Question for any parents/new parents on the forum

[hoosierdoc]

CDC - Vaccine History - Vaccine Safety

Vaccines have done more to ensure the health and life expectancy of Americans than any other medical advance. As was stated, forget about thimerosol. Diet Cokes probably have aluminum in them too in super low concentrations.

Vaccinate your kid. If you'd rather space them out for some reason, fine. But you may pay more as it requires more doctor visits and it's possible insurance won't cover all of the visits (no idea though).

I commend you for being vigilent when it comes to the health of your kids, but vaccines are your friend.

 

[travisbelt]

My son is 5 and my daughter turns 3 in January, both of which have received all of the recommended vaccinations. I was definitely nervous about them because of the links to different complications. We had a really good relationship with our pediatrician, and through discussion, we felt much better about trusting him with these vaccinations. Now that my son is in kindergarten, we would've had to have him vaccinated anyways, so we're comfortable with the decision.

 

[ATOMonkey]

Keep in mind that not all vaccines are manufactured the same way or in the same facility for that matter.

As we've recently seen with these Steroid shots, factories, pharmacies, etc. can screw up.

IMO, it's a roll of the dice. The odds are on your side that there will be no adverse reaction. That doesn't preclude the existence of bad stuff though.

 

[Ted]

Really? Last I looked it is right in the IC, granted it has been a couple years.

The law has been in effect the last 7 years.

IC 20-34-3-2
Religious objections
Sec. 2. (a) Except as otherwise provided, a student may not be required to undergo any testing, examination, immunization, or treatment required under this chapter or IC 20-34-4 when the child's parent objects on religious grounds. A religious objection does not exempt a child from any testing, examination, immunization, or treatment required under this chapter or IC 20-34-4 unless the objection is:
(1) made in writing;
(2) signed by the child's parent; and
(3) delivered to the child's teacher or to the individual who might order a test, an exam, an immunization, or a treatment absent the objection.
(b) A teacher may not be compelled to undergo any testing, examination, or treatment under this chapter or IC 20-34-4 if the teacher objects on religious grounds. A religious objection does not exempt an objecting individual from any testing, examination, or treatment required under this chapter or IC 20-34-4 unless the objection is:
(1) made in writing;
(2) signed by the objecting individual; and
(3) delivered to the principal of the school in which the objecting individual teaches.
As added by P.L.1-2005, SEC.18.

 

[tyrajam]

Good for you for weighing the pro's and con's and doing your own research! I struggled with this idea for all three of my kids. The one thing I will tell you is like MrJarrell said, if you are going to get them space them out. The idea of giving so many shots at once to such a small body is only done for a "protection of the herd" reason. Many parents aren't as diligent as you and don't see a doctor regularly, so if the doc doesn't give them all of the vaccines when he has a chance they might never get them. I have worked in a school for the last 9 years and my parents took in dozens of foster kids when I was younger and the number of parents who never take their kids for regular medical care is astounding.
My parents and grandparents and all of my extended family are very anti vaccine, but if you read the actual incidence rates of the different vaccines, you will see the reactions are very, very low. Low enough to make it worth it for the dangerous diseases. I would never get a flu shot or chicken pox shot, because those are such low risk illnesses, but Measles? It's worth it for me.

 

[steveh_131]

That must somehow turn anecdote into evidence.

You complete your paragraph with a bunch of statements that begin with "I believe." Last I checked, religious statements begin with similar statements.

The possibility of you actually knowing several people who have had serious reactions to vaccines is so remote, that in all likelihood, you're wrong. You may think you're right, but it is more likely true that you've misdiagnosed the cause than you actually having met several people who have had serious complications from a modern vaccine.

I know some of the same people. He's not wrong and there was no misdiagnosis. There were severe neurological reactions immediately following the vaccine, with zero history of neurological problems prior to the vaccination.

Even the CDC acknowledges that there can be severe side effects, why are you pretending that they are non-existent?

 

[steveh_131]

I would never get a flu shot or chicken pox shot, because those are such low risk illnesses, but Measles? It's worth it for me.

Measles has a 0.3% fatality rate in the U.S.

Are we calling that 'high risk' now?

 

[downzero]

Even the CDC acknowledges that there can be severe side effects, why are you pretending that they are non-existent?

They also acknowledge that they are extremely infrequent. Even the doctor in the house is saying to vaccinate your kids and that they are practically a miracle of modern medicine.

There is also no evidence that spacing then out makes any difference, but it can't hurt, do I express no opinion on that.

There is simply no way to defend not vaccinating an otherwise healthy child. Even one child with measles or polio is too many.

 

[steveh_131]

They also acknowledge that they are extremely infrequent. Even the doctor in the house is saying to vaccinate your kids and that they are practically a miracle of modern medicine.

There is also no evidence that spacing then out makes any difference, but it can't hurt, do I express no opinion on that.

There is simply no way to defend not vaccinating an otherwise healthy child. Even one child with measles or polio is too many.

Even one child with permanent neurological damage due to vaccinations is too many.

Let's look at this mathematically.

There were 222 reported cases of measles in the U.S. in 2011. We will ignore the fact that most of those were acquired while traveling abroad. With a total population of approximately 311 million, this comes out to a 0.0000713% change of catching measles in the U.S.

Now if we factor in the 0.3% mortality rate, we are left with 0.0000000214% chance of dying from a measles infection.

This number is so minuscule that I'm not even going to bother factoring in the actual efficacy of the measles vaccine, which we all know to be far below 100%.

Since we have absolutely no idea what damage these vaccines could be causing, why would we so easily dismiss the potential side effects in favor of avoiding a 0.0000000214% chance of a measles death?

 

[rambone]

That must somehow turn anecdote into evidence.

You complete your paragraph with a bunch of statements that begin with "I believe." Last I checked, religious statements begin with similar statements.

The possibility of you actually knowing several people who have had serious reactions to vaccines is so remote, that in all likelihood, you're wrong. You may think you're right, but it is more likely true that you've misdiagnosed the cause than you actually having met several people who have had serious complications from a modern vaccine.

It threatens your worldview to think that I could be right. Everybody knows that reactions only happen after every few zillion shots. It doesn't happen to real people in our lives; vaccines are too miraculous. Only crazy, delusion, stupid, insane, anti-science, unfit parents give any credit to that side of the argument.

When my sister had seizures in front of her doctor after getting recommended vaccines, he didn't believe in harmful reactions either. The "diagnosis" of her reaction was that it was probably her breakfast that caused the attack on her nervous system. Then he wanted her back to sell her 2 more booster shots. You see, when real reactions happen, they are denied and swept under the rug -- left unreported -- so that people can keep believing that reactions are so rare that you'd have to be mentally ill to acknowledge them.

And yes, you can make up your own mind about it, and I am free to think that you are delusional and unfit to be a parent if you do so. I never said that we should use the state to lock you up or that you shouldn't be free to act irrationally, or that your irrationality was a threat to others. It doesn't follow that I have to agree with or condone your choice to do something that is so insanely stupid that it demonstrates why there are people (not me) who think that you ought to lack the ability to make such a profoundly stupid choice.

And yes, refusing to do something for which the benefits so outweigh the potential costs, where the penalty for doing so is the possibility of contracting a disease so terrible that modern science has changed the course of history by practically eradicating it, is crazy. You can think whatever you want about that. Just like you seem to think whatever you want about everything else (and I'm perfectly fine with that). Just don't try to convince me that it's justified other than to someone who has a delusional misunderstanding of what probability is.

The only reason we can sit here and even argue about this is that these vaccines made it drastically more likely that our parents would survive to child bearing age. It's amazing how pompous we've become after the fact, while consuming the benefits of these vaccines....as if to suggest that they're not the miracle they really are.

This is definitely a case of people being entitled to their opinion, and that's about it. Because there's no serious debate about the effectiveness of vaccines except put forth by a bunch of crazy people and discredited, failed scientists.

Did you have to purposely edit in condescending comments into every single line, or did it just flow out naturally that way? Maybe you should introduce yourself to a family harmed by vaccines and tell them how delusional and crazy they are for questioning the miracle.

P.S. Religious arguments often include discussion of miracles.

 

[Benny]

Even one child with permanent neurological damage due to vaccinations is too many.

Let's look at this mathematically.

There were 222 reported cases of measles in the U.S. in 2011. We will ignore the fact that most of those were acquired while traveling abroad. With a total population of approximately 311 million, this comes out to a 0.0000713% change of catching measles in the U.S.

Now if we factor in the 0.3% mortality rate, we are left with 0.0000000214% chance of dying from a measles infection.

This number is so minuscule that I'm not even going to bother factoring in the actual efficacy of the measles vaccine, which we all know to be far below 100%.

Since we have absolutely no idea what damage these vaccines could be causing, why would we so easily dismiss the potential side effects in favor of avoiding a 0.0000000214% chance of a measles death?

First off, I'd be lying if I said I didn't skim through and miss a lot of content in this thread, but why are you hung up on measles? Is that your 1 case that actually has an argument against vaccines or are you just saying that not ALL vaccines are necessary (conceding that some have merit)?

 

[Tactical Dave]

Hey everyone, my daughter was just born Oct 31st 2012. I have some concerns over her first round of vaccinations.

I've been reading up and I'm at a cross road and leaning towards not allowing my child to receive any vaccinations whatsoever.

Mainly because of the ingredients, Thimerosal for one which is Mercury. Formaldehyde is in nearly all vaccines and once it is in your body it does not come out. There are several forms of Aluminum as well.

So the question is are there any other parents who have had this conundrum?

The doctor we have I and my extended family have been going to since he started his practice in 94. We asked him about them ahead of time because we have an extended family member who is autistic. He has done a lot of research on it and told us if there was solid medical proof or if he felt they were unsafe he would not recommend them. Our son got them and he is 3 with no issues.

 

[steveh_131]

First off, I'd be lying if I said I didn't skim through and miss a lot of content in this thread, but why are you hung up on measles? Is that your 1 case that actually has an argument against vaccines or are you just saying that not ALL vaccines are necessary (conceding that some have merit)?

I brought up measles because that's the one that he pointed out.

 

[Benny]

I brought up measles because that's the one that he pointed out.

He brought up polio in the same sentence.

Then there are the others not mentioned...I don't know the numbers on any of them, but feel free to show me statistics as to why it's not better to vaccinate.

 

[Ted]

Even one child with permanent neurological damage due to vaccinations is too many.

Let's look at this mathematically.

There were 222 reported cases of measles in the U.S. in 2011. We will ignore the fact that most of those were acquired while traveling abroad. With a total population of approximately 311 million, this comes out to a 0.0000713% change of catching measles in the U.S.

Now if we factor in the 0.3% mortality rate, we are left with 0.0000000214% chance of dying from a measles infection.

This number is so minuscule that I'm not even going to bother factoring in the actual efficacy of the measles vaccine, which we all know to be far below 100%.

Since we have absolutely no idea what damage these vaccines could be causing, why would we so easily dismiss the potential side effects in favor of avoiding a 0.0000000214% chance of a measles death?

Let us also look at the other facts about the measles.

Before the measles vaccine, nearly every child contracted measles before age 15.

Before the measles vaccine in the United States, according to the CDC, there were:

• Roughly 475 deaths
• 48,000 hospitalized
• 7,000 had seizures
• 1,000 suffered permanent brain damage or deafness.

Today, there are 50 reported cases, that most originate outside the U.S.

 

[Lucas156]

More "freedom loving people" wanting to force their beliefs on others for the good of society. Amusing.

 

[jon5212]

Kinda strange to call me dilusional for not wanting my child to receive vaccines. Once again glad it's no one else's choice but myself and my wife's.

I think it's dilusional to want to pump your 8 pound baby full of toxic chemicals right off the bat.

I myself have not had any vaccines since I was 18 and I'm healthy as a horse, hell I even smoked for 12 years and the last physical I went to the Doctor had to ask me if I smoked.

I just find it hard to believe a government entity IE FDA has OUR best interests at heart... its more like their only interest is how big their pocket book is along with the major drug companies.

Also I'll have to look if there are any studies on non-vaccinated people who have contracted diseases for which vaccines are available.

 

[CitiusFortius]

Had a kid back in march. Dont let internet hype scare you. As with all drugs, there is a very, very, very small chance of sickness.

You need to trust your pedoatrician, dont play doctor with google, just do what the DOCTOR says. To you your child is everything, the doctor has seen hundreds of kids.

If he or she has seen any red flags in the kids before you you would know about it.

 

[GBuck]

Which is funny, what risk does a "non vaccinated" kid pose when everyone else DOES have them? Pretty ironic to me.

Because even though you have been vaccinated, you could lose your immunity or get it and carry it to someone who is not immune.

 

[CitiusFortius]

Kinda strange to call me dilusional for not wanting my child to receive vaccines. Once again glad it's no one else's choice but myself and my wife's.

Then why did you post in a public forum asking other peoples input???

You cant ask for advice then get high and mighty when points of view come out different than your own