Officer kills armed civilian

[Sigblitz]

I'm not rushing to judgment on this. I truly believe he was not a criminal of any sort, a good husband, father, grandfather and an upstanding businessman. I also have no reason to believe the trooper was out to execute an innocent citizen on the side of a relatively busy highway. Something went horribly wrong and I would like to take the opportunity to learn from the event and not have it repeated.

 

[Sigblitz]

Did someone say shootered? It's not New Year's eve yet but ok.

 

[Fargo]

Did that apply to this situation?

Could, if the reporting on when/why the lights came on is correct. Front deck, rear deck, commands given on approach etc.

 

[jsharmon7]

I'm not rushing to judgment on this. I truly believe he was not a criminal of any sort, a good husband, father, grandfather and an upstanding businessman. I also have no reason to believe the trooper was out to execute an innocent citizen on the side of a relatively busy highway. Something went horribly wrong and I would like to take the opportunity to learn from the event and not have it repeated.

This is the best comment of the thread. It seems unlikely this guy was going to shoot a Trooper, and it seems unlikely the Trooper was just itching to shoot a guy.

If I recall correctly, ISP was having some trouble with people stealing broken down vehicles on highways. I would guess the Trooper was investigating the situation as such. If he thinks he might be approaching such a situation, and then someone puts his hand on a gun, I can see the tension. I hope the full story comes out so all of us can consider how we would/should respond to a similar situation.

 

[2A_Tom]

I'm not rushing to judgment on this. I truly believe he was not a criminal of any sort, a good husband, father, grandfather and an upstanding businessman. I also have no reason to believe the trooper was out to execute an innocent citizen on the side of a relatively busy highway. Something went horribly wrong and I would like to take the opportunity to learn from the event and not have it repeated.

This is the best comment of the thread. It seems unlikely this guy was going to shoot a Trooper, and it seems unlikely the Trooper was just itching to shoot a guy.

If I recall correctly, ISP was having some trouble with people stealing broken down vehicles on highways. I would guess the Trooper was investigating the situation as such. If he thinks he might be approaching such a situation, and then someone puts his hand on a gun, I can see the tension. I hope the full story comes out so all of us can consider how we would/should respond to a similar situation.

I believe the whole story is out.

There were only two persons present, The officer and Mr. Rightsell.

The officer reports that while approaching Mr. Rightsell, he gave commands which Mr. Rightsell did not follow and reached for his gun. When the officer perceived that Mr. Rightsell was attempting to draw his gun, the officer drew and fired his service pistol, hitting Mr. Rightsell.

When Mr. Rightsell fell to the ground, the officer removed himself to a safe distance in case Mr. Rightsell were to return fire, and calledfor back up.

The officer waited until back up arrived and with their help they disarmed and took Mr. Rightsell into custody.

Mr. Rightsell says...

There were no other witnesses or video of the shooting.

 

[Lelliott8]

Lots of people at his vigil with many nice things to say about him. One man said he knew Glen his entire life and called the officer’s claim “a bulls**t lie”.

 

[Coach]

I never mentioned a t shirt in my post but hell yes it can put the world at ease. Touching a OPEN gun can be seen as a threat.

I mentioned a t shirt because that would be concealment. What about touching a concealed gun is that a threat? Touching any gun does not mean threat. The totality of the circumstances would mean a lot.

 

[Coach]

A man was in a place he had the right to be. Along a public road working on his daughters vehicle. No outstanding warrants for his arrest that have been reported. He gets shot and killed. This is a tragedy. Much more information is needed on this situation.

This is a time and a place where a body cam would do a lot of good.

 

[HKUSP]

Sigh... I don't like any of this. The police in Ohio after we got concealed carry were jumpy, and we were legally required to notify them if we were interacting with them in an official capacity. OC (which had always been legal) started picking up popularity and it got worse. It was an adversarial, distrustful situation that still has echoes today.

There are always three sides to this, and two always come out swinging. "The cops are always wrong, and the cops are always right". I think side three like myself that do not hate the police but have a feeling that there is a double standard emerging watch it all with skepticism, fueled by a certain amount of thinking "that could have been me". Philando Castile comes to mind. We sit back, watch, and wait for answers that just don't seem to come. I, myself, am also quite skeptical of the job the media does reporting incidents as well and that doesn't help either.

It pays as an armed citizen to think these possibilities through. If you're going to be tinkering with a vehicle on the side of the road that's already attracted attention then you should expect there's a real certainty the police might show up. I have been in that exact situation before, and the guns stayed hidden. I've been helped with flat tires and just being sat with while a tow truck was on the way so I wouldn't get hit. I am grateful for the assistance of several police departments have rendered in those situations and those interactions were friendly. I also has enough situational awareness to have my ID in a top shirt pocket and ready to go when the police arrived. Everyone was happy with that. Even in normal life not expecting to have to interact with the police I NEVER carry my wallet on my gun side. I also don't put a whole lot of faith in a dispatcher passing along all of the pertinent information. Been there too.

I don't really know who is at fault here, and suspect we're never going to find out. It's a tragedy that someone that didn't need to had to die just for the sake of a teachable moment. A man's life is worth more than that. Sometimes what's legal, right, and smart don't end up being the same thing.

Chris

 

[JCSR]

I mentioned a t shirt because that would be concealment. What about touching a concealed gun is that a threat? Touching any gun does not mean threat. The totality of the circumstances would mean a lot.

Concealed means the general public or LEO's do not know you are armed. I shouldn't have to explain the difference in touching an exposed handgun. You are trying to flip my question to promote your agenda. Even with my limited experience and low post count I can clearly see what you're doing.

 

[455 Beretta]

Law officers have a lot of responsibility and are trained to “react” correctly. I am guessing a lot of that “reaction” becomes second nature after training is ingrained (the whole point of training, right?).

Even if the officer had totally neutral bias (no preconceived notion that the person was upstanding or criminal) if someone looks like they are reaching for a weapon, what would one expect the officer to do, wait and see if the other gun is completely unholstered before reacting? Wait until the gun is pointed at him before reacting? Wait until the first shot is fired by the other person? That’s asking a lot more of any human than can be expected.

Bad citizen? No, doesn’t seem like it. Bad cop? Maybe, maybe not. But I know if I’m on the job and on the receiving end of a threat, trainined ingrained instinct has got to kick in...if it doesn’t, then what do we expect the poor guy to do? Especially if he doesn’t have years of experience to begin to be able to “feel” as situation out?

This is the internet, but away from the keyboard, some guy killed someone while trying to do a job he may have loved and been paid sh*t for, with high expectations that he act like a machine at times and with some divine discretion at others. It’s almost an unrealistic expectation, which expectation may differ from audience to audience.

 

[bwframe]

...This is a time and a place where a body cam would do a lot of good.

Yep.

 

[HKUSP]

Even if the officer had totally neutral bias (no preconceived notion that the person was upstanding or criminal) if someone looks like they are reaching for a weapon, what would one expect the officer to do, wait and see if the other gun is completely unholstered before reacting? Wait until the gun is pointed at him before reacting? Wait until the first shot is fired by the other person? That’s asking a lot more of any human than can be expected.

As a regular citizen, I feel like that's the standard I'm being held to. It's vexing.

 

[455 Beretta]

As a regular citizen, I feel like that's the standard I'm being held to. It's vexing.

Indeed. It’s asking too much of any human human, regardless of which end of a weapon they’re on.

 

[Coach]

Concealed means the general public or LEO's do not know you are armed. I shouldn't have to explain the difference in touching an exposed handgun. You are trying to flip my question to promote your agenda. Even with my limited experience and low post count I can clearly see what you're doing.

No you do not. Because I do not have an agenda other than wanting justice to prevail. I also don't want to see OC blamed for something so I commented on your idea. This thread had a tremendous amount of issues hanging around on it. I don't like the situation at all. I don't like it being insinuated that the man was killed because his handgun was in the open.

 

[Denny347]

Law officers have a lot of responsibility and are trained to “react” correctly. I am guessing a lot of that “reaction” becomes second nature after training is ingrained (the whole point of training, right?).

Even if the officer had totally neutral bias (no preconceived notion that the person was upstanding or criminal) if someone looks like they are reaching for a weapon, what would one expect the officer to do, wait and see if the other gun is completely unholstered before reacting? Wait until the gun is pointed at him before reacting? Wait until the first shot is fired by the other person? That’s asking a lot more of any human than can be expected.

As a regular citizen, I feel like that's the standard I'm being held to. It's vexing.

Not that this applies here, but an officer does not have to wait for a gun to be unholstered. There are no universal standards for non-LEO's similar to Graham v Connor

 

[HKUSP]

I don't like the situation at all. I don't like it being insinuated that the man was killed because his handgun was in the open.

Despite my earlier comments, I'm right there with you. I used to OC a lot in Ohio, not so much here.

There have been enough incidents nationally lately of a good guy with a gun being shot it's changed my outlook on whether or not I would intervene in any sort of public shooting. We're all on our own at this point. I'm not willing to help anyone I do not know, and that's sad in and of itself.

 

[HKUSP]

Not that this applies here, but an officer does not have to wait for a gun to be unholstered. There are no universal standards for non-LEO's similar to Graham v Connor

This is fair how exactly? Perhaps you see how some of us feel trapped in the middle. We have to worry about fire from both directions. It makes you want to give up on society all together.

 

[JCSR]

No you do not. Because I do not have an agenda other than wanting justice to prevail. I also don't want to see OC blamed for something so I commented on your idea. This thread had a tremendous amount of issues hanging around on it. I don't like the situation at all. I don't like it being insinuated that the man was killed because his handgun was in the open.

Coach we just have to disagree. This is an unfortunate situation and it's not about me. Sorry for being disrespectful to alll involved.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Not worked up here at all, and yes, you are certainly entitled to your opinion..

Well, his opinion was actually correct. Blood spatter is hardly an exact science, mainly because of all the variables which can create different spatter. In fact, blood spatter analysis isn't as often used as "hollywood" would have you believe. If your sister was teaching blood spatter, as a college course, geeeeeeeez..... I gotta wonder how long ago that was.