Powder or Primers?

[NullSyndrome]

Assuming you had enough bullets, which would you be more concerned with there possibly being a shortage of?

In other words, if you only had enough money to buy one or the other, would you buy 1000 primers, or 1lb of powder?

(this is hypothetical, I know there is a price difference.)

 

[sloughfoot]

I buy primers by the case and powder by the keg. Therefore, I don't worry about temporary shortages.

I did not vote in your survey.

 

[Fishersjohn48]

I buy primers each and powder by the grain. I also did not vote.

 

[NullSyndrome]

I buy primers each and powder by the grain. I also did not vote.

 

[bluewraith]

I voted primers, as powder seems to last a lot longer depending on what you are loading.

 

[billybob44]

Take long to count the GRAINS?? HA HA...

I buy primers each and powder by the grain. I also did not vote.

Sure you do Fish---Just how many grains DO you have????????Bill.

 

[shibumiseeker]

A thousand primers or a pound of powder is a quantity so small as to not be worth considering.

But, in the spirit of your poll, it's harder to manufacture primers than powder. Double or single based powders are relatively easy to make in a true long term shortage situation, but perchlorate or chlorate primers with the little cups and anvils are more difficult (but not impossible). Lead azide or lead styphenate priming compounds are much more difficult, and even mercury fulminate is going to be difficult as mercury is very hard to find anymore.

Primers are so cheap that there is absolutely no excuse not to have a ten year supply of them sitting around. They'll be like currency regardless if SHTF or not. I can sell every box of primers I now have for more than I bought them for today if I want.

 

[lon]

... perchlorate or chlorate primers with the little cups and anvils are more difficult (but not impossible). Lead azide or lead styphenate priming compounds are much more difficult, and even mercury fulminate is going to be difficult as mercury is very hard to find anymore.

Primers are so cheap that there is absolutely no excuse not to have a ten year supply of them sitting around.

Here's an old thread using strike anywhere matches for the compound.

https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/ammunition_and_reloading/38590-reloading_spent_primers.html

Never tried it, but I did buy a couple boxes of strike anywheres...they're nice to have around anyway.

I'm with you on the long term supply idea, I'm still shooting Federal Match Rifle primers (in the red box)from the '94 shortage

 

[chuddly]

i voted primers....but i agree that both are such a small amount that if your only buying that much then you are already behind the curve

 

[Broom_jm]

If you have 50,000 primers and no powder...or 20# of powder and no primers...what difference does it make? If you're not prepared, you're not prepared.

"Would you spend money on food or water, in the case of a disaster?"

Well, maybe you can survive longer without food than you can potable water, but if the goal is to be PREPARED...get both!

 

[NullSyndrome]

i voted primers....but i agree that both are such a small amount that if your only buying that much then you are already behind the curve

Keep in mind however, that not everyone who reloads is a high volume shooter.

 

[dom1104]

What are you preparing for? a war?



Figure out how much you plan on shooting, buy enough to support that habit for as long as you figure you will need to.

its not rocket science.....

 

[shibumiseeker]

Keep in mind however, that not everyone who reloads is a high volume shooter.

So? I think every shooter should stash away some primers and powder whether they reload or not. Stored properly they don't go bad and they are easy to sell if one needs cash.

If every shooter out there had 5k of primers for each primer size and a couple of 8lb jugs each of a common pistol and rifle powder then ammo shortages would be a moot issue because you can always find a friend that is willing to trade letting you use his reloading equipment and some tutorage in exchange for some.

But that's ok, I'm resigned to the fact that during the NEXT shortage we'll have people complaining that they can't buy stuff or that the prices have shot through the roof again, and I'm planning on fleecing them when the "low volume shooter" "needs" just one box of primers. Historically speaking the shortages have lasted about 2 years, so if everyone had a 5-10 year supply then there wouldn't be a shortage. During the last shortage I kept several friends supplied with components and when stuff started to come down in price and be available I told then that they'd better stock up because the next time around I wasn't going to be as generous if they didn't.

 

[Fishersjohn48]

So? I think every shooter should stash away some primers and powder whether they reload or not. Stored properly they don't go bad and they are easy to sell if one needs cash.

If every shooter out there had 5k of primers for each primer size and a couple of 8lb jugs each of a common pistol and rifle powder then ammo shortages would be a moot issue because you can always find a friend that is willing to trade letting you use his reloading equipment and some tutorage in exchange for some.

But that's ok, I'm resigned to the fact that during the NEXT shortage we'll have people complaining that they can't buy stuff or that the prices have shot through the roof again, and I'm planning on fleecing them when the "low volume shooter" "needs" just one box of primers. Historically speaking the shortages have lasted about 2 years, so if everyone had a 5-10 year supply then there wouldn't be a shortage. During the last shortage I kept several friends supplied with components and when stuff started to come down in price and be available I told then that they'd better stock up because the next time around I wasn't going to be as generous if they didn't.

While I agree and I tend to keep more than a few around, wouldn't everyone stocking up like that CREATE a shortage?

 

[shibumiseeker]

While I agree and I tend to keep more than a few around, wouldn't everyone stocking up like that CREATE a shortage?

Not if it's not being done all at once but over time.

The last shortage was sort of a quadruple whammy: the election happened at a time when there were two active wars going on at the same time a lot of the cheap surplus ammo from eastern bloc countries supply was drying up and all this while metals prices were peaking. The manufacturers couldn't keep up with the rapid increase in demand as a result as there wasn't much excess capacity in the system so once distributors stocks fell it took a while for the manufacturers to ramp up capacity, and during that time period there were 3-4 month waits and because everyone was panicked the stock was snapped up in excess as soon as it was available and idiots who had never thought to reload were paying $100+ for a box of primers so they could have it Right Now. Other people were buying every box they could at $50 a box so they could sell it to idiots at $100+ a box.

Meanwhile, I hunkered down, cut my normal orders in half and paid a little more per shipment and waited patiently the 3-4 months it took to fill the backorders and kept some friends in supply and helped others by trading them even for types of primers they needed but didn't have for primers they had extras of.

There's only a very few manufacturers of the primary components and it took them about 9-12 months to ramp up production and another 6 months to clear all the backorders. In the meantime Iraq was winding down and the metals prices came down somewhat. So right now we are sitting on extra capacity and relatively low prices and several months out from the potential start of new panic buying. It's the perfect time to stock up, not early December. If there is panic buying then we'll have helped lessen the impact. If there's no panic buying then we'll have helped the manufacturers smooth the transition to reduced production.

 

[NullSyndrome]

What are you preparing for? a war?



Figure out how much you plan on shooting, buy enough to support that habit for as long as you figure you will need to.

its not rocket science.....

Perhaps I should have worded the poll "Which do you think there will more likely be a shortage of, powder or primers." That would have been more clear.

Instead it has become a discussion of stockpiling and wether or not it is smart for small volume reloaders to buy in small quantities (like a box of 1000 primers). Not a bad discussion, but not what I was really getting at.

 

[red_zr24x4]

I voted to buy the powder, because if powder/ primers are in that much of a shortage you can always do this--
The Firearm Blog » Reusing primers

 

[XtremeVel]

Perhaps I should have worded the poll "Which do you think there will more likely be a shortage of, powder or primers." That would have been more clear.
.

If going by past times of shortages, I would say primers... Powder, while some of the more desired types can also become somewhat scarce, it always seemed like I could always get something that would work decently...

A question I hear often asked lately is from new gun owners asking about the last shortage a few years ago and are looking into getting into reloading now due to fears of it happening again. It seems like $300-500 is the range many are limited to initially... There has been a few that want to become moderate shooters and might be better served spending the majority of what they have now on consumables such as powder and primers and saving and getting the press and tooling later.

 

[lon]

... There has been a few that want to become moderate shooters and might be better served spending the majority of what they have now on consumables such as powder and primers and saving and getting the press and tooling later.

Good thinking... I don't see primers or powder getting any cheaper. Buy 8#jug of a wide range powder (231, unique, etc. for pistols) and 10-15 k primers from Powder Valley, and you'll be set for a lot of shooting. The tools (and good, usable bullets) will always be available.

 

[XtremeVel]

Good thinking... I don't see primers or powder getting any cheaper. Buy 8#jug of a wide range powder (231, unique, etc. for pistols) and 10-15 k primers from Powder Valley, and you'll be set for a lot of shooting. The tools (and good, usable bullets) will always be available.

It's the new gun owners I find having sympathy for, not so much the reloaders that have seen shortages before and still have not prepared...

Giving the advice of buying the components first might seem back asswards to some, but it's the advice I have recently given a few looking to get into reloading. I did it because their reason was solely because they want to have immunity against any possible future shortages... And for full disclosure, I can give this advice and feel good about it because these looking to get into reloading are people I have known for YEARS and see daily. They all fully understand if funds and/or availabilty were to be an issue later on all the other things ( press, dies, tooling, ect), that they would be more than welcome to use mine. Heck, they are even aware for a six pack of my favorite beer, they could even send the brass home with me the night before and it would be tumbled and waiting for them.