Lightweight 44mag revolvers...thoughts?

[abuckle]

I say this as a man who has more .357 magnums than any sane man ought to own..I mean in all flavors...From 640-1 to a couple model 28-2's and everything in between.....For my "woods" gun or "farm" gun I have switched to either my 629, Ruger New Vaquero in 45 ACP (Birdshead 3.5 inch barrel...Cute as the dickens), New Vaquero in 45 long colt or (my beater) Uberti Hombre with new springs in same caliber....Here is why....

We have copperheads on our property.....I have found (even though I have not ever had to shoot one thanks to our 7.5 long black snake that resides under the house) that on paper the 45 long colt or 44 special do much better with shot loads than the .357 magnum....Plus the bore diameter puts the SSA clones a little lighter than the .357 magnum ones...

All offered IMHO....

Here is the NV in 45 ACP....Shot loads out of it perform as well as the 45 long colt....

This shows you the kind of land we have.....It's very "snakey"...I do not harm snakes but my young daughter is on the autism spectrum so any copperhead by the house will be dealt with.........

This video helped me change my mind on my summer carry.....

[video=youtube;EB8mIjFr8tQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EB8mIjFr8tQ[/video]

Thanks for the info

 

[abuckle]

Honestly, a short barrelled 44mag is pointless. A Glock 20 10mm will be lighter and carry more rounds and have more energy with hot ammo than a short barelled 44. You lose a -lot- of energy dropping below a 4"bbl in 44. I carry my 44mag when I want something with more punch than my 10mm and that means 6"bbl+. 44snubbies are good for throwing a fireball but less optimal for utilizing the capability of the round.

I agree here with the snubbed nose 44's, I am considering the ultralight 4" versions. I guess I should have been more clear on that in my original post. Good points though.

 

[abuckle]

I have owned a 4 1/4" Model 69 and will be replacing it with the2 3/4" version soon. I found it to be brisk with full house loads and very tolerable with 44 Specials. My go to load in Specials is 6.8 grains of Unique under a 250 grain SWC.

I still have and will probably never part with a Model 329PD. The full magnum loads are not pleasant at all to shoot, but with Specials it is very comfortable and controllable.

With a load tailored to your comfort level, both will of these guns are tough to beat. However, if you are not a reloader, you would probably be served better with a 357 Magnum revolver or a 10mm auto.

Thanks for these comments, I did not consider the 10mm option as others have mentioned. I am not a re-loader (yet), but have considered it in the future. I think I like revolvers for their simplicity out in the woods, its one thing that is (fingers crossed) will work we needed. The semi autos make me nervous in that setting if a jam occurs, or if if gets dropped in direct/mud or something. I am probably being a bit dramatic, but just thinking through what would be simplest.

 

[abuckle]

A couple of you mentioned the chest rigs, I have seen these in the past, I tried one a few years back and wasn't impressed. Camping John in my other thread recommended this instead for hiking: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00Q56LMIC/_encoding=UTF8?coliid=ILKDVTRQ6TCZV&colid=9IRW7MMSUW1P&psc=0

Not cheap, but looks practical. Anyone else have any experience with these?
I also tried a drop leg holster, but with my heavy 44 mag it wasn't comfortable.

Maybe I need to look more into the ballistics of the .357 round again. Any suggestions on where I can view some current research?
Thanks for all the replies!

 

[Route 45]

A couple of you mentioned the chest rigs, I have seen these in the past, I tried one a few years back and wasn't impressed. Camping John in my other thread recommended this instead for hiking: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00Q56LMIC/_encoding=UTF8?coliid=ILKDVTRQ6TCZV&colid=9IRW7MMSUW1P&psc=0

Not cheap, but looks practical. Anyone else have any experience with these?
I also tried a drop leg holster, but with my heavy 44 mag it wasn't comfortable.

Maybe I need to look more into the ballistics of the .357 round again. Any suggestions on where I can view some current research?
Thanks for all the replies!

Buffalo Bore is some of the most powerful ammunition available. Their website lists real world velocities of their ammo fired from actual firearms, not test barrels. An easy way to compare calibers to each other with regards to ballistics:

https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_list&c=146

 

[abuckle]

Buffalo Bore is some of the most powerful ammunition available. Their website lists real world velocities of their ammo fired from actual firearms, not test barrels. An easy way to compare calibers to each other with regards to ballistics:

https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_list&c=146

Thanks for the link, I'll check it out.

 

[snowwalker]

S&W used to make what is called a 'mountain gun' in 44 mag. It would be a good carry gun on trails or hunting. They are kind of a collector's piece, but a well made S&W, unlike what S&W makes today.

 

[prescut]

The OP said it was for woods gun, so he is concerned with weight. He has a heavier 44 mag. He later said bear country.

I am a handloader with 44 mags, 357 max, and 45 colt. I'm almost 69.
I woods carry a 13 oz SW 360PD in 357 mag. Like someone above said, the scandium revolvers can be painful when shooting paper. My 360 is loaded to shoot right at 1000fps. Carry lots, shoot little.

During my one encounter where I had to fire, I didn't even feel the recoil. My attention was on the danger. Now, 10 minutes later I looked down at my black and blue palm and said, "Ouch".

I would carry more weight if I could. I can't. So I went with the caliber for that weight gun and possible targets. I love the 38/357 caliber, but I do not think it is enough gun in bear country especially in a 2" barrel with low velocity.

If I was back in Montana I think I would move up to the 329 4" in 44 mag at 25oz. That's almost twice the weight of the 360. I can make my handloads achieve whatever velocity/recoil I want.
Although I shoot a fair amount of heavy recoil revolvers, I would never load that 329 with a hot load 44mag. I can hear the damage to bone, ligaments, and muscle from my easy chair. Mid level mag loads and 44 special give good stopping power with manageable recoil.

The guys who say a carry shouldn't be comfortable, it should be comforting; are full of horse pucky. If it is too heavy to carry comfortably, you won't carry it. The best gun is the one you have with you.

 

[roscott]

A few thoughts:

1. When you say "bear country" is that black bears or brown bears? Black bears I would be willing to fight armed with a big rock (have done that,) and would be happy with a .45 or .357 any day. Brown bears, I wouldn't want to fight with an AK or 12 gauge. The only time I've been threatened by one, my only thought was outrunning the guy next to me.

2. You say you're looking for a gun that's easy to carry backpacking and fun at the range. IMHO these two are mutually exclusive in a bear-qualified caliber. I purchased a 3" 629 Mountain Gun, and it's just too dang heavy for serious backpacking. The triple K chest rig posted upthread helps significantly, but ounces are ounces when it comes to rucking miles.

I like the look of that Taurus posted earlier, or I would look into a Glock 10mm. My 629 is 44oz, and it's just too dang heavy. A 24oz Taurus is the same weight as a Glock 19 with a half mag of ammo, so that seems pretty reasonable to me.

 

[abuckle]

Thanks prescut and roscott for the comments, someone previously mentioned the Buffalo Bore Ammo company, they have some great articles that were interesting. In short the author (who lives and hunts from what I could read grizzlies and down) claimed .357 would keep you alive. I agree that a bear gun and a fun range gun are not likely to overlap, but was trying to make a gun serve more than one purpose I guess. It might be feeble thinking. All of the comments on the 329pd agree with the comments here, I have spoken with a few owners of the gun as well and basically state full 4mags are just too rough in that light of a gun. I think I can get what I am wanting ultimately out of a small frame 4" .357. I took a trip to the gun store today and found the Ruger SP101 4" to be reasonable. It is 30ish oz in weight. Holsters seem limited, but their are some good chest rigs out there I have noticed and I think it might serve as a decent range gun too. My current 44 mag is 45oz and as someone mentioned simply too heavy for hiking, so it may go back on the market, who knows. I do take it deer hunting and has served as a good backup to my rifle.

 

[Drail]

A lightweight revolver in .44 Magnum is also serves as a great inertial bullet puller. And the heavier the load the more it will pull bullets. After firing the first 3 or 4 rounds the last two rounds in the cylinder have been jerked back very sharply 3 or 4 times. If you really need a heavy caliber like the .44 Mag. - don't buy a lightweight gun. Eventually it will hang up on you and leave you with a lightweight bludgeon.

 

[Skullglide]

Abuckle. Check out the Gunfighters Inc Kenai chest rig. I have this with a shell for my 3” GP100 and my 4” 28-2. I went through a similar quest of bear gun protection revolver. I had a 3 3/4” super Blackhawk .44, Alaskan .44. Both of these were just to heavy. Unfortunately I have a lot of previous damage in both hands and wrists. The recoil was not great for as much as I shoot. I posted a WTB ad here for a 3” SP101. I ended up getting a 3” adj sight GP100. It has been great and gets shot and carried a lot. After a lot of research and talking to people who live in bear country. The right ammo and practice are key.

 

[Skullglide]

View attachment 63199 Here is the chest rig with View attachment 63199

 

[Ruspath]

I was wondering why you are replacing the 4 1/4 version with the 2 3/4? I went over thais subject for several weeks and will get the 69 4 1/4 version over the short barrel 69 and N frames on Tuesday.

One thing I haven't seen here is the sizing of the N frame (of which I have 5, all with Hogue Grips) which is the upper limit for double action in medium size hands) and the better fit I have with my 686 L frame, same as the 69. I figured to split the difference in barrel length with the 4 1/4.

I don't anticipate a steady diet of full power magnums in the 69 but it is nice to know it is available. Don't know how well the lighter L frame would hold up but I guess it will be long before I ever shoot enough to find out.

Longtime 44 special lover (24, and 624 snub from the mid eighties) so I will shoot more 44 specials, or hand load down on 44 mag with 2400.

 

[two70]

Thanks prescut and roscott for the comments, someone previously mentioned the Buffalo Bore Ammo company, they have some great articles that were interesting. In short the author (who lives and hunts from what I could read grizzlies and down) claimed .357 would keep you alive. I agree that a bear gun and a fun range gun are not likely to overlap, but was trying to make a gun serve more than one purpose I guess. It might be feeble thinking. All of the comments on the 329pd agree with the comments here, I have spoken with a few owners of the gun as well and basically state full 4mags are just too rough in that light of a gun. I think I can get what I am wanting ultimately out of a small frame 4" .357. I took a trip to the gun store today and found the Ruger SP101 4" to be reasonable. It is 30ish oz in weight. Holsters seem limited, but their are some good chest rigs out there I have noticed and I think it might serve as a decent range gun too. My current 44 mag is 45oz and as someone mentioned simply too heavy for hiking, so it may go back on the market, who knows. I do take it deer hunting and has served as a good backup to my rifle.

FYI, here's an interesting article on bear attacks stopped by handguns. Some surprisingly weak calibers have been used to successfully stop bear attacks and even to kill the attacking bears.

 

[abuckle]

View attachment 63199 Here is the chest rig with View attachment 63199

Thanks Skullglide, this is helpful. I have seen these online as well, a bit pricey but looks comfortable, reliable and user friendly.

 

[abuckle]

I was wondering why you are replacing the 4 1/4 version with the 2 3/4? I went over thais subject for several weeks and will get the 69 4 1/4 version over the short barrel 69 and N frames on Tuesday.

One thing I haven't seen here is the sizing of the N frame (of which I have 5, all with Hogue Grips) which is the upper limit for double action in medium size hands) and the better fit I have with my 686 L frame, same as the 69. I figured to split the difference in barrel length with the 4 1/4.

I don't anticipate a steady diet of full power magnums in the 69 but it is nice to know it is available. Don't know how well the lighter L frame would hold up but I guess it will be long before I ever shoot enough to find out.

Longtime 44 special lover (24, and 624 snub from the mid eighties) so I will shoot more 44 specials, or hand load down on 44 mag with 2400.

Well I started a conversation in a previous post about 3" or 4" .357 revolvers. Then a person recommended the .44mag S&W 329PD. I spoke to several owners of that gun and basically for my purposes wouldn't likely need the full 44 mag power. I have a 44 mag its just too heavy for hiking/backpacking. The lightweight without the powerful rounds made the gun purpose a bit obsolete. SO I went ahead and got the Ruger SP101 in 4". Its 30oz,.357 and is comfortable. The idea was it was light enough to carry in the woods, powerful enough to address threats, and long enough for hunting and having a bit of fun at the range. It may not be the best decision for everyone, but I am pleased with my decision. Hope this clarifies

 

[abuckle]

FYI, here's an interesting article on bear attacks stopped by handguns. Some surprisingly weak calibers have been used to successfully stop bear attacks and even to kill the attacking bears.

Thanks for the post, I also read another article through Buffalo Bore group. They shared that the type of bear is important. Grizzly being a tougher issue, but a maimed Black bear would leave you alone, which a .357 would satisfy your needs. So I went that route, if in more "dangerous" country, I'll pack a bigger gun.

 

[two70]

Thanks for the post, I also read another article through Buffalo Bore group. They shared that the type of bear is important. Grizzly being a tougher issue, but a maimed Black bear would leave you alone, which a .357 would satisfy your needs. So I went that route, if in more "dangerous" country, I'll pack a bigger gun.

The article I linked specifies the type of bear in each case study and I found it interesting the number of grizzlies that were killed or stopped with 9mms or a .45 acp. Personally I would want at least a 10mm in bear country regardless of type of bear but I don't feel the need for anything bigger than a .44 mag.