The Marine Corps Stands Alone - AGAIN

The #1 community for Gun Owners in Indiana

Member Benefits:

  • Fewer Ads!
  • Discuss all aspects of firearm ownership
  • Discuss anti-gun legislation
  • Buy, sell, and trade in the classified section
  • Chat with Local gun shops, ranges, trainers & other businesses
  • Discover free outdoor shooting areas
  • View up to date on firearm-related events
  • Share photos & video with other members
  • ...and so much more!
  • r3126

    Sharpshooter
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    19   0   0
    Dec 3, 2008
    710
    63
    Indy westside
    Finally, someone says what they think - not what is politically correct.



    Marine Corps leader stands against gays in military

    Gen. James T. Conway tells the Senate Armed Services Committee that he thinks 'don't ask, don't tell' works as it is.




    Reporting from Washington - The Commandant of the Marine Corps said Thursday that gays should not be allowed to serve openly in the military, becoming the most senior commander to break from President Obama's goal of lifting the ban.

    Gen. James T. Conway, testifying before the Senate Armed Services Committee, said the policy known as "don't ask, don't tell" should be left alone.

    "I think the current policy works," he said. "My best military advice to this committee, to the secretary, to the president, would be to keep the law such as it is."

    Conway's stance is considered crucial because it shows there are sharp disagreements among top officers and within the Joint Chiefs of Staff about whether to allow gays and lesbians to serve openly. Opposition from military leaders helped derail earlier efforts to lift the ban, most notably former President Clinton's effort in 1993.

    Unlike previous attempts to ease rules, however, top Pentagon officials have endorsed a change. Adm. Michael G. Mullen, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs, said this month that he wanted a new policy and that allowing gays to serve openly was a matter of "integrity."

    Republicans opposed to changing the policy have said that Mullen's views do not represent those of other senior military leaders.

    The chiefs of the various military services have been testifying before the House and Senate this week, and lawmakers have questioned them about the Obama administration's plans to overturn the 1993 law that bars gays and lesbians from serving openly. Since the law was passed, about 14,000 service members have been removed from the military because of their sexual orientation.

    During their testimony, none of the chiefs backed Mullen's position by calling for an end to the ban. But all of the chiefs, including Conway, have supported Defense Secretary Robert M. Gates' plan to study the effect of changing of the law.

    Conway has taken positions at odds with top Pentagon officials in the past, but has not publicly addressed the issue of gays in the military. Conway is due to retire this summer when his term as commandant is up.

    He told lawmakers that any policy change should not be judged by its fairness to gays, but by its impact on the military.

    "My personal opinion is that unless we can strip away the emotion, agenda and politics and ask [whether] we somehow enhance the war-fighting of the United States Marine Corps by allowing homosexuals to openly serve, then we haven't addressed it from the correct perspective," Conway said.

    Conway was challenged, gently, by Sen. Joe Lieberman (I-Conn.), who has said that he plans to introduce legislation to allow gays to serve openly.

    "I hope we conclude that repealing 'don't ask don't tell' will enhance military readiness," Lieberman said.

    Some advocacy groups were more direct.

    Aubrey Sarvis, executive director of the Servicemembers Legal Defense Network, said that any law that pushed out qualified troops during wartime undermined military readiness and effectiveness.

    "Gen. Conway was the only chief to say to Congress this week that the law is 'working,' " Sarvis said. "It is not working."

    julian.barnes@latimes.com
     

    lashicoN

    Master
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Nov 2, 2009
    2,130
    38
    North
    He doesn't state why he has that opinion, just that he thinks the current law works. He also states that it's too emotional of an issue. No kidding, when you deprive an entire group of people service in our military for no apparent reason it may become emotional.
     

    SSGSAD

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    14   0   0
    Dec 22, 2009
    12,404
    48
    Town of 900 miles
    The Marine Corps has :bigballs: :patriot: If you haven't served, SHUT YOUR PIE HOLE MAGGOT !!!!! I do not want to be in the foxhole, or a shower with a gay man, any more than you want your teenage(18) is legal to join, daughter, in the foxhole, or shower with me.....
     

    r3126

    Sharpshooter
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    19   0   0
    Dec 3, 2008
    710
    63
    Indy westside
    when you deprive an entire group of people service in our military for no apparent reason

    No one is denied service. The "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy is the concession made to accomodate the homosexually inclined person to fulfill his or her desire to serve. The military service is neither the place for "social experimentation" nor externally imposed "political correctness."

    I am reluctant to imagine, based on 22 years of active service, what issues will result from an open integration based on sexuality.
     

    CarmelHP

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Mar 14, 2008
    7,633
    48
    Carmel
    He doesn't state why he has that opinion, just that he thinks the current law works. He also states that it's too emotional of an issue. No kidding, when you deprive an entire group of people service in our military for no apparent reason it may become emotional.

    :nopity::bs:
     

    Marc

    Master
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Aug 16, 2008
    2,517
    38
    District 6
    the day the chow hall has a night club is the day they should be able to serve openly, it would cause too much controversy and the term "blanket party" would take on a whole new meaning
     

    lashicoN

    Master
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Nov 2, 2009
    2,130
    38
    North
    If you haven't served, SHUT YOUR PIE HOLE MAGGOT !!!!! quote]

    No.

    No one is denied service. The "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy is the concession made to accomodate the homosexually inclined person to fulfill his or her desire to serve. The military service is neither the place for "social experimentation" nor externally imposed "political correctness."

    I am reluctant to imagine, based on 22 years of active service, what issues will result from an open integration based on sexuality.

    I don't know a whole lot about this issue. What could go wrong if they let them join, openly homosexual, and treated them as they treat everyone else in the Marines? Why does sexual preference matter? It seems to me, the biggest fear is male on male rape by a homosexual. Wouldn't the simple solution be to not allow convicted rapists to join the Marines?
     

    r3126

    Sharpshooter
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    19   0   0
    Dec 3, 2008
    710
    63
    Indy westside
    ...the term "blanket party" would take on a whole new meaning

    Therein lies one of the multitude of problems that would occur. Taken in the adverse, a "blanket party" would lead to disciplinary problems, discrimination issues and a degredation of morale. We will then be pitting one "group" against the majority which, in no way, furthers unit cohesion, mission effectness or "esprit de corps."

    What could go wrong if they let them join, openly homosexual, and treated them as they treat everyone else in the Marines? Why does sexual preference matter?

    I think I address that in my above statement. If you have not served, it is hard for you to understand. No disrespect intended.
     

    lashicoN

    Master
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Nov 2, 2009
    2,130
    38
    North
    Therein lies one of the multitude of problems that would occur. Taken in the adverse, a "blanket party" would lead to disciplinary problems, discrimination issues and a degredation of morale. We will then be pitting one "group" against the majority which, in no way, furthers unit cohesion, mission effectness or "esprit de corps."

    Not if you treated everyone the same. Can a normal grunt sue the Marines when he gets his feelings hurt or when he gets tired of walking 22 miles with an 80 pound pack on his back? There should be absolutely no difference when it comes to a homosexual. When you want to become a Marine, I'm pretty sure you know going in that it isn't going to be a fun day at the beach.
     

    r3126

    Sharpshooter
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    19   0   0
    Dec 3, 2008
    710
    63
    Indy westside
    It seems to me, the biggest fear is male on male rape by a homosexual. Wouldn't the simple solution be to not allow convicted rapists to join the Marines?

    I ASSURE you, that IS NOT the fear! Additionally, convicted rapists (major felony conviction) cannot join the Marine Corps or any other branch of the military.
     

    lashicoN

    Master
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Nov 2, 2009
    2,130
    38
    North
    I ASSURE you, that IS NOT the fear! Additionally, convicted rapists (major felony conviction) cannot join the Marine Corps or any other branch of the military.

    Are you sure about that?

    "I do not want to be in the foxhole, or a shower with a gay man, any more than you want your teenage(18) is legal to join, daughter, in the foxhole, or shower with me....." - SSGSAD

    "i just got out a couple years ago and couldn't agree more with SSGSAD. he said it perfectly." - Grunt Soldier
     

    r3126

    Sharpshooter
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    19   0   0
    Dec 3, 2008
    710
    63
    Indy westside
    Not if you treated everyone the same.

    The crux of the problem.... Not everyone is treated the same - just like in real life out here in the civilian world.

    As I stated earlier, if you haven't served, it is hard for you to understand. If you don't want to understand the military issues, you will never understand.

    This has gone on long enough.

    Bye.
     

    Fletch

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jun 19, 2008
    6,379
    48
    Oklahoma
    This has gone on long enough.

    Bye.

    Wait a minute... didn't you START the thread? What, you only want to talk about controversial topics so long as everyone agrees with you? How does a person that averse to conflict even make it in the military?
     

    r3126

    Sharpshooter
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    19   0   0
    Dec 3, 2008
    710
    63
    Indy westside
    Wait a minute... didn't you START the thread? What, you only want to talk about controversial topics so long as everyone agrees with you? How does a person that averse to conflict even make it in the military?

    You know, I think I will respond to you. Yep, I started the thread. Yep, I dropped the thread. What I do has nothing to do with you... I care not whether everyone agrees with me - it is just pointless to argue the same thing over and over - I am not going to convince him, and obviously, he is not going to convince me.

    How did I make it in the military? Very well, I think. Do you have something "constructive" to add or do you just like to insult people?

    What a jerk!
     

    Indy_Guy_77

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    16   0   0
    Apr 30, 2008
    16,576
    48
    It's a logistics problem...

    They don't let hetero men bunk with or shower with or latrine with hetero women due to the potential for problems. Right? Right. The majority of those problems are sexual in nature.

    So, to help keep problems at a minimum, they segregate those populations.

    Now, let's say that you have an openly gay person, or two, or three, or however many. These folks are now in the position that they're bunking with showering with that population which they find sexually attractive and/or stimulating.

    And that's supposed to be a GOOD idea? The potential for HUGE problems has suddenly grown exponentially.

    So, if they already separate the men from the women to limit problems of a sexual nature... Then would they also have to separate the gay men from the heterosexual men? Or would you put the gay men in with the hetero women?

    And what about keeping the gay men away from the other gay men?

    What about the gay women? Keep them with the hetero women or put them with the gay men?

    It's all about logistics...
     

    TopDog

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    19   0   0
    Nov 23, 2008
    6,906
    48
    I'm with the Commandant on this. And to those trying to stir the pot, do we really have to hash over the reason's for our positions on this issue yet again? I don't think so and I'm not going to voice what has been said over and over one more time.
     

    j706

    Master
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    60   0   1
    Dec 4, 2008
    4,160
    48
    Lizton
    If you haven't served, SHUT YOUR PIE HOLE MAGGOT !!!!! quote]

    No.



    I don't know a whole lot about this issue. What could go wrong if they let them join, openly homosexual, and treated them as they treat everyone else in the Marines? Why does sexual preference matter? It seems to me, the biggest fear is male on male rape by a homosexual. Wouldn't the simple solution be to not allow convicted rapists to join the Marines?

    Gay service members undermine morale and discipline. It is a distraction. It is un natural. It is not accepted by the majority of our average everyday citizens much less military personnel.

    I don't care what the tree hugger liberals say, homosexuality is wrong. :noway:
     

    Indy_Guy_77

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    16   0   0
    Apr 30, 2008
    16,576
    48
    Gay service members undermine morale and discipline. It is a distraction. It is un natural. It is not accepted by the majority of our average everyday citizens much less military personnel.

    I don't care what the tree hugger liberals say, homosexuality is wrong. :noway:

    Not that you really want to go down that road... But there are all kinds of things that are wrong that service members (and Americans in general) do on a daily basis... If you want to choose that route, then your argument will fail at almost every level.
     

    ATF Consumer

    Shooter
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Sep 23, 2008
    4,628
    36
    South Side Indy
    There were [strike]gays[/strike] homosexuals in the military when I served...no one asked, so they didn't tell...they were able to serve and all was well. I don't understand what the problem is...why do we have to know they are homo?
     
    Top Bottom