Should Trump accept Speaker of the House

[KLB]

I believe that was when they created the country. But after settling the country logistics made mass illegal immigration difficult and we didn’t have millions pouring in to the country…

Things are different now…

They are very different. I am not sure how you can argue someone is only a constitutionalist if they are for a border wall. For much of the history of the country there was no concept of illegal alien.

 

[indyartisan]

Open borders and a welfare state is an idea doomed to fail.

 

[BugI02]

And no, I did not vote for Libertarian for President. I voted for Trump.

It gets hard to tell

When all you have is a Biden, it doesn't seem like it should follow that everything looks like a Trump failure - but the JK wing never ceases to amaze

 

[BugI02]

Well this is certainly more than what Ingomike had to offer at the time. For a minute there I thought he was giving up and conceding.( Even though I don’t really believe that.)

Far too many people are looking for just one thing they can do that will make it all better again. Even the fourth box doesn't offer that

It took 30 or 40 years to get here, it could take 3 or 4 years just to get the rudder hard over on the ship of state. We have a good base of red states still to work with but, as they say, we have to be the change we're looking for as well as remember that 'Perfect is the enemy of good enough'

 

[BugI02]

You do realize that this Trump getting selected for Speaker thing is just a wishful pipe dream, correct? Howbout being realistic and concentrating on doing something else productive?

It is actually worse than that, it is an idea that would shunt one of the few people that is capable of helping us change course into a cup de sac where he will be able to get nothing done. The Democrats are so afraid of a 2nd Trump presidency that they would likely support it. For a part of the electorate that insists Trump is over and done with, everything is certainly still all about Trump. Whistling past the graveyard

 

[BugI02]

Yes I do. How about we abandon the Rino Right and put our efforts into making the GOP the 3rd party? Support independent candidates instead of voting for RINOs to keep the dems out? Take the hit and give notice to the GOP that their supporters are leaving in droves.

Libertarian Party 2.0

Republican Party used to be the party of true conservatives before the CoCRublicans got in bed with business interests. Take back what was ours, Trump gave a master class on how it could be done

 

[BugI02]

Oh, and for gosh sakes, if you want better choices, vote in the primaries! People seem to forget we actually get to decide who's on the November ballot but almost nobody shows up in the spring when they actually have a say on the matter.

Start earlier than that, by encouraging good people to run and showing them they will have support. If you want quality candidates in next years midterm elections you should already be trying to shape who runs in the primary and ensure there is at least one acceptable choice - and be prepared to fail, you can't always get enough people to see past their nose but they never will if we don't try

 

[BugI02]

Did you personally do anything to make it better?

Does kvetching about Trump count?

 

[BugI02]

It was a dumb Ida to begin with (for manifold reasons). Why would I personally aid in its construction?

That's not what he asked you, and you know it. He asked if you had done ANYTHING to make it better not whether you had helped create the wall

I'm going to guess that unless doing tax returns for border jumpers counts as making the situation vis a vis border jumpers better, that the answer will be no

 

[BugI02]

You are assigning your likes to every "conservative" it would seem. The wall was always a boondoggle. It was never going to be built. Someone not supporting it does not make them less conservative.

Holy 'facts not in evidence' Batman! It was in fact in the process of being built and would have continued to be had Trump not been robbed

 

[KG1]

It is actually worse than that, it is an idea that would shunt one of the few people that is capable of helping us change course into a cup de sac where he will be able to get nothing done. The Democrats are so afraid of a 2nd Trump presidency that they would likely support it. For a part of the electorate that insists Trump is over and done with, everything is certainly still all about Trump. Whistling past the graveyard

I think it's going a bridge to far to think that the Democrats would likely strategically support it. That's almost like saying the GOP establishment would support it for the same reason just to keep him from the Presidency. Neither one wants anything to do with Trump having any kind of seat within the Federal government for any reason.

 

[BugI02]

They are very different. I am not sure how you can argue someone is only a constitutionalist if they are for a border wall. For much of the history of the country there was no concept of illegal alien.

That may be a distinction without a difference. If a person is against the only effective measure that can be implemented at the time to control the border, given that the legislative branch had repeatedly abdicated that responsibility, it is difficult to see how such a position can be considered constitutionalist beyond pro forma fealty to seperation of powers

 

[KLB]

Holy 'facts not in evidence' Batman! It was in fact in the process of being built and would have continued to be had Trump not been robbed

Really? You think it would have been completed during his presidency? How much was actually completed before he left office? From what I can find it was 452 miles of wall, of which 80 miles were built where there was no previous barrier of any kind. That left only a little under 1300 miles of wall to build.

You think he had the money to complete it? At $15Bn for that, we're talking about another $40+Bn for the rest of it. He wasn't getting that with a D Congress in charge.

 

[Ingomike]

Really? You think it would have been completed during his presidency? How much was actually completed before he left office? From what I can find it was 452 miles of wall, of which 80 miles were built where there was no previous barrier of any kind. That left only a little under 1300 miles of wall to build.

You think he had the money to complete it? At $15Bn for that, we're talking about another $40+Bn for the rest of it. He wasn't getting that with a D Congress in charge.

Would the racer have won the race if he hadn’t ran out of gas? You are applying the wrong template. If you think I only believe Trump was cheated on Election Day you are wrong. Both Georgia senate seats were stolen and a rising star in Michigan had his senate seat stolen. That would change a lot…

 

[KLB]

Would the racer have won the race if he hadn’t ran out of gas? You are applying the wrong template. If you think I only believe Trump was cheated on Election Day you are wrong. Both Georgia senate seats were stolen and a rising star in Michigan had his senate seat stolen. That would change a lot…

Would it? The House would still be solidly D.

 

[JettaKnight]

It gets hard to tell

When all you have is a Biden, it doesn't seem like it should follow that everything looks like a Trump failure - but the JK wing never ceases to amaze

I wouldn't say Trump was a failure; he just wasn't the messiah the zealots have been prophecying.
And he lost the election; it's time to move on.

 

[KG1]

I wouldn't say Trump was a failure....

Good enough.

 

[BugI02]

Really? You think it would have been completed during his presidency?

WTF, dude? I'm still waiting for the interstate highway system to be 'completed', and it has been almost 66 years

Doesn't mean the parts that got built weren't useful on their own without adding up to the whole thing. Even just concentrating on building the wall in the high traffic areas and forcing the crossers into less favorable and more remote terrain would be useful

Do you actually comprendé why perfect is the enemy of good enough. people who demand that perfection often don't want anything done at all and use those demands to argue against ANYTHING effective being done

If we never do anything that won't be 100% effective, we will never do anything

By that logic we can stop the war on poverty tomorrow because it isn't 100% effective at its stated purpose

We could take 2 or 3% of the money saved and build a Taj MaWall

 

[BugI02]

I wouldn't say Trump was a failure; he just wasn't the messiah the zealots have been prophecying.
And he lost the election; it's time to move on.

Why do I have this vision of you telling the Lord upon his return that New Jerusalem just wasn't done right

 

[JettaKnight]

Why do I have this vision of you telling the Lord upon his return that New Jerusalem just wasn't done right

It ain't happening till Jesus returns, and it certainly won't be accomplished through political means by governments.