This is my first review, so excuse the novice nature of this post. I am both new at writing in this manner as well as a relatively newer shooter with limited experience. I hope if nothing else, other new shooters will have a place for advice from another like minded individual. I am looking for a handgun to conceal. I have never shot single stacks or any other micro/ subcompact guns. (I have shot my naa arms .22lr). I have handled shields more than plenty, but the p365 is new to me. These are my first impressions as unbiased as possible. I am a fan of both and these have been my top choices since I started this path.
*spoiler is at the end if you don't want to read everything*
Company impressions and warranties.
Sig sauer has been around for a while, about 40 years. Before that J.P. Sauer and Sohn had been in business for a while since 1751 to be exact. Sig started making muskets in 1860. They are an industry standard and will be around for a while. Sig's limited lifetime warranty for the original owner is a nice deal. I have not needed them personally but have had to deal with them a few times. They are just like any other company. It depends on your attitude and the kind of day the rep is having, more so than anything else. I think people give Sig less credit than they deserve. Put aside fan club grievances and Sig makes a great manufacturer.
On the other hand Smith & Wesson is another classic true and tried name in the industry. 150 years in production will attest to this. They provide a 1 year limited warranty to the original owner only. I had to double check this, since I could've sworn they had a lifetime warranty as well. S&W tends to be a bit slow compared to the industry turnaround average. Speaking to a rep when inquiring about a customers bodyguard. Apparently their sheer volume makes it difficult to keep up with warranty repairs. The particular b/g I called about had been sitting on a shelf for almost 6 weeks and hadn't even made it through their check in process. After some small talk and friendly persuasion, The gentleman agreed to personally move the gun along. It got shipped back that week with a new magazine for the feeding issue. I don't recall if it actually fixed the problem. I think most will agree that you get good value and quality from S&W. Not great but not bad. They tend to put out products that are .. manila. Nothing to get excited about, but you can rely on and will work for the majority of people.
Before thoughts
I have been reading about and getting hyped up about Sig's new p365. I had to see what the fuss was about, being a Sig fanatic. I own a few including my present edc/ night stand gun, my p320 in 40s&w.. (if anyone knows where I can buy a .357 sig barrel, please let me know). Naturally a similar handgun in a much more concealable package was very appealing. Add in the capacity that is only 3 rounds shy of my 320 compact. That equates to 10+1, or 12+1 with the extended mag. They did suspend shipment until they made sure they had the gun squared away. Isolated instances of failure to return to battery got fixed. I am actually in the train of thought that this is a good thing. I feel better that the company took responsibility before they shipped out all these guns and made a quick buck in the bear gun market. After the p320 fiasco, they had to make sure that their 365 line was perfect. Anything less and it would be disastrous for the company. The gun itself looks a bit top heavy and probably awkward to hold.
It's a S&W shield, what more is there to say. It has been the best selling handgun in the U.S. for a couple years running. So in handling the P.C. I did notice a couple of things. Fiber optic sights... cool they finally one upped the Springfield xds. The lightening cutouts are cool, but realistically, in a defensive situation, I don't see them helping. The barrel is ported, once again cool. They reduce recoil to help with precision shooting. Once again, the average shooter even moderately trained shooters is not going to focus on the fundamentals or care enough during the situation. There are always exceptions, I'm sure Jerry Miculek might notice. I am not one of that tier of shooters. for me, a stop is a stop and dead is dead. Aim center mass and most folks will get the job done. No one is going to measure your groups as part of the investigation. Be more concerned about those stray rounds. The trigger is upgraded compared to the gen. 1. The grip is comfortable but seems slippery. looks great and well balanced. The 7+1 or 8+1 magazines were great once, but in comparison don't seems all that great anymore. The aftermarket is huge with the M&P line.
Concealabilty:
Shockingly, The Sig wins this round. At only .01" thicker at the grip. All other dimensions or smaller or negligible in the Sig over the Smith. The stock shield is available with a 3.1" or 4" barrel. Otherwise both the p365 and the shield performance center both have 3.1" barrels. Unloaded, they are within a half ounce. All this while holding either 3 or 4 rounds more with comparable magazines. The downside to the Sig is the aftermarket. As with all new guns, it will be 6 months to a year before the aftermarket catches up with the availability of accessories.
On my lane.
Both of the guns were rentals at the local point blank near my fiances place. I thought about testing new clean gun that have been beautifully maintained and lubed, but a carry gun is rarely in perfect condition. So I opted to keep them dirty and grimy. As with all rentals, I had to used their ammo, no hp. So I grabbed 3 boxes of Midwest Ammunition's fmj 115gr. rn.
Take down is similar, except you don't have to pull the trigger on the p365 to release the slide. Both slide release levers were a joke. I tend to prefer the slingshot method, which came in handy today. Magazines were both easy to load and insert. The p365 did get tight after the 8th round. I can hand load mags without even paying attention to the action. On round #10 I had to put real effort to load it. Both factory magazines seemed to be equal quality. Sig made these magazines look like they have been manufacturing them for years. Smith has been making them for years and it shows. Once in, the shield mag has a little bit of wiggle. The Sig is sturdy as it should be. Both mags release easily but didn't slide out and fall like I prefer. Both mag releases are big enough to hit easily, but designed at a slight angle as to not hinder draw from a holster.
My natural point of aim had me high with the Sig. The shield was spot on. The fiber optics was nice but a little bright for being in a well lit indoor range, my first time using them. The 5.3" sight radius on the shield helped when stretching out past 15 yds. At close distances there wasn't much difference. The p365 trigger pull was about 5.5# compared the the shields 6.5#. This was measured by feel, I didn't use a trigger pull gauge. The Sig's pull was long but it had a stiff smooth tension all the way through. It reminded me a lot of my p320, but longer. The S&W had some travel before the tension hits. The hinged trigger amplifies this. Both guns had a mediocre break, not sharp and crisp but still clean. The best way to describe it is, boring. You know it breaks but doesn't have the satisfying snap. Reset is the same. You know it resets but it isn't audible or solid.
The grip is the part we're all waiting for. I have longer medium girth hands. I fit well into your typical xl or size 12 gloves. In comparison, a Sig 226 is perfect, a Beretta 92fs, is a touch big and a Ruger sr9 is small. The S&W fit fine. It was a bit thin. My support hand had only a sliver of purchase. My dominate hand was easy to get high for proper grip. I felt as I couldn't get high enough to really bring down the bore axis. If I went with the shield, the first thing I would do is buy some Talon grips. It otherwise feels good in hand, and will do so for a lot of folks.
The Sig p365 did not feel like it was loaded with 11 rounds (13 if i was comparing extended mag with extended mag). The weight was a tad forward, but the under cuts let you get a high grip. This lowered the bore axis and balanced out the weight nicely. The grip was surprisingly and overly small. being only .01 inches thicker than the shield, it was still shorter and narrower front to back. It was apparent that the extended mag was needed to keep your pinky and half of your ring finger fully on the grip. There was absolutely no space left for my support hand palm purchase. This threw off my support thumb placement. I was constantly concerned it was too high or slipping forward. With some practice, I'm sure it will get better. There will be a steeper learning curve with the p365.
Range is hot!
midwest ammunition 115gr fmj rn for all shooting with sig p365 and s&w shield pc 9
first shots
p365
11 rounds slow fire
5 yards
View attachment 65618
shield performance center
9 rounds slow fire
5 yards
2nd round stovepipe. I believe this was a combination of how dirty and possibly cold the gun was and the sub standard ammo.
View attachment 65619
p365
slow fire
15 rounds @ 10 yards
5 rounds @15 yards
5 rounds @20 yards
5 rounds @25 yards
View attachment 65620
Shield
slow fire
5 @ 3 yards
5 @ 5 yards
5 @ 10 yards
5 @ 15 yards
5 @ 20 yards
5 @ 25 yards
View attachment 65621
P365
hammer pairs in rapid succession (about 5 - 6 seconds)
10 @ 5 yards
View attachment 65629
shield
hammer pairs in rapid succession (about 5-6 seconds)
8 @ 5 yards
View attachment 65630
Control
I used my 92fs as a control for my grouping.
Beretta 92 fs
Tula 115 gr. fmj rn steel cased brendan primed
controlled consecutive fire
50 rounds @ 5 yards
View attachment 65631
Beretta 92 fs
Tula 115 gr. fmj rn steel cased brendan primed
controlled consecutive fire
50 rounds @ 7 yards
View attachment 65632
Beretta 92 fs
Tula 115 gr. fmj rn steel cased brendan primed
controlled consecutive fire
50 rounds @ 10 yards
View attachment 65633
The range is cold.
The pictures speak for themselves. These two guns are great I would trust either one of them with my life. Although I would keep them clean. The one hiccup was a stove pipe. I will attribute this to how dirty this rental gun was. I can't imagine any responsible person let their gun get this dirty. Therefore I will let this one malfunction slide. After that both guns ran like a dream. I still can't decide. I suppose I will just carry whichever comes into my life at a better deal. I can't imagine the stock shield would be much different.
*spoiler is at the end if you don't want to read everything*
Company impressions and warranties.
Sig sauer has been around for a while, about 40 years. Before that J.P. Sauer and Sohn had been in business for a while since 1751 to be exact. Sig started making muskets in 1860. They are an industry standard and will be around for a while. Sig's limited lifetime warranty for the original owner is a nice deal. I have not needed them personally but have had to deal with them a few times. They are just like any other company. It depends on your attitude and the kind of day the rep is having, more so than anything else. I think people give Sig less credit than they deserve. Put aside fan club grievances and Sig makes a great manufacturer.
On the other hand Smith & Wesson is another classic true and tried name in the industry. 150 years in production will attest to this. They provide a 1 year limited warranty to the original owner only. I had to double check this, since I could've sworn they had a lifetime warranty as well. S&W tends to be a bit slow compared to the industry turnaround average. Speaking to a rep when inquiring about a customers bodyguard. Apparently their sheer volume makes it difficult to keep up with warranty repairs. The particular b/g I called about had been sitting on a shelf for almost 6 weeks and hadn't even made it through their check in process. After some small talk and friendly persuasion, The gentleman agreed to personally move the gun along. It got shipped back that week with a new magazine for the feeding issue. I don't recall if it actually fixed the problem. I think most will agree that you get good value and quality from S&W. Not great but not bad. They tend to put out products that are .. manila. Nothing to get excited about, but you can rely on and will work for the majority of people.
Before thoughts
I have been reading about and getting hyped up about Sig's new p365. I had to see what the fuss was about, being a Sig fanatic. I own a few including my present edc/ night stand gun, my p320 in 40s&w.. (if anyone knows where I can buy a .357 sig barrel, please let me know). Naturally a similar handgun in a much more concealable package was very appealing. Add in the capacity that is only 3 rounds shy of my 320 compact. That equates to 10+1, or 12+1 with the extended mag. They did suspend shipment until they made sure they had the gun squared away. Isolated instances of failure to return to battery got fixed. I am actually in the train of thought that this is a good thing. I feel better that the company took responsibility before they shipped out all these guns and made a quick buck in the bear gun market. After the p320 fiasco, they had to make sure that their 365 line was perfect. Anything less and it would be disastrous for the company. The gun itself looks a bit top heavy and probably awkward to hold.
It's a S&W shield, what more is there to say. It has been the best selling handgun in the U.S. for a couple years running. So in handling the P.C. I did notice a couple of things. Fiber optic sights... cool they finally one upped the Springfield xds. The lightening cutouts are cool, but realistically, in a defensive situation, I don't see them helping. The barrel is ported, once again cool. They reduce recoil to help with precision shooting. Once again, the average shooter even moderately trained shooters is not going to focus on the fundamentals or care enough during the situation. There are always exceptions, I'm sure Jerry Miculek might notice. I am not one of that tier of shooters. for me, a stop is a stop and dead is dead. Aim center mass and most folks will get the job done. No one is going to measure your groups as part of the investigation. Be more concerned about those stray rounds. The trigger is upgraded compared to the gen. 1. The grip is comfortable but seems slippery. looks great and well balanced. The 7+1 or 8+1 magazines were great once, but in comparison don't seems all that great anymore. The aftermarket is huge with the M&P line.
Concealabilty:
Shockingly, The Sig wins this round. At only .01" thicker at the grip. All other dimensions or smaller or negligible in the Sig over the Smith. The stock shield is available with a 3.1" or 4" barrel. Otherwise both the p365 and the shield performance center both have 3.1" barrels. Unloaded, they are within a half ounce. All this while holding either 3 or 4 rounds more with comparable magazines. The downside to the Sig is the aftermarket. As with all new guns, it will be 6 months to a year before the aftermarket catches up with the availability of accessories.
On my lane.
Both of the guns were rentals at the local point blank near my fiances place. I thought about testing new clean gun that have been beautifully maintained and lubed, but a carry gun is rarely in perfect condition. So I opted to keep them dirty and grimy. As with all rentals, I had to used their ammo, no hp. So I grabbed 3 boxes of Midwest Ammunition's fmj 115gr. rn.
Take down is similar, except you don't have to pull the trigger on the p365 to release the slide. Both slide release levers were a joke. I tend to prefer the slingshot method, which came in handy today. Magazines were both easy to load and insert. The p365 did get tight after the 8th round. I can hand load mags without even paying attention to the action. On round #10 I had to put real effort to load it. Both factory magazines seemed to be equal quality. Sig made these magazines look like they have been manufacturing them for years. Smith has been making them for years and it shows. Once in, the shield mag has a little bit of wiggle. The Sig is sturdy as it should be. Both mags release easily but didn't slide out and fall like I prefer. Both mag releases are big enough to hit easily, but designed at a slight angle as to not hinder draw from a holster.
My natural point of aim had me high with the Sig. The shield was spot on. The fiber optics was nice but a little bright for being in a well lit indoor range, my first time using them. The 5.3" sight radius on the shield helped when stretching out past 15 yds. At close distances there wasn't much difference. The p365 trigger pull was about 5.5# compared the the shields 6.5#. This was measured by feel, I didn't use a trigger pull gauge. The Sig's pull was long but it had a stiff smooth tension all the way through. It reminded me a lot of my p320, but longer. The S&W had some travel before the tension hits. The hinged trigger amplifies this. Both guns had a mediocre break, not sharp and crisp but still clean. The best way to describe it is, boring. You know it breaks but doesn't have the satisfying snap. Reset is the same. You know it resets but it isn't audible or solid.
The grip is the part we're all waiting for. I have longer medium girth hands. I fit well into your typical xl or size 12 gloves. In comparison, a Sig 226 is perfect, a Beretta 92fs, is a touch big and a Ruger sr9 is small. The S&W fit fine. It was a bit thin. My support hand had only a sliver of purchase. My dominate hand was easy to get high for proper grip. I felt as I couldn't get high enough to really bring down the bore axis. If I went with the shield, the first thing I would do is buy some Talon grips. It otherwise feels good in hand, and will do so for a lot of folks.
The Sig p365 did not feel like it was loaded with 11 rounds (13 if i was comparing extended mag with extended mag). The weight was a tad forward, but the under cuts let you get a high grip. This lowered the bore axis and balanced out the weight nicely. The grip was surprisingly and overly small. being only .01 inches thicker than the shield, it was still shorter and narrower front to back. It was apparent that the extended mag was needed to keep your pinky and half of your ring finger fully on the grip. There was absolutely no space left for my support hand palm purchase. This threw off my support thumb placement. I was constantly concerned it was too high or slipping forward. With some practice, I'm sure it will get better. There will be a steeper learning curve with the p365.
Range is hot!
midwest ammunition 115gr fmj rn for all shooting with sig p365 and s&w shield pc 9
first shots
p365
11 rounds slow fire
5 yards
View attachment 65618
shield performance center
9 rounds slow fire
5 yards
2nd round stovepipe. I believe this was a combination of how dirty and possibly cold the gun was and the sub standard ammo.
View attachment 65619
p365
slow fire
15 rounds @ 10 yards
5 rounds @15 yards
5 rounds @20 yards
5 rounds @25 yards
View attachment 65620
Shield
slow fire
5 @ 3 yards
5 @ 5 yards
5 @ 10 yards
5 @ 15 yards
5 @ 20 yards
5 @ 25 yards
View attachment 65621
P365
hammer pairs in rapid succession (about 5 - 6 seconds)
10 @ 5 yards
View attachment 65629
shield
hammer pairs in rapid succession (about 5-6 seconds)
8 @ 5 yards
View attachment 65630
Control
I used my 92fs as a control for my grouping.
Beretta 92 fs
Tula 115 gr. fmj rn steel cased brendan primed
controlled consecutive fire
50 rounds @ 5 yards
View attachment 65631
Beretta 92 fs
Tula 115 gr. fmj rn steel cased brendan primed
controlled consecutive fire
50 rounds @ 7 yards
View attachment 65632
Beretta 92 fs
Tula 115 gr. fmj rn steel cased brendan primed
controlled consecutive fire
50 rounds @ 10 yards
View attachment 65633
The range is cold.
The pictures speak for themselves. These two guns are great I would trust either one of them with my life. Although I would keep them clean. The one hiccup was a stove pipe. I will attribute this to how dirty this rental gun was. I can't imagine any responsible person let their gun get this dirty. Therefore I will let this one malfunction slide. After that both guns ran like a dream. I still can't decide. I suppose I will just carry whichever comes into my life at a better deal. I can't imagine the stock shield would be much different.
