if the aforementioned soccer mom toting a few kids goes in to a BWW's and sees a dude wearing camo sporting a pistol on his hip, she doesn't know if he's really a responsible gun owner, or a dude that could go off if someone texts in a manner he doesn't like.

I'm not suggesting that this makes the business owner correct, but my guess is that's generally the motivation behind the sign and policy.

 

[Scutter01]

Right. My guess is that most of these signs (especially at establishments such as restaurants where patrons will be expected to remain on the premises for extended periods) are not a serious attempt to avert crime, but rather to eliminate discomfort among those who might not feel secure around gun-toting strangers. Let's be serious, if the aforementioned soccer mom toting a few kids goes in to a BWW's and sees a dude wearing camo sporting a pistol on his hip, she doesn't know if he's really a responsible gun owner, or a dude that could go off if someone texts in a manner he doesn't like.

I'm not suggesting that this makes the business owner correct, but my guess is that's generally the motivation behind the sign and policy.

How do I know that soccer mom isn't going to pick up the knife on the table and stab someone if that person texts in a manner she doesn't like? I think I should demand that B-Dubs ban soccer moms. Fear begets fear. Banning guns in your store because of what the owner "might" do is irrational at best and feeds into media-induced fear at worst.

 

[TheSpark]

Right. My guess is that most of these signs (especially at establishments such as restaurants where patrons will be expected to remain on the premises for extended periods) are not a serious attempt to avert crime, but rather to eliminate discomfort among those who might not feel secure around gun-toting strangers. Let's be serious, if the aforementioned soccer mom toting a few kids goes in to a BWW's and sees a dude wearing camo sporting a pistol on his hip, she doesn't know if he's really a responsible gun owner, or a dude that could go off if someone texts in a manner he doesn't like.

I'm not suggesting that this makes the business owner correct, but my guess is that's generally the motivation behind the sign and policy.

Yea, you hit it dead on. Most who do post these signs, be it mom and pop or a chain store, do it because it gives their customers a false sense of security. Or it gives the policy makes in the business a false sense of security because they are not fully thinking it through.

Criminals don't follow laws. So why in the world would they follow some policy, especially consider it is not legally enforceable, you have?

 

[StunnedMonkey]

How do I know that soccer mom isn't going to pick up the knife on the table and stab someone if that person texts in a manner she doesn't like? I think I should demand that B-Dubs ban soccer moms. Fear begets fear. Banning guns in your store because of what the owner "might" do is irrational at best and feeds into media-induced fear at worst.

This is why I always sit in the bar at B-Dubs. No sketchy soccer moms.

 

[TheSpark]

How do I know that soccer mom isn't going to pick up the knife on the table and stab someone if that person texts in a manner she doesn't like? I think I should demand that B-Dubs ban soccer moms. Fear begets fear. Banning guns in your store because of what the owner "might" do is irrational at best and feeds into media-induced fear at worst.

Because guns kill people on their own. Just ask Obama.

 

[funeralweb]

You see a business with a no guns allowed sign. Obviously, a piece of paper or plastic on a window or door doesn't stop a thug from bringing in a weapon. Have you ever asked to talk to a manager how they police that sort of policy. A metal detector? A pat down? A wand at the door? After all, as a customer, you want to know that you will be "safe" from potential gun violence.

Interesting twist to find out exactly what, if any, diligence is exercised at the local level toward enforcing a no-gun policy, be it a corporate-level decision or a mom-n-pop operator. And yes, after learning that they most likely do nothing to enforce their toothless policy, I might just have to expose my sidearm, mention that I would hate to trespass against their safety concerns, and leave the premises.

 

[indiucky]

Yes. Chuck E Cheese in Clarksville,IN. My daughter and I were leaving after I noticed they put a sign up. As I was leaving I snapped a pic with my cell phone of the sign which prompted the Manager to come up and ask why I was leaving...I told him, he was in agreement and gave me the number to corporate. I called them and voiced my displeasure.

 

[jsharmon7]

On the flip side, we as licensed carriers are in the minority. Only about 40% of the population in Indiana even owns guns, and I'm sure the number who carry them regularly is much lower than that. The number who would be so incensed by an anti-gun policy is probably much lower than that even. So for the handful of you who would go make a stink, or give them one of those pre-printed cards about "no gun = no money," how far outnumbered by the Suzy Soccer Moms are you? A business then has to make a choice between appeasing our minority versus scaring off the Suzy Soccer Moms. It would be nice to believe that businesses would stand on principle but they are in the business of making money. If Suzy Soccer Mom complains about the MWAG and nothing is done, how much business is lost compared to the tiny percentage of dyed-in-the-wool gun carriers who would actually make a business decision based on an anti-gun policy? It's extremely difficult to quantify how much business is lost by Suzy Soccer Mom not returning to a pro-gun store versus a gun enthusiast not returning to an anti-gun store. Given the number of us who regularly carry firearms versus the number who don't, I'd say businesses err on the side of Suzy Soccer Mom.

 

[TheSpark]

Yes. Chuck E Cheese in Clarksville,IN. My daughter and I were leaving after I noticed they put a sign up. As I was leaving I snapped a pic with my cell phone of the sign which prompted the Manager to come up and ask why I was leaving...I told him, he was in agreement and gave me the number to corporate. I called them and voiced my displeasure.

Yea, Chuck E Cheese has one of the most heavily worded signs to scare you into obeying. Of course it, as all other no gun signs, hold no weight of law.

I've read that Chuck E Cheese actually trains employees as part of their initial training period to pick out concealed carriers. I'm guessing that is recognizing what printing looks like. That place is very anti-gun, at least at the corporate level. I have proudly carried there twice I believe.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Yea, Chuck E Cheese has one of the most heavily worded signs to scare you into obeying. Of course it, as all other no gun signs, hold no weight of law.

I've read that Chuck E Cheese actually trains employees as part of their initial training period to pick out concealed carriers. I'm guessing that is recognizing what printing looks like. That place is very anti-gun, at least at the corporate level. I have proudly carried there twice I believe.

****sigh****

You haven't been around here for the past few days, I'm guessing?

 

[TheSpark]

****sigh****

You haven't been around here for the past few days, I'm guessing?

Yes I have, and have argued the fact that no guns signs can't hold weight of law no matter the language tooth and nail.

 

[funeralweb]

Given the number of us who regularly carry firearms versus the number who don't, I'd say businesses err on the side of Suzy Soccer Mom.

Agreed. I'll respect the biz owner's right to operate the way he/she sees fit. For me and my family, it's more about our right to self-preservation that determines where we .

 

[StunnedMonkey]

I'm assuming that we're generally talking about OC'ing here? Or are people saying that they'd respect the sign and not CC? If one was CC'ing properly, no one would even know, correct?

8 more to go.

 

[SteveM4A1]

This is why I always sit in the bar at B-Dubs. No sketchy soccer moms.

At my local bdubs, soccer moms bring their children into the bar all of the time. I like when I am watching a UFC fight on Saturday night at 11 PM and here comes a family into the bar with a baby and a 5 year old....

 

[PeaShooter]

Yes I have, and have argued the fact that no guns signs can't hold weight of law no matter the language tooth and nail.

link to this other discussion, please

 

[jsharmon7]

I'm assuming that we're generally talking about OC'ing here? Or are people saying that they'd respect the sign and not CC? If one was CC'ing properly, no one would even know, correct?

8 more to go.

I think this is even more evidence in favor of businesses posting "no guns" signs. Only 40% of Hoosiers own guns. Even fewer have an LTCH and carry guns. Even fewer who care strongly enough to stop shopping there, as evidence by the idea of CC'ing and continuing patronage anyway. So from the perspective of a business owner, how many customers are you going to lose over that signage? How many are likely to feel uncomfortable around people openly carrying firearms? Seems like a no-brainer from a business standpoint.