I just luv gubmint

[KLB]

So you're saying a landlord will take a hit on what they earn due to property taxes going up and not pass it along to a tenant?

Short term, no. They probably have a lease with the tenant which spells out the monthly rent.

Long term, they will try. If the market is in their favor, they will be able to. If it isn't, they will not.

Renters no more pay property tax than they pay for repairs.

 

[firecadet613]

Short term, no. They probably have a lease with the tenant which spells out the monthly rent.

Long term, they will try. If the market is in their favor, they will be able to. If it isn't, they will not.

Renters no more pay property tax than they pay for repairs.

Wrong. They will adjust rent accordingly to ensure it's covered. You're fooling yourself if you think otherwise.

Have you seen rental rates lately? Just like pricing on houses, they are extremely high. I'm sure the landlords are doing just fine...

And landlords on the commercial sector do NNN leases, so they could care less...

 

[KLB]

Wrong. They will adjust rent accordingly to ensure it's covered. You're fooling yourself if you think otherwise.

Have you seen rental rates lately? Just like pricing on houses, they are extremely high. I'm sure the landlords are doing just fine...

And landlords on the commercial sector do NNN leases, so they could care less...

You are taking a snapshot in time and thinking there is some Universe where landlords just charge whatever they want for rent and get it.

Commercial is a joke. Chicago is running 45% empty in commercial.

 

[Ingomike]

You are taking a snapshot in time and thinking there is some Universe where landlords just charge whatever they want for rent and get it.

Commercial is a joke. Chicago is running 45% empty in commercial.

It is patently ridiculous to think any landlord does not pass on the costs if repairs and taxes directly on to the tenant and if the market doesn’t allow for that they will cease leasing. No one can or will provide rental property and lose money on it for long.

The commercial RE market is getting bad, but there are still hot sectors even now…

 

[firecadet613]

You are taking a snapshot in time and thinking there is some Universe where landlords just charge whatever they want for rent and get it.

Commercial is a joke. Chicago is running 45% empty in commercial.

I should have said retail commercial, not commercial offices downtown...

Landlords are not going to pay increased property taxes out of the goodness of their hearts...apartments are in very short supply bud....

You wouldn't last long as a landlord if you don't pass along incurred expenses...

You must think companies pay for marketing and not the end consumer...

 

[phylodog]

And if there are no renters the taxes must still be paid.
If the building is converted to different use the taxes must still be paid.
If the building burns to the ground the owner gets compensated from owner's insurance. It is up to the renters to provide their own and they are only compensated for their possesions within the building.

How the owner obtains the funds to maintain his or her ownership of the property is solely up to and the responsibility of the property owner, they don't have to lease living space or lease the space at all. Giving credit to the renters for paying the taxes is akin to the communist claim that the workers should be compensated equally to or moreso than the business owner because without the workers there would be no business. In other words, ********.

 

[jamil]

So you're saying a landlord will take a hit on what they earn due to property taxes going up and not pass it along to a tenant?

Depends on the market. This is not astonishing. Supply/demand. Location. Local economy. Say your property tax goes up on a property by $388.68. Yur renters are paying $1250/mo. Assume property tax is the only expense increased. Are you going to raise your tenant’s rent $32.39 oer month? What if you know they’re already maxed out on rent and and will likely move if you raise it much more? But they’re really good tenants, pay their rent on time every month. Don’t **** up the place. What if the local economy is a renters economy and the average time to lease is 3 or more months? Do you raise the rent to exactly $1282.39 when the lease is up? Or do you just say, **** it and eat the cost until condition are better for raising the rent?

Expenses figure in a lot for what you charge, but there are other factors that prevent you from passing on all the cost increases to your tenants.

 

[jamil]

Do those “expenses” not get passed on to the tenant? Are you implying that landlords pay taxes and do not collect that “expense” from the tenant?

See the previous post.

 

[jamil]

Amazing how many folks don't understand how the world works...

Exactly!

 

[firecadet613]

Depends on the market. This is not astonishing. Supply/demand. Location. Local economy. Say your property tax goes up on a property by $388.68. Yur renters are paying $1250/mo. Assume property tax is the only expense increased. Are you going to raise your tenant’s rent $32.39 oer month? What if you know they’re already maxed out on rent and and will likely move if you raise it much more? But they’re really good tenants, pay their rent on time every month. Don’t **** up the place. What if the local economy is a renters economy and the average time to lease is 3 or more months? Do you raise the rent to exactly $1282.39 when the lease is up? Or do you just say, **** it and eat the cost until condition are better for raising the rent?

Expenses figure in a lot for what you charge, but there are other factors that prevent you from passing on all the cost increases to your tenants.

You (and others) are missing the basic facts of how the landlord/tenant relationship works.

The landlord pays all costs directly (mortgage, property taxes, etc) and the tenant is the real one who pays them. A landlord will not rent out a place at a loss...

If the landlord is only clearing $50/mo or less, they are doing it wrong... but when it comes time to renew the lease, they'll correct it to make sure their expenses are covered.

Pretty basic stuff here fellas, but leave it to INGO to not understand the basics...

 

[jamil]

It is patently ridiculous to think any landlord does not pass on the costs if repairs and taxes directly on to the tenant and if the market doesn’t allow for that they will cease leasing. No one can or will provide rental property and lose money on it for long.

The commercial RE market is getting bad, but there are still hot sectors even now…

It’s patently ridiculous to think that landlords always have the option to pass every increase on to the tenants. Stop leasing? Why? Are their margins so tight that in a bad economy they can't eat $30 to keep their awesome tenants who pay rent on time every month and don't **** up the place?

You (and others) are missing the basic facts of how the landlord/tenant relationship works.

No I'm not.

The landlord pays all costs directly (mortgage, property taxes, etc) and the tenant is the real one who pays them. A landlord will not rent out a place at a loss...

No ****? Not passing on all the costs is not the same thing as renting out the place at a loss.

If the landlord is only clearing $50/mo or less, they are doing it wrong... but when it comes time to renew the lease, they'll correct it to make sure their expenses are covered.

Pretty basic stuff here fellas, but leave it to INGO to not understand the basics...

Costs alone don't determine the price of anything. Markets do. In any market you get what you can get. In a good market you can get more. In a ****** market you won't. So then you get what you can, and then raise the rent when the market will pay it. Pretty basic stuff here. No reason not to get it. But leave it to INGO for some holdouts.

 

[phylodog]

You (and others) are missing the basic facts of how the landlord/tenant relationship works.

The landlord pays all costs directly (mortgage, property taxes, etc) and the tenant is the real one who pays them. A landlord will not rent out a place at a loss...

If the landlord is only clearing $50/mo or less, they are doing it wrong... but when it comes time to renew the lease, they'll correct it to make sure their expenses are covered.

Pretty basic stuff here fellas, but leave it to INGO to not understand the basics...

By your reasoning you don't pay any taxes whatsoever. All money you turn over in taxes is provided to you by your employer so your employer is the one paying taxes, not you.

 

[KLB]

By your reasoning you don't pay any taxes whatsoever. All money you turn over in taxes is provided to you by your employer so your employer is the one paying taxes, not you.

But they get their money from customers paying for a product or service, so the customers are paying the taxes. Of course they get their money from their employers, so I guess their employers pay the taxes.

Where it really gets weird is for a government employee. Then the government is paying itself taxes.

 

[firecadet613]

By your reasoning you don't pay any taxes whatsoever. All money you turn over in taxes is provided to you by your employer so your employer is the one paying taxes, not you.

You guys are comical.

@phylodog tell me you've never managed a P&L without telling me you've never managed a P&L. Top line sales are what drives it and more sales (money from the customer) cures all...

Property taxes go up, sales go up to offset it and keep your EBITDA where you want it...

Landlords pass along expenses to tenants, pretty simple stuff.

Not sure where you guys are, but housing is in short supply and apartments are charging top tier rents and many have waiting lists.

This will likely shock most of you, but everything a business has, customers pay foe. That fancy new remodels EOF McDonald's with $100k in the drive thru alone, you paid for it.

The cost of wages goes up (see CA), so do menu prices.

You're fooling yourself (or have no idea of simple economics), if you don't understand that customers of a business pay their expenses.... they have no other source of revenue.

Back to the property tax discussion, I feel for those on a fixed income. But if you've worked your whole life and were unable to pay off your mortgage, that's on you. Don't live beyond your means, pay extra towards principal, budget your money, don't eat out every night, etc.

If folks did that, this wouldn't even be a discussion....

 

[Ingomike]

It’s patently ridiculous to think that landlords always have the option to pass every increase on to the tenants. Stop leasing? Why? Are their margins so tight that in a bad economy they can't eat $30 to keep their awesome tenants who pay rent on time every month and don't **** up the place?


No I'm not.


No ****? Not passing on all the costs is not the same thing as renting out the place at a loss.



Costs alone don't determine the price of anything. Markets do. In any market you get what you can get. In a good market you can get more. In a ****** market you won't. So then you get what you can, and then raise the rent when the market will pay it. Pretty basic stuff here. No reason not to get it. But leave it to INGO for some holdouts.

Small minded.

 

[Ingomike]

By your reasoning you don't pay any taxes whatsoever. All money you turn over in taxes is provided to you by your employer so your employer is the one paying taxes, not you.

You probably believe that those with mortgage don’t pay taxes either, that the mortgage company pays the taxes. After all if you don’t make the payments the mortgage company will still pay the taxes most if the time…

 

[phylodog]

You probably believe that those with mortgage don’t pay taxes either, that the mortgage company pays the taxes. After all if you don’t make the payments the mortgage company will still pay the taxes most if the time…

You assume escrow exists within rental agreements thereby awarding a tenant the credit for paying taxes.

It's very clear who was indoctrinated rather than educated in this thread.

 

[Ingomike]

You assume escrow exists within rental agreements thereby awarding a tenant the credit for paying taxes.

It's very clear who was indoctrinated rather than educated in this thread.

I don’t assume anything, I said you probably believe that too as it is as ridiculous as your other assertion. The good news for property owners is that most renters are ignorant that they are being charged near double the property taxes of those affluent enough to buy their own property thus making it harder to save to actually buy a property of their own….

 

[ditcherman]

Pretty basic stuff here fellas, but leave it to INGO to not understand the basics...

Did you know that the wet grass in your yard in the evening is not dew?
Maybe it’s different between renters and owners though…

 

[phylodog]

After all if you don’t make the payments the mortgage company will still pay the taxes most if the time…

Sweet! I guess I've been wasting my money all these years! Who knew!