"I can't breathe....Breathe Easy"

[BigBoxaJunk]

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free ."
Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Hell, the debt alone has you, your children, and your grandchildren chained to the yoke.

And yet most of us continue to go, get in line, and stand in the voting booth, and actually believe we're perpetuating freedom.

 

[hoosierdoc]

...and believe it or not, people have more freedom in our generations, than any other prior (collectively)

This is absurd. Do you think there are less restrictions on what you can do in indiana in 2014 than there were in 1814?

 

[Expat]

This is absurd. Do you think there are less restrictions on what you can do in indiana in 2014 than there were in 1814?

It is a typical liberal tactic, make something up that is so breathtaking that you really don't know what to say...

 

[Twangbanger]

Just some things, I thought I point out. (Lord knows if I addressed everything I'd be here forever)

1. some are, but MOST now can legally do so as they please = more freedom than before (Was it illegal? I really don't know, but would like to)
3. Yeah, wrong... Microbreweries (I'll give you that...but having microbreweries and carving out a legislative exception for them, while leaving the other law in place, is not really more freedom - just more consumer choice).
7. Fail at understanding the difference between broadcast and cable TV (You didn't say "broadcast," you said "media". I gave examples. And "Sanford and Son" was broadcast).
8. You lost me (Well...I probably lost myself, too...but really doubt I'll get away with it, from talking to the bouncers. I thought you said you were an officer, so set me straight if I'm wrong on this)
12. Why would you ask me "when" this occurred? Funny, for you knowing so much, you didn't call me out on IC. (I'm just asking you to tell me when it was illegal to burn the flag, since you posited that it happened. I'm not an expert, I'm just conversing with you and really want to know. There have been a lot of proposals for amendments that never went anywhere at the U.S. Level. Indiana State level? I don't know).

627. PROHIBITION. (I'll spot you a free one).

 

[Expat]

Taxation is control. Until 1931, federal taxation ran around 3% of GDP. Obviously it is now in the 10x that area...
So you were only a slave to the government for a few days in the old days. Now you are their slave for several months.

 

[churchmouse]

The people confidence in impartiality seems to be a little more of a concern with LE than with a sports team.

Just saying why not. The idiocy is springing up in every corner. People can support or deny who they wish. People can express their beliefs as they wish.

In my world, sports is not a platform for these things. It is not why (sports) exists. If these people want to express a point of view there are cameras every where that will broadcast it out to the masses with all the talking head Bravo Sierra that goes with it. Believe or ignore it.
I do not tune into a sports broadcast for political view points. Sports is an escape from this crap. Leave it be.

For LEO to respond may not be taking the high ground but I do see why they did it and at least it was not shoved up my butt during a football game.

 

[JMoses]

In my lifetime i've seen the following changes.

Can't put leaves out for the trash man.
Can't burn trash in your back yard.
Can't sell gasoline with lead or without ethanol.
Can't buy cold medicine without paperwork.
Can't drive without a seatbelt.
Can't drive with an open container of alcohol.
Can't have kids in the car without being in a carseat.
Catch and keep a box turtle.
Can't send a box full of homemade cupcakes to your kids school.
Can't play with toy guns in the local park.

You want to drink and drive with your kids unrestrained in your car? Wow, I'm sorry that the government won't allow you to do that.

 

[churchmouse]

You want to drink and drive with your kids unrestrained in your car? Wow, I'm sorry that the government won't allow you to do that.

Not sure he said he wanted to. Just seen the changes.

 

[churchmouse]

Taxation is control. Until 1931, federal taxation ran around 3% of GDP. Obviously it is now in the 10x that area...
So you were only a slave to the government for a few days in the old days. Now you are their slave for several months.

And they want more.

 

[Trigger Time]

I'm so used to these people hooting and hollering about something do people really care anymore? No
its actualy very funny. Just like people wearing African clothing that aren't even from there nor their ancestors.
on one side of my family I can tell you the ship my (3rd?)great grandfather came to New York from Ireland on, but you don't see me running around in a kilt or dressed like a damn leprocon.
attention seekers and baitors is all they are

 

[OneShotFOGE]

In my lifetime i've seen the following changes.

Can't put leaves out for the trash man.
Can't burn trash in your back yard.
Can't sell gasoline with lead or without ethanol.
Can't buy cold medicine without paperwork.
Can't drive without a seatbelt.
Can't drive with an open container of alcohol.
Can't have kids in the car without being in a carseat.
Catch and keep a box turtle.
Can't send a box full of homemade cupcakes to your kids school.
Can't play with toy guns in the local park.

Can't bring peanut butter and jelly sandwiches to school.

 

[88GT]

Oh, I almost missed this...

-remember when stores were closed on Sundays (some still are...why do you think Indiana package liquor stores lobby for - and get - state-based protectionism...see #3 below)
-remember when you could be drafted (you still can be...make sure you register for selective service when you turn 18, btw)
-remember when you couldn't carry out alcohol on Sundays (in Indiana you still can't)
-remember when abortion was illegal (the Republicans aren't finished with this yet...they're just too busy helping the banks at the moment)
-remember when there was no such thing as a casino in Indiana (Wow...score 10 points for Freedom on that one. Tell me more about this "Casino Boat as Bastion of Liberty <<<insert photo of Gene Wilder in purple suit here <<<)
-remember when you couldn't physically resist unlawful entry (try it on the po-leets, and see how far you get...I guess "wrong house" = lawful)
-remember when media was more heavily censored (thanks NYPD Blue) (when I grew up, people of all colors laughed at Sanford and Son until it hurt...and based on your answer to #2, I'll assume HBO and Skinemax were already on the air before you were born)
-remember when public intox was simply being intoxicated in public (regardless of your actions) (Go try it...any weekend in Indy other than Black Expo, and see what happens)
-remember the AWB (remember the 200+ years before the AWB...before "your pal" Clinton, in other words?)
-remember when gay marriage was illegal (this is really the only point of your post).
-remember when jailbreaking a phone was illegal (remember when that phone wasn't the center of the average American's life? Silly me...of course you don't)
-remember when it was illegal to burn the flag (Got me there...when exactly was that? If you're stuck, and you probably are, Look up Texas vs. Johnson)
-remember when absinthe was illegal (I do, dagnabit) (I'll check it out when I celebrate my freedom at the Casino Boat - see #5).
-remember airline price regulation (I'm too busy studying new reams of healthcare regulation)
-remember restricted travel to Russia, China, and Vietnam (pick me up some Cohiba Robustos next time you're in Cuba)
-remember when books based on ideology were banned (Mao - 70s) (Catch 22 and gay marriage? Is that really all you got?)

I'd also like to point out that the majority of his "oppressive" examples were preceded by a time when none of that regulation existed. As I said in the other thread where he tried this ridiculous argument: pick a period of time. The years before that had more freedom.

With few exceptions on that list, most of those restrictions weren't in place at the inception of the U.S. which means that any rollback of the restriction is merely a return to a previous status quo, not an overall net gain to total freedom.

 

[indiucky]

You and I both know the days of Decorum are gone.

So I thought...Wife just informed me this morning we are getting a new couch (my mountain cur added her own touches to the current couch) and it appears she is going on a full blown decorum binge....

 

[churchmouse]

So I thought...Wife just informed me this morning we are getting a new couch (my mountain cur added her own touches to the current couch) and it appears she is going on a full blown decorum binge....

OK.......I got nothing.......

 

[chipbennett]

I know exactly what you mean. One of the laws you heralded as expanding liberty has resulted in over 50 million deaths since the SCOTUS ruled it the law of the land. Yes, some laws are more proportionate to liberty than others. Too bad most of those 50 million (a disproportionate number of them black) never got a chance to enjoy the new found liberties brought about in the 20th century.

I'm a pro-choicer. You may not consider it liberty, but I do. We can simply disagree.

You can disagree, but you'd be wrong. Where does the unborn child - fully human, fully genetically and physically distinct from either parent - get the "choice"? The body of the unborn child is not the body of the mother. The life of the unborn child is not the life of the mother. The rights of the unborn child are not the rights of the mother.

So, basically, your "freedoms" are really a trade-off. You can drink and gamble (and I agree those shouldn't be illegal), but if you're a human being who hasn't yet passed through the birth canal your mother can legally murder you, and if you don't purchase health insurance, the government makes you pay a fine.

The selective service is still a thing, and the AWB came and went during a 10-year period. How about NFA and all of the other infringements on the RKBA? (Better not be caught with empty brass inside the District of Columbia, either.) Thanks to the DMCA, we still don't really own many of our electronic devices, whether or not you can legally jailbreak your iCrap.

As for gay marriage: until the State gets out of marriage (a religious institution), nothing will be fixed. And the end result is that the State is actively violating freedom of conscience. (When the State starts recognizing civil unions, and stops interfering with marriage, *then* we will have freedom and equal protection for all. Churches can marry whomever they choose, and the State neither approves, opposes, or recognizes religious marriages. The marriage and the civil union are two separate entities. Everyone wins.) I would guess that you and I would probably actually mostly agree on this one?

 

[LANShark42]

In my lifetime i've seen the following changes.

Can't put leaves out for the trash man.
Can't burn trash in your back yard.
Can't sell gasoline with lead or without ethanol.
Can't buy cold medicine without paperwork.
Can't drive without a seatbelt.
Can't drive with an open container of alcohol.
Can't have kids in the car without being in a carseat.
Catch and keep a box turtle.
Can't send a box full of homemade cupcakes to your kids school.
Can't play with toy guns in the local park.

You forgot:
Say the pledge of allegiance in school.
Pray in school
Take a hunting/gun safety class in school
Get a rare or medium-rare hamburger in a restaurant.
expect privacy on a phone call or in an e-mail.

 

[88GT]

You forgot:
Say the pledge of allegiance in school.
Pray in school
Take a hunting/gun safety class in school
Get a rare or medium-rare hamburger in a restaurant.
expect privacy on a phone call or in an e-mail.

Heck, school itself has become an onslaught on the rights of both parent and child.

 

[2ADMNLOVER]

attention seekers and baitors is all they are

Every last one of'em , man or woman , ought to be kicked in the crotch repeatedly and water boarded until the stupid pours out of'em .

If you have enough breath / strength in your lungs to yell repeatedly " I can't breath " , then maybe your sorry ass should concentrate on breathing INSTEAD of resisting .

 

[BehindBlueI's]

You forgot:
Say the pledge of allegiance in school.
Pray in school
Take a hunting/gun safety class in school
Get a rare or medium-rare hamburger in a restaurant.
expect privacy on a phone call or in an e-mail.

You can say the Pledge. You just can't force others to do so.
Same for prayer. You can, you just can't force others to. Seems to be like organizations like the FCA even do so routinely on a voluntary basis.
Why not? Regulation, or just not offered?
Sure you can. The restaurants that don't are afraid of their fellow citizens suing them if they get sick.
We had a party line when we first had a telephone, no expectation of privacy there. Of course no e-mail, either, but if you expect privacy in e-mail you don't understand how the system works. It's less secure than folded note being passed down the row by school kids.

Its funny how many of these lists are made up of things that are simply untrue, things that are based on fears of liability passed off as forced changes, changing cultural attitudes, etc. For the ones that are true, there's often an associated gain in freedom as well. You can't buy leaded gas? So I'm now free to not breathe unhealthy amounts of lead and to have cleaner drinking water. Ignoring the fact that you can buy synthetic additives if you really need it, gasoline today has the octane boosted without the neurotoxins, so what freedom did you really lose?

PEOPLE LOVE TO TALK ABOUT THEIR RIGHTS AND EQUALLY LOVE TO FORGET ABOUT THEIR RESPONSIBILITIES.

 

[88GT]

You can say the Pledge. You just can't force others to do so.
Same for prayer. You can, you just can't force others to. Seems to be like organizations like the FCA even do so routinely on a voluntary basis.
Why not? Regulation, or just not offered?
Sure you can. The restaurants that don't are afraid of their fellow citizens suing them if they get sick.
We had a party line when we first had a telephone, no expectation of privacy there. Of course no e-mail, either, but if you expect privacy in e-mail you don't understand how the system works. It's less secure than folded note being passed down the row by school kids.

Its funny how many of these lists are made up of things that are simply untrue, things that are based on fears of liability passed off as forced changes, changing cultural attitudes, etc. For the ones that are true, there's often an associated gain in freedom as well. You can't buy leaded gas? So I'm now free to not breathe unhealthy amounts of lead and to have cleaner drinking water. Ignoring the fact that you can buy synthetic additives if you really need it, gasoline today has the octane boosted without the neurotoxins, so what freedom did you really lose?

PEOPLE LOVE TO TALK ABOUT THEIR RIGHTS AND EQUALLY LOVE TO FORGET ABOUT THEIR RESPONSIBILITIES.

Some schools actively disallow Christian acts.

What responsibilities would those be?