I have been reinforcing my decision to never again fly in an airplane.

[HoughMade]

Hear hear. I'm old enough to remember when flying was actually a pleasant experience. In this post 9/11 era of rude & hopelessly incompetent TSA agents, more invasive screening and ever-decreasing seat size and leg room, I'll just drive to wherever I need to go. Should I ever travel overseas, I'll either go by sea or just stay home.

I'm in my second 5 year TSA Pre Check stint. Security is easy-peasy.

Today's reminder that I'm glad that I carry on rather than check luggage.

I have checked bags once in the past 10 years or so and it went fine. MDW-LGA, LGA-MDW

 

[Ingomike]

I'm in my second 5 year TSA Pre Check stint. Security is easy-peasy.

What I find in my discussions on this topic, there are have’s and have nots and their experiences are often quite different. We have for example @chipbennett that apparently flies a lot or @BehindBlueI's that has made a hobby out of travel (good for him) that love the travel and there are those that fly infrequently, many of whom hate todays air travel.

For the infrequent, many don’t want to spend the time and money necessary to receive all the perks, perks that are often procured on an employers dime for many, not the traveller’s. The infrequent used to get good service and comfortable accommodations while flying, but now most of that is gone or only offered to the frequent flyers or big budget tickets.

I remember when I first took a flight I thought the attendants were some of THE nicest people on earth, some are nice today but they have their surly attendants too. I watch old movies and see a pleasant stroll through the airport, a walk to the boarding stairs, and remember how pleasant it all once was.

I find it interesting that age seems to make a difference too. Those that are younger likely had little experience before air travel became excessive security theater, cattle calls, and parking five miles from the airport.

If you love it, great for you, enjoy, I just do not enjoy it at all, and for the record, I love flying in a plane from small to big.

 

[HoughMade]

What I find in my discussions on this topic, there are have’s and have nots and their experiences are often quite different. We have for example @chipbennett that apparently flies a lot or @BehindBlueI's that has made a hobby out of travel (good for him) that love the travel and there are those that fly infrequently, many of whom hate todays air travel.

For the infrequent, many don’t want to spend the time and money necessary to receive all the perks, perks that are often procured on an employers dime for many, not the traveller’s. The infrequent used to get good service and comfortable accommodations while flying, but now most of that is gone or only offered to the frequent flyers or big budget tickets.

I remember when I first took a flight I thought the attendants were some of THE nicest people on earth, some are nice today but they have their surly attendants too. I watch old movies and see a pleasant stroll through the airport, a walk to the boarding stairs, and remember how pleasant it all once was.

I find it interesting that age seems to make a difference too. Those that are younger likely had little experience before air travel became excessive security theater, cattle calls, and parking five miles from the airport.

If you love it, great for you, enjoy, I just do not enjoy it at all, and for the record, I love flying in a plane from small to big.

I get it. Pre-pandemic, I flew a lot for work. Less now, but I still do. When I first got it, the TSA Pre-Check was $85 for 5 years. If I flew once a year, I would still think $17 annually was a deal. I don't remember what the renewal cost.

 

[chipbennett]

What I find in my discussions on this topic, there are have’s and have nots and their experiences are often quite different. We have for example @chipbennett that apparently flies a lot or @BehindBlueI's that has made a hobby out of travel (good for him) that love the travel and there are those that fly infrequently, many of whom hate todays air travel.

For the infrequent, many don’t want to spend the time and money necessary to receive all the perks, perks that are often procured on an employers dime for many, not the traveller’s. The infrequent used to get good service and comfortable accommodations while flying, but now most of that is gone or only offered to the frequent flyers or big budget tickets.

A lot of those perks are gone, or being scaled way back, even for the frequent flyers. And my experience is probably different from the infrequent flyers because I have developed particular routines that make the experience better/more consistent/less frustrating/etc.

 

[Ingomike]

A lot of those perks are gone, or being scaled way back, even for the frequent flyers. And my experience is probably different from the infrequent flyers because I have developed particular routines that make the experience better/more consistent/less frustrating/etc.

I am sure the routines are a huge advantage all around. It just feels like it is getting more difficult to do anything.

 

[BugI02]

During the pandemic, when capacity was cut back pretty hard, I actually loved being able to piece together an itinerary that was all Embraer 170s and 175s or CRJ 700s and 900s, which have bigger seats than larger aircraft and have no middle seat, they're 2 x 2

They also take far less time to emplane and deplane and the average passenger knows better than to try and carry on his/her entire life. On board wifi was a weak link, though

Now I ****ing had to ride a 777 from SFO to DEN a couple of months ago to travel when I needed to and it was COMPLETELY full, not one empty seat. I thought I was going to age out just waiting to deplane

 

[BehindBlueI's]

What I find in my discussions on this topic, there are have’s and have nots and their experiences are often quite different. We have for example @chipbennett that apparently flies a lot or @BehindBlueI's that has made a hobby out of travel (good for him) that love the travel and there are those that fly infrequently, many of whom hate todays air travel.

I'd probably like it less if it was a job. As you say, it's a hobby for me, so I enjoy near complete flexibility. Since I don't have to be any particular place at any particular time, I can (often) avoid airports I know suck, times I know are peak travel times, etc. I can choose flights with easy layovers, layovers in airports I can get into a decent lounge, etc. I spend a lot of time researching and "war gaming" different trips on excel sheets (transportation, lodging costs and availability, rental car if needed, etc) and then we just choose the one that looks best. Sometimes it's a flight, sometimes a road trip, and we've considered a cruise but it's just never looked that good in comparison to other options for the same time/money.

If you're only going to travel domestically, TSA precheck is easy to get and pretty cheap. If you have a travel credit card you'll likely find they reimburse you for it. Global entry is a bigger PITA because of scheduling the interview in person, but once you've got it it's so much better.

Honestly, though, part of it is just managing expectations. You're in a seat flying through the air at 600mph. In very recent human history no amount of money or political power could let you do that. Now you can do it in a climate controlled atmosphere with *flipping internet access* while you're there. (I recently switched to T-mobile, and you get free wi-fi on a lot of domestic flights with it). Sure there's things that suck about it. There's things that suck about driving. There's things that suck about sitting on your ass at home in front of the television. A little stoicism goes a long way in putting the suck in perspective for all the positives that result, IMO.


And it's often cheap AF if you have flexibility like I do. I recently posted in the low cost travel thread that there are direct flights from Chicago to Lisbon for $300 round trip in December. $1k for premium economy, which is pretty nice on TAP.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I have checked bags once in the past 10 years or so and it went fine. MDW-LGA, LGA-MDW

I vary. If I'm going to take a handgun, obviously I have to check a bag. If not, it's carry on only with very rare exception. Not because it's that much of a PITA to check the bag, but largely because it's a real time saver to not wait for the baggage to come back out if it's a bigger airplane. Also nice at big foreign airports since you'll probably be ahead of most of the people on your plane to get to immigration and customs.

On Europe trips it's so much better to only have a backpack as well. No keeping up with suitcases, no annoying bub-bub-bub of dragging a wheelie bag on cobblestones, if you get somewhere before you can check in it's NBD to keep your bag with you a few hours (though most places will let you drop bags), and train travel is a cinch if you can put your bag on your lap for short jaunts or overhead for longer ones.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Now I ****ing had to ride a 777 from SFO to DEN a couple of months ago to travel when I needed to and it was COMPLETELY full, not one empty seat. I thought I was going to age out just waiting to deplane

It's an interesting dynamic to watch people. Both crowding the gate knowing their boarding group is 10 minutes from being called and standing up/blocking aisles when it's not there turn to move.

We chose bulk head seats for each leg of our last flight so we were easy on/easy off for the most part. Only downside there is the little fold out tables to try and balance your meal on vs the much more solid fold downs.

 

[BE Mike]

I'd probably like it less if it was a job. As you say, it's a hobby for me, so I enjoy near complete flexibility. Since I don't have to be any particular place at any particular time, I can (often) avoid airports I know suck, times I know are peak travel times, etc. I can choose flights with easy layovers, layovers in airports I can get into a decent lounge, etc. I spend a lot of time researching and "war gaming" different trips on excel sheets (transportation, lodging costs and availability, rental car if needed, etc) and then we just choose the one that looks best. Sometimes it's a flight, sometimes a road trip, and we've considered a cruise but it's just never looked that good in comparison to other options for the same time/money.

If you're only going to travel domestically, TSA precheck is easy to get and pretty cheap. If you have a travel credit card you'll likely find they reimburse you for it. Global entry is a bigger PITA because of scheduling the interview in person, but once you've got it it's so much better.

Honestly, though, part of it is just managing expectations. You're in a seat flying through the air at 600mph. In very recent human history no amount of money or political power could let you do that. Now you can do it in a climate controlled atmosphere with *flipping internet access* while you're there. (I recently switched to T-mobile, and you get free wi-fi on a lot of domestic flights with it). Sure there's things that suck about it. There's things that suck about driving. There's things that suck about sitting on your ass at home in front of the television. A little stoicism goes a long way in putting the suck in perspective for all the positives that result, IMO.


And it's often cheap AF if you have flexibility like I do. I recently posted in the low cost travel thread that there are direct flights from Chicago to Lisbon for $300 round trip in December. $1k for premium economy, which is pretty nice on TAP.

So if you have time to spare, go by air?

 

[chipbennett]

I vary. If I'm going to take a handgun, obviously I have to check a bag. If not, it's carry on only with very rare exception. Not because it's that much of a PITA to check the bag, but largely because it's a real time saver to not wait for the baggage to come back out if it's a bigger airplane. Also nice at big foreign airports since you'll probably be ahead of most of the people on your plane to get to immigration and customs.

On Europe trips it's so much better to only have a backpack as well. No keeping up with suitcases, no annoying bub-bub-bub of dragging a wheelie bag on cobblestones, if you get somewhere before you can check in it's NBD to keep your bag with you a few hours (though most places will let you drop bags), and train travel is a cinch if you can put your bag on your lap for short jaunts or overhead for longer ones.

So much this. Last month at PVG (Shanghai), I waited almost an hour for my luggage. (That's a trip that I have to check a bag, for several reasons. Otherwise, I'm Team CarryOn.)

As for Immigration (Passport Control) and Customs: the Passport Control line can sometimes get long, but I've never had any kind of wait or delay getting through Customs.

 

[chipbennett]

It's an interesting dynamic to watch people. Both crowding the gate knowing their boarding group is 10 minutes from being called and standing up/blocking aisles when it's not there turn to move.

We chose bulk head seats for each leg of our last flight so we were easy on/easy off for the most part. Only downside there is the little fold out tables to try and balance your meal on vs the much more solid fold downs.

The less-than-gracious term for these people is "gate lice". It is a huge pet peeve of mine. They do nothing but complicate and delay the boarding process.

 

[bobzilla]

I'd probably like it less if it was a job. As you say, it's a hobby for me, so I enjoy near complete flexibility. Since I don't have to be any particular place at any particular time, I can (often) avoid airports I know suck, times I know are peak travel times, etc. I can choose flights with easy layovers, layovers in airports I can get into a decent lounge, etc. I spend a lot of time researching and "war gaming" different trips on excel sheets (transportation, lodging costs and availability, rental car if needed, etc) and then we just choose the one that looks best. Sometimes it's a flight, sometimes a road trip, and we've considered a cruise but it's just never looked that good in comparison to other options for the same time/money.

If you're only going to travel domestically, TSA precheck is easy to get and pretty cheap. If you have a travel credit card you'll likely find they reimburse you for it. Global entry is a bigger PITA because of scheduling the interview in person, but once you've got it it's so much better.

Honestly, though, part of it is just managing expectations. You're in a seat flying through the air at 600mph. In very recent human history no amount of money or political power could let you do that. Now you can do it in a climate controlled atmosphere with *flipping internet access* while you're there. (I recently switched to T-mobile, and you get free wi-fi on a lot of domestic flights with it). Sure there's things that suck about it. There's things that suck about driving. There's things that suck about sitting on your ass at home in front of the television. A little stoicism goes a long way in putting the suck in perspective for all the positives that result, IMO.


And it's often cheap AF if you have flexibility like I do. I recently posted in the low cost travel thread that there are direct flights from Chicago to Lisbon for $300 round trip in December. $1k for premium economy, which is pretty nice on TAP.

A good friend and I were laughing at a recent experience they had on a recent out of country trip. Apparently one of their fellow passengers didn't get something they wanted or something, and was just mad the entire week. Everytime they'd run into them in the resort he was just seething angry.

We are the opposite. If things go sideways, it's just a new adventure. Getting stuck in chicago with no plane, no eta on when that plane MIGHT arrive etc just meant we went to avis and grabbed a car to drive home. No biggie. If you're on vacation and you're mad you might be doing it wrong.

 

[bobzilla]

It's an interesting dynamic to watch people. Both crowding the gate knowing their boarding group is 10 minutes from being called and standing up/blocking aisles when it's not there turn to move.

We chose bulk head seats for each leg of our last flight so we were easy on/easy off for the most part. Only downside there is the little fold out tables to try and balance your meal on vs the much more solid fold downs.

We stand up and move around when they start boarding because we know the next "X" hours we will be sitting so this is our last chance to stretch and move about.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

We stand up and move around when they start boarding because we know the next "X" hours we will be sitting so this is our last chance to stretch and move about.

Yeah, but do you go stand in, or very near, the line so you're first in your boarding group that's 6 calls away or try to sneak on with a much earlier group? That's what we're talking about. In Chicago I saw people lined up before they called group 1, and thought there's no way that many people are in 1. I'm group 3, had to push past all of them to board...

 

[bobzilla]

Yeah, but do you go stand in, or very near, the line so you're first in your boarding group that's 6 calls away or try to sneak on with a much earlier group? That's what we're talking about. In Chicago I saw people lined up before they called group 1, and thought there's no way that many people are in 1. I'm group 3, had to push past all of them to board...

The only time we didn't go with our group was when I was still in a sling with broken bones. So people wouldn't bump into me and make me cry we asked for early boarding, I had a left side window so I was protected as much as I could be.

 

[chipbennett]

Yeah, but do you go stand in, or very near, the line so you're first in your boarding group that's 6 calls away or try to sneak on with a much earlier group? That's what we're talking about. In Chicago I saw people lined up before they called group 1, and thought there's no way that many people are in 1. I'm group 3, had to push past all of them to board...

Exactly. Stand up/walk around in the gatehouse all you want. Just stay out of the boarding area/lanes.

 

[Ingomike]

Exactly. Stand up/walk around in the gatehouse all you want. Just stay out of the boarding area/lanes.

And the discussion is about one of the things I hate about air travel not having assigned seats and bins thereby eliminating the “cattle calls”. I ponder why? My best guess is the bean counters found the “castle call“ boarding (and even the line jumpers) are faster giving the airline the gate quicker for another flight…

 

[SmileDocHill]

When I was little I was very afraid of flying but the flight staff was very good. After landing the pilot was shaking hands as people deplaned, they used to do that. I asked him why he wanted to be a pilot, I can't imagine since I'm afraid of flying. He said actually he became a pilot to overcome his fear also. I was shocked. You were afraid of flying!? He said no, I was always afraid of dying alone.

 

[dsol]

Just found out I get to go to Brussels for a work conference in September. Sure am not driving there!