questioning the BOB concept

[teddy12b]

I also live in Fort Wayne, and I'll agree that needing a BOB is unlikely, but I still think it's a very good idea to have one ready and be reasonably prepared. The whole point of being prepared isn't to figure out what disaster is going to happen beforehand, it's to be in a better position to continue living after an unknown disaster strikes.

There's probably a lot of people in Japan who just got washed away who would have liked to have had an emergency plan for getting to higher ground with a back pack loaded with supplies. They didn't see that disaster coming until they got hit.

My BOB isn't anything fancy and it came about almost by accident. I had placed an order with armygear.net for 2 cases of MRE's and a new large alice pack with frame. When it all got to the house the wife wasn't to pleased with all the big boxes in the kitchen so I just tried to see if I could get the 24 MRE's into one large alice pack and it did. I've since added other equipment to the pack and removed some of the MRE's, but the idea of a BOB, could be just a glorified tote that has shoulder straps.

I was paying $14 per tote at lows for the heavy duty 400# capacity containers at Lowes that could hold 24 MRE's. I figured why not pay $30 for an Alice pack that could hold the same amount of food, but would be reasonably confortable if we had to leave quickly.

I prepare with a BOB because I'm humble enough to know that I can't predict everything that's going to happen in this world and I'd rather be proactive about survival than reactive. I'm a big believer in "bugging in" because I have a wife and child with another child to arrive any day now, but that doesn't mean that I shoudn't have something ready to go "just in case". BOB's are like car insurance and it's good to have around, but I think we all agree that nobody ever wants to have to use it.

 

[norsk]

Just to be clear (hopefully without sounding argumentative), my only point is that it seems to me that having a bug out *BAG* is not the most useful device for most people. The concept of bug out *BAG* implies one would be able to walk some distance with the supplies kept inside the *BAG*. I absolutely, positively agree that being prepared, and having a kit of some sort is not only a good idea but truly necessary. However, it seems to me that the likelihood of most of us ever having to literally "walk out" is extremely small. Therefore, why have a bug out *BAG* when you could have something else, for example a tote bin? Several previous posters have said that they like the *BAG* because they can just throw it in their car when they make long commutes. I totally agree. But if this is all you are doing with it, why not have something like a tote bin that you can almost certainly fit many more supplies in?

At the end of the day as long as we are prepared in some way we are far ahead of most others. And what works best for you may not work best for me. Personally, when I went to assemble my bug out *BAG*, my though process was the following:
1. Wow, I need to carry a lot of stuff to ensure even a minimum level of survival/defense for myself, wife, and 6 month old.
2. I guess, after putting aside the "tacticool" dreams and really thinking about situations that realistically could happen, it would be highly unlikely that myself, wife, and infant would be "walking out" to some other place to escape said situations.
3. I guess it would be much more likely that in the event of said situations, I would either stay at home or try to escape via auto.
4. If that is the case, why do I need to limit my supplies to what I can fit in a *BAG*?
5. Hmm, it turns out I can fit everything I can think of to keep myself, wife, and infant comfortable for 2-5 days in two Rubbermaid tote bins. I can just keep all of my supplies organized neatly in these. I could also throw these two bins in the back of the Jeep in less than one minute and be on my way to escaping.
6. If this is my situation, I wonder how many other people may not be best served with a bug out *BAG*, but may not think about it because everyone says "oh yeah, you MUST have a BOB to be prepared"?

I hope this makes my point clearer, if it wasn't to begin with.

 

[IndySSD]

Just to be clear (hopefully without sounding argumentative), my only point is that it seems to me that having a bug out *BAG* is not the most useful device for most people. The concept of bug out *BAG* implies one would be able to walk some distance with the supplies kept inside the *BAG*. I absolutely, positively agree that being prepared, and having a kit of some sort is not only a good idea but truly necessary. However, it seems to me that the likelihood of most of us ever having to literally "walk out" is extremely small. Therefore, why have a bug out *BAG* when you could have something else, for example a tote bin? Several previous posters have said that they like the *BAG* because they can just throw it in their car when they make long commutes. I totally agree. But if this is all you are doing with it, why not have something like a tote bin that you can almost certainly fit many more supplies in?

At the end of the day as long as we are prepared in some way we are far ahead of most others. And what works best for you may not work best for me. Personally, when I went to assemble my bug out *BAG*, my though process was the following:
1. Wow, I need to carry a lot of stuff to ensure even a minimum level of survival/defense for myself, wife, and 6 month old.
2. I guess, after putting aside the "tacticool" dreams and really thinking about situations that realistically could happen, it would be highly unlikely that myself, wife, and infant would be "walking out" to some other place to escape said situations.
3. I guess it would be much more likely that in the event of said situations, I would either stay at home or try to escape via auto.
4. If that is the case, why do I need to limit my supplies to what I can fit in a *BAG*?
5. Hmm, it turns out I can fit everything I can think of to keep myself, wife, and infant comfortable for 2-5 days in two [STRIKE]Rubbermaid tote bins[/STRIKE] bags?. I can just keep all of my supplies organized neatly in these. I could also throw these two[STRIKE] bins[/STRIKE] bags in the back of the Jeep in less than one minute and be on my way to escaping.
6. If this is my situation, I wonder how many other people may not be best served with a bug out *BAG*, but may not think about it because everyone says "oh yeah, you MUST have a BOB to be prepared"?

I hope this makes my point clearer, if it wasn't to begin with.

So basically this entire thread and the hours you and your friends have spent discussing this topic is completely based on the semantics between using a bag or a box to hold your preps?

I feel cheated. I thought this topic was going to revolutionize the way I look at preparing to provide for my family in a SHTF scenario....

This discussion does not deliver anything but a forum for you to nitpick people's choice of containers...

 

[teddy12b]

I see what you're saying about the the tote's. I actualyl just started another thread because I was about to purchase a few more of my favorite kind tonight and now I can't because they're no longer available.

I keep a lot of my stuff in totes, just because they are large enough to hold a lot of gear and small enough that I can still man handle them without breaking my back. Part of our emergency plan is folding down the back seat and stuffing the totes in the back of the mini van. The totes will double stack and are a great way to move whatever is in them.

If this is all about why a tote versus a bag, my answer is that I do both. All the preps I have for my family couldn't fit into one bag, so I use a lot of totes. Out of all that gear & food I decided to make one bag that has a little bit of everything. If you're only talking about enough stuff to fill one tote or one bag you need to get going on the prepping. Once I had several totes filled up, I really had to ask myself why not have a bag loaded up and ready?

 

[norsk]

So basically this entire thread and the hours you and your friends have spent discussing this topic is completely based on the semantics between using a bag or a box to hold your preps?

I feel cheated. I thought this topic was going to revolutionize the way I look at preparing to provide for my family in a SHTF scenario....

This discussion does not deliver anything but a forum for you to nitpick people's choice of containers...

I appreciate your response, but I disagree. I think the discussion between using a "bag and box," as you say, is not pedantic. If it is true that for most people for most SHTF scenarios a bag is unrealistic, then choosing a bag would mean unnecessarily limiting what survival/defense supplies one would have at the ready. Going further, it seems to me after reading many, many online comments and discussions about BOBs, most people appear to think that once they assemble their BOB they are "ready for anything." And indeed they may be, but it doesn't seem like these same people have given much thought to the logical extension of a BOB: that the reason you have a BOB in the first place is because you must think you are going to walk somewhere. So, if it is NOT true that you would/could/should walk somewhere either before or after a SHTF scenario, then by focusing on the BOB you would be making yourself not as prepared as you otherwise could be, and therefore lulling yourself into some false sense of security.

Being that the BOB is clearly the "hot topic" right now in discussions of preparedness, if the BOB really isn't the most useful "tool" in the "toolkit," then perhaps people should instead focus on what the most useful tool would be. Perhaps it will be the BOB, but perhaps - like I discovered - there is a better system for you, which could increase your preparedness and therefore also increase your safety in a SHTF scenario.

To me, this is more than semantics. But even if it is simply that, what else am I going to do while playing babysitter with my son today?

 

[Kitty]

Ok, I’ve been following this for a while. Right or wrong here is my opinion.


You have both. Yes, in most situations (let’s arbitrarily say 95% of the time) you will be able to take your vehicle. Totes are great.


But what happens if that other 5% shows its head? The road is closed or impassible? How about running out of gas? Tornado and truck gets crushed? There are scenarios where all you have is what you can carry. In which case, you need to have your bag ready.



I’m putting bags together for my dogs because I won’t leave them behind. Can they ride in the car? Certainly, but if we have to abandon the vehicle or are in a situation where I cannot get my vehicle out (can you say blizzard?), we all have supplies to get us to a safer place.

 

[revance]

Ok, I’ve been following this for a while. Right or wrong here is my opinion.


You have both. Yes, in most situations (let’s arbitrarily say 95% of the time) you will be able to take your vehicle. Totes are great.

+1

Your preps should be modular. First line of defense is having preps for your home. These should be the most elaborate of all of your preps because the chances of using them is far greater than the rest and you are less restricted by volume, weight, etc.

2nd should be your totes, water tanks, gas cans, etc. that you can quickly throw in the back of your car and go.

3rd is the BOB for those crazy times that you don't have time to grab more than one thing OR when you must abandon your vehicle (so throw it in the back with the totes).

My biggest concern is that I don't have any good BOLs. I have places I could evacuate to for a somewhat normal disaster, but I don't have any place I could escape from civilization.


I should add that the great thing about this approach is that it isn't completely necessary to have a bunch of duplicates of things. Obviously more of something is always better, but everything should be tiered. You will ALWAYS have the BOB (home, car, on foot), so that is the most crucial. You don't have to have the same things in your totes (unless you happen to have space/$ for it). Your home preps don't have to have the same thing as your totes since they are stored in the home. Basically you are just packaging your home preps in varying degrees of mobility. The absolute bare essentials should be in something that can be carried on foot. As you work down the priority list, you can make the containers less mobile.

 

[Keith_Indy]

So you're at work, and, for whatever reason, you have to stay there for 3 days. How are you doing for supplies then? They all boxed up nice and neat in your home? Lot good they'll do you there.

I've got min. 3 days worth of food in my car in my BOB. The BOB isn't the end of preparations or a survival plan, it's merely one aspect of it.

 

[flagtag]

I agree that we need supplies stored in such a way that they could easily be thrown into a vehicle for a quick escape if necessary. (in tubs/whatever) But also agree that the necessity to do so might usually be very slim. "Bugging in" would always be preferred to "bugging out".

But, as mentioned before, having a BOB or GHB is also a good idea. We may never know if - while at work for example - something would happen and what got us to work is no longer available (for whatever reason). We would need something to get us home in relative comfort (food/shelter/water/seasonal clothing/etc.)

Having a BOB doesn't limit the amount of supplies at home - it's an additional (good sense) prep bag that can be transported easily enough on one's back, or on something like a game cart - if one is available. (I have one in the bed of my truck to carry more stuff if needed.)

 

[flatlander]

Ok, I’ve been following this for a while. Right or wrong here is my opinion.


You have both. Yes, in most situations (let’s arbitrarily say 95% of the time) you will be able to take your vehicle. Totes are great.


But what happens if that other 5% shows its head? The road is closed or impassible? How about running out of gas? Tornado and truck gets crushed? There are scenarios where all you have is what you can carry. In which case, you need to have your bag ready.



I’m putting bags together for my dogs because I won’t leave them behind. Can they ride in the car? Certainly, but if we have to abandon the vehicle or are in a situation where I cannot get my vehicle out (can you say blizzard?), we all have supplies to get us to a safer place.

This is the best arguement to the O.P. How far can you carry your "tote" if something happens to the Jeep or will you just set up camp right there? There is a survival story (fiction) about a guy who thought he was prepared, vehicle weapons etc and ended up dead because of a knowledge gap. If you think this will work for you then give it a realistic try. Maybe it will. You are the only one who will know for sure.
Myself? Got a fully stocked bag that I can start my life over with pretty quick. It may take a while to get to my major preps from here but I do have a plan to get there

Bob

 

[Libertarian01]

To All,

I will try to address my responses to specific concerns addressed.

The first thing I would like to do is reiterate that when defining "BoB" I am using MY definition for a "Bug out Bag." I did this specifically so that we would not be arguing apples and oranges.

Blackhawk2001 & Keith_Indy, I believe you are referring to what I would call a "Get Home Bag" and I agree entirely with having one of these! Yet the OP was referring to a BoB, again Bug out Bag. IF we are away from home when a crisis occurs then it is 100% useful to have a container that will help sustain us until we can either get home OR to a bug out location. However, this has nothing to do with the definition I used for a BoB. On the creation of a get home bag I will again agree entirely on its potential usefulness.

Kitty, I like your use of the 95% arbitrary number. So with this logic when considering surviving potential threats you should dedicate 95% of your time, energy, money (in short, assets) to be split between a home bunker and a bug out location. How you divide that energy is entirely up to you dependent upon your personal situation. This means, logically, that you should only devote 5% of all prep work on a BoB, including thought and planning.

The problem we all face is that we have limited resources. We cannot devote all of the time, energy, thought, planning, money and effort to adequately deal with every possible event that could occur. Is it possible that there will be a full nuclear exchange between Russia and the United States? Sure it is, but the fact is that the probability of such a disaster is radically reduced from what is was in 1970. The political situation has changed. This means that putting that near the top of the list to prepare against is wasting resources. It would be far better to prepare for a winter ice storm, which is much more likely to occur, and hopefully easier to prepare for.

Let us suppose that we are going to spend $1,000 this year on prepping. You can use whatever number works for your budget but $1k will be easy to divide. If you don't have any food or water resources in your own home would you be better off spending 10%, or $100, on food and water at home or $900? I believe the 90% would be more in line. Now, presume we have enough resources to survive on at home for 6 monthes and we are in the new year spending another $1k. Would it be better to spend 90% of our money on continuing to build our food & water at home OR perhaps better to look at putting some money toward acquiring a bug out location? I would humbly suggest that perhaps a good fallback location might be next in line. Or perhaps putting a good deal of that money toward securing our home/bunker.

If you live in the country and are self sufficient but living on the grid maybe(?) most of your money should go toward wind or solar power in an event.

Each of our individual circumstances will dictate where best to apply our limited resources to get the most bang for our buck.

Given my definition of a BoB I will rate it at being near the very bottom of priorities. This is because I believe for where I live there is almost no likely event where the need for a BoB would place it near the top of the list. If someone wants to plan for the unlikely before the probable I would suggest that you rethink your strategy.

Regards,

Doug

 

[revance]

My argument is that it does not NEED to be 95% on one thing and 5% on a BOB. The BOB contains things also useful when bugging in or if you are leaving in a vehicle. All you are doing is taking the most essential items you SHOULD have anyway and choosing to store them in the most mobile thing... a bag.

Does a bag really cost that much?

Again, don't think of it as additional prep, think of it as how you choose to store the preps you already have. Put some of the most important things in a bag, some of the next most important things in totes, and the things that are too heavy or bulky to take with you on shelves. It is merely an issue of how you are storing the preps you should already have.

 

[shibumiseeker]

Look man, you don't want one, don't have one. Simple as that. You don't need to come onto the net and get everyone to agree with you to justify your decisions. I happen to think it's a poor decision, but it's yours to make since you are the one who has to live with it. The only reason I discussed it in the first place was because I think your logic is flawed and there are plenty of new folks out there who deserve to hear both sides of the considerations. It's not a huge expense, and quite frankly as far as prep items go it's one of the cheaper ones to do, so your arguments about limited resources are silly.

 

[Keith_Indy]

We really are starting to talk semantics here. I've been into preparedness since the late 70's, and it really don't matter what you call it.

If your kit can sustain you for several days to a week (or more,) and you can carry it, it doesn't matter if you are trying to get home, to work, to a cabin retreat, or just vacate an area quickly. In any case you are leaving an area, to go to another area, or trying to sustain yourself in a place where you do not have stored supplies.

Hence, the term Bug Out Bag is sufficient in most cases. That is what my bag is intended for. Whether I'm at work, and the destination is home, or at home, and the destination is an alternate bug out location, I've got the 1 bag. Now, if we can drive, then we'll stuff the car with supplies. But that bag is going to be by my side, and it will be the bag of last resort. No need to transfer anything, cause anything of real value will be in that bag.

As far as totes, I'd make sure you have some means of pulling, or carting the totes to be better prepared. A hand cart for instance that can convert to a 4 wheel cart.

As for probabilities, I suppose it's not at all probable where you live that an ice storm will get you stuck at work overnight?

That happened this past winter to a friend of mine. In that situation, it wasn't safe enough to drive, there were downed power lines and trees anyway. He was lucky it was only 1 night, and there were enough snacks for the few people he was stuck with.

What if that had been longer, say 2 days. Would there have been enough food? I'm diabetic, I'd be going nuts if I didn't have food. It would be detrimental to my survival, as well as those around me.

That's just 1 example out of maybe a dozen real world situations where having that BOB was useful. Here are a few more that have happened to me in the past.

Coming onto a bad car accident, and needing your first aid supplies.
There was the time I needed the fire extinguisher out of my car to put out another persons car fire.
Needing a multi tool to help a friend change the dead battery on his car.
Being in the middle of no-where Indiana on a Sunday, and needing to eat lunch.

Another that just happened, was several homes had to be evacuated because of an ammonia leak. They drag those things all over the place here in Indiana. Being ready to grab a bag and head for other shelter if you live around farmland is a great idea.

The bag is useful outside of full blown SHTF crises. It is not intended to be chucked in the car and forgotten about. It's meant to be useful on a weekly basis.

shibumiseeker has a great point about the BOB being a good starting place for preparations, and being an inexpensive start at that.