Super old gun with almost no markings.

[fullmetaljesus]

Hey all. My dad has had this gun tucked away in a closet for 30+ years.

A close friend gave it to him a long time ago.

It has very few markings and no branding.

Any ideas as to what this is?

View attachment IMG_20210326_163000339.jpg
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[MrSmitty]

more detailed pictures of the barrel, near the breech, could be just a wall hanger, could be a Damascus barrel, does look like it has proof makes, I see something that looks like a Cresent moon, could be a Turkish proof mark, but I'm far from an expert. I hate to see good guns just sit, but, don't want anyone getting blown up either.. Just hang it over you fireplace till you get info...

 

[fullmetaljesus]

more detailed pictures of the barrel, near the breech, could be just a wall hanger, could be a Damascus barrel, does look like it has proof makes, I see something that looks like a Cresent moon, could be a Turkish proof mark, but I'm far from an expert. I hate to see good guns just sit, but, don't want anyone getting blown up either.. Just hang it over you fireplace till you get info...

The barrel does look like damascus.
The pics fails to show how beautiful it is.

There are a couple marks by the breech but nothing I could say for certain what the look like. They kinds show up in the pics.

 

[Magnum314]

That's Belgium for sure. Or at least I am 99.99% sure. That "post/pedestal" identification visible in a magnified picture #2 is a Belgium black powder proof mark, called a "view mark", or the inspectors mark, in this case, Le Perron. Dating post 1811...pre-1968, most likely. I'll see what else I can dig up for you. Same inspector marks can be found on old Belgium doubles as well.

 

[jagee]

@Leadeye is the old gun guru

 

[printcraft]

For sale? I'd like a buddy to take a look at it.

 

[Leadeye]

From the pictures I would agree with magnum 314, Belgian manufacture and proofs. They made a lot of different guns, even copies of American versions like early S&W revolvers. Need more pictures, could be a shotgun or if it has rifling in the barrel a hunting rifle. How large is the bore and about how long is the barrel?

The decorations are something you see more on continental guns of this era as opposed to English or American. They were works of art.

 

[fullmetaljesus]

From the pictures I would agree with magnum 314, Belgian manufacture and proofs. They made a lot of different guns, even copies of American versions like early S&W revolvers. Need more pictures, could be a shotgun or if it has rifling in the barrel a hunting rifle. How large is the bore and about how long is the barrel?

The decorations are something you see more on continental guns of this era as opposed to English or American. They were works of art.

It's too late to call my dad for measurements tonight so I'll call him tomorrow.

It's certainly a shotgun, and the bore was not all that large. I'll have him measure that as well.

 

[BigRed]

Sometimes it takes some homework, but I would be remiss if I did not mention....Firearms were made to be fired.

 

[hoosierdaddy1976]

For sale? I'd like a buddy to take a look at it.

Do you think you're dealing with the Loch Ness monster?

 

[Leadeye]

Sometimes it takes some homework, but I would be remiss if I did not mention....Firearms were made to be fired.

I can see Damascus lines in the barrel steel, but nothing wrong with BP. The nipples will need to come out and the barrel inspected.

 

[fullmetaljesus]

Talked to my dad. The barrel is 30-31" long and it's a 30cal

 

[Tactically Fat]

Also should be noted that there were hundreds of thousands of Belgian parts imported as kits, too. To which state-side makers would tweak, fit, and assemble into firearms. Or just sell as parts.

So just because it has Belgian proof marks, doesn't necessarily mean that it's a Belgian gun.

 

[Leadeye]

Talked to my dad. The barrel is 30-31" long and it's a 30cal

That's too small to ba a shotgun for sure, must be some sort of two barreled light rifle. Rifeling designed to shoot balls is usually pretty slow twist, might not be easily visible.

Have to concur with TF, the list of stuff from places like Liege is long over the years.

 

[fullmetaljesus]

So the mystery just gets deeper. No definitive answers on this one?

 

[Leadeye]

Like TF said earlier, it could be a totally custom gun made from parts available during that era. Between the percussion lock and the Damascus rifle barrels I figure your gun was made 1840s to 1870s. It's really a work of art from what I can see in the pictures.

 

[fullmetaljesus]

Like TF said earlier, it could be a totally custom gun made from parts available during that era. Between the percussion lock and the Damascus rifle barrels I figure your gun was made 1840s to 1870s. It's really a work of art from what I can see in the pictures.

It is beautiful. I wish the pictures did a better job of showing it.

 

[Tactically Fat]

We also need to realize that there were dozens and dozens of "companies" that'd buy and assemble parts for sale.

I have an old 12ga shotgun from the same era. The only maker marks on it are "Geo. Washington", I believe. Has basically all the same Belgian proof marks that your musket has.

But when you google up "Geo. Washington" shotguns...almost no real information about it.

It was probably imported as a whole gun by a re-seller, stamped with their own stamp, then out the door.

Unless something was made by a big name company, we're essentially dealing with the dark-ages of trying to figure things out.