The War on Drugs : Is lost

[Lex Concord]

You guys have to be bat poop crazy to think that drugs should be made legal to buy.

In the roofing business I have seen way to many people that use to just smoke pot who then move on to other drugs and completely lose all touch with reality in a few short years.

And you have to be squirrel-turd nuts to think that the failures of a few folks you happen to know justify the destruction of any liberty for all.

 

[phylodog]

OK timeout. You also need to do your research on where these drugs are grown/produced...
You are 1/2 right...

Marijuana is grown across Central and South America.
Cocaine comes mostly out of South America not just Columbia.
Heroin does not come out of the Middle east. It comes out of Asia.
Hash comes from the Middle East.
And the Majority of Meth does come from the US... There is a lot made in Central America though...

The Foreign Suppliers are reaping the benefits because of the War on Drugs. Oft times our Government is paying these People to stay in power and do what they do...
The War on drugs what a **** farce.
Should be renamed the War on American Freedoms...

Marijuana is grown everywhere. The majority comes from Mexico.

I didn't say anything about Columbia.

You're right about heroin. I think Afghanistan and automatically think middle east. Plenty of poppy coming out of there.

The majority of meth is produced in Mexico. There are a thousands of small scale production facilities in this country but there are large scale factories in Mexico.

 

[IndyMonkey]

And you have to be squirrel-turd nuts to think that the failures of a few folks you happen to know justify the destruction of any liberty for all.

not a few, all the people that I know that smoked pot had or has some issue with there life that was directly related to drug use.

I have yet to see anything that had to do with the enforcement of laws pertaining to illegal drugs directly effect my rights.

 

[lashicoN]

You guys have to be bat poop crazy to think that drugs should be made legal to buy.

In the roofing business I have seen way to many people that use to just smoke pot who then move on to other drugs and completely lose all touch with reality in a few short years.

What does being in the roofing business have to do with anything? Are you trying to say that that makes you an expert on long-term marijuana effects? I fail to see that as a credible source.

I don't personally know anyone who smoked pot who then moved on to actual drugs, apart from alcohol.

And we're not crazy, we're just Americans. Freedom is the only way.

 

[IndyMonkey]

What does being in the roofing business have to do with anything? Are you trying to say that that makes you an expert on long-term marijuana effects? I fail to see that as a credible source.

I don't personally know anyone who smoked pot who then moved on to actual drugs, apart from alcohol.

And we're not crazy, we're just Americans. Freedom is the only way.

Heres the difference from you and I. I post first hand experience about coworkers, employers, and employees from spending time with them every day for several years. Watching several people go from productive members of society to garbage is very eye opening.

You beat your Freedom drum, and think thats the key to happiness. But not caring about the effect that it will have on the general population.

 

[Lex Concord]

not a few, all the people that I know that smoked pot had or has some issue with there life that was directly related to drug use.

And your point is

I did not say "a few of the people you know", but "a few people you happen to know". Even if you know 300 people, in a nation of 300 million, that is a few.

Again, your experience is anecdotal. Sad, yes, but anecdotal.

Why is it more okay for a whiskey drinker to ruin his own life and those of his family than a pot smoker Yet this is the structure of the law.

If a person has not threatened or harmed the property or person of another, no true crime has occurred, laws to the contrary notwithstanding. While I choose not to break those laws against crimes without victims, having no taste for inebriation in general ( I burn through about a twelve-pack a year, if I'm on a tear) and because I value my physical freedom and the emotional and fiscal well-being of my family, there is no reason that laws preventing adults from consuming such items in the privacy of their own homes should stand.

 

[Lex Concord]

Heres the difference from you and I. I post first hand experience about coworkers, employers, and employees from spending time with them every day for several years. Watching several people go from productive members of society to garbage is very eye opening.

You beat your Freedom drum, and think thats the key to happiness. But not caring about the effect that it will have on the general population.

Do you own your own roofing business?

If not, do you know anyone who does? Any business?

Do you realize that most businesses fail, and that a business failure has the potential to bring financial ruin and other issues into the lives of those who took the risk?

Maybe there should be laws against such individual risks being taken, as the potential downside is too horrible to imagine. Maybe only the anointed are ever wise enough to determine acceptable risks for individuals in this country.

It would be for the children.

Don't mind me, I'll just be over here beating my freedom drum while those who wish to do so march to the beat of the nanny state. It is a choice, is it not?

 

[IndyMonkey]

there is no reason that laws preventing adults from consuming such items in the privacy of their own homes should stand.

Because thats not how rabid narcotics users work. They have to have the drugs, it doesnt matter what they have to do to get it. Even if it means doing dirty mexican guys on washington st for 5.00 or breaking in your house and stealing from you.

You should talk to someone so hooked on drugs that thats all they think about, its amazing that someone can be so weak minded, or that a drug can be so powerful.

I couldn't careless what you do in your house. Its when it comes out in the public and interfere with my life that I have an issue.

 

[IndyMonkey]

Do you own your own roofing business?

If not, do you know anyone who does? Any business?

Do you realize that most businesses fail, and that a business failure has the potential to bring financial ruin and other issues into the lives of those who took the risk?

Maybe there should be laws against such individual risks being taken, as the potential downside is too horrible to imagine. Maybe only the anointed are ever wise enough to determine acceptable risks for individuals in this country.

It would be for the children.

Don't mind me, I'll just be over here beating my freedom drum while those who wish to do so march to the beat of the nanny state. It is a choice, is it not?

Living in a society with more than one person is about give and take.
Thats the only way that it works.

Beat your freedom drum all you want but there has to be compromises made for this country work.

 

[Ogre]

You guys have to be bat poop crazy to think that drugs should be made legal to buy.

In the roofing business I have seen way to many people that use to just smoke pot who then move on to other drugs and completely lose all touch with reality in a few short years.

whats your point? The fact that people choose to partake in something that ruins their lives is their own business. PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY... big boys and girls should be allowed to do with their body as they wish, but must accept responsibility for themselves and their actions, good or bad.

 

[Expat]

whats your point? The fact that people choose to partake in something that ruins their lives is their own business. PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY... big boys and girls should be allowed to do with their body as they wish, but must accept responsibility for themselves and their actions, good or bad.

But they aren't responsible and never will be. We as a society end up picking up the bill for all this. And you can say that needs to change, but it won't...

 

[IndyMonkey]

whats your point? The fact that people choose to partake in something that ruins their lives is their own business. PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY... big boys and girls should be allowed to do with their body as they wish, but must accept responsibility for themselves and their actions, good or bad.

Because it over flows into our business. From stealing, driving while Impaired to having the local trustee pay your elec bill because you would rather smoke crack.

It doesnt stay in your house.

 

[lashicoN]

Heres the difference from you and I. I post first hand experience about coworkers, employers, and employees from spending time with them every day for several years. Watching several people go from productive members of society to garbage is very eye opening.

You beat your Freedom drum, and think thats the key to happiness. But not caring about the effect that it will have on the general population.

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." Thomas Jefferson

 

[IndyMonkey]

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." Thomas Jefferson

What did ole TJ know about getting his wagon stolen from the carriage house by crack smokers?

 

[Duncan]

Depends on your definition of real income. I guess only those who actually turn raw materials into products meets your definition. Otherwise, I'd have to dispute how a salesman for a private company provides any more work or income to society than a fireman or policeman.

Sorry, but I still don't believe that today's illegal drugs should be legal. Some things are worth fighting against.

One more thing--calling us names looks like an extremist tactic to me. You know nothing about me or most folks in the conversation, yet you call us a name that represents things far beyond the scope of this discussion.

I understand your passion, but simply disagree with you on this issue.

I think more accurate terms here are , wealth , consumption productivity commerce .

Law enforcement .. Scratch that .. Peace Officers are needful and necessary .
They deal with the trash and the scum .. sometimes ...
They are suppose to be a reactive janitorial maintenance service ... to clean up and hopefully restore peace and
ensure justice . We need them . They are invaluable when performing their proper duties .
But ALL of our servants cops , fireman , mayors , bus drivers , bureaucrats
CONSUME WEALTH ... they do not produce an item of WEALTH . That is not to say they are not
needful and don't work or do a good job .
All wealth ultimately comes from the creation and production of a thing or the useful service to bring that item to commerce .... name one thing that does not come from the ground , the earth ?

Like it or not the cost of government is some of our wealth .
I agree with one poster that in essence said that the paycheck a government employee pays taxes with come form the
taxpayer . A simpler way to look at it is a fireman Earns $100 for a weeks work ... exempt him from ALL TAXES then
just give him $50 the effect is the same .
The WEALTH that came from the employers , us , just gets redirected with the fireman paying all the taxes .
At the end of the week he still only has $50 and the producers of wealth have to supply the " capitol " and wealth to run the system .
Thanks

 

[lashicoN]

What did ole TJ know about getting his wagon stolen from the carriage house by crack smokers?

Are you trying to say that the character of humans has changed since Thomas Jefferson scribed those words?

Are you trying to say that a crackhead is worse than a tyrant? Those words applied and applies to absolutely everything. If you disagree with Thomas Jefferson, then you disagree. That's fine, but you should know that those words describe what this country is supposed to be.

Freedom above all. And that's what is supposed to set us apart from the world. Not comfort over all, not order over all, not safety over all. Freedom is the key to happiness, but only a free man knows this. I sincerely hope that you discover that sometime in your lifetime.

 

[IndyMonkey]

Freedom above all. And that's what is supposed to set us apart from the world. Not comfort over all, not order over all, not safety over all. Freedom is the key to happiness, but only a free man knows this. I sincerely hope that you discover that sometime in your lifetime.

It is what sets us apart from the rest of the world, and also the right to vote to change things.

 

[lashicoN]

It is what sets us apart from the rest of the world, and also the right to vote to change things.

Not if the change you make results in watered down freedom. Do I have to pull the Franklin quote here about those sacrificing liberty to attain temporary safety?

 

[MinuteMan47]

...I believe the prefered drug of Thomas Jefferson's time would have been opium. He was actually thought to have grown it in his garden at Monticello.


"Many distinguished early Americans grew Papaver somniferum. Rightly or wrongly, they would today be treated as felons. Thomas Jefferson cultivated opium poppies at his garden in Monticello. The seeds from its plants, including the poppies, were sold at the gift-shop of Thomas Jefferson Center for Historic Plants until 1991 - when a drug-bust at the nearby University of Virginia panicked the Board of Directors into ripping up the plants and burning the seeds. The cultivation of Papaver somniferum is banned in the USA under the Opium Poppy Control Act of 1942. Amateur horticulturists, however, continue to value the beautiful red, yellow and white flowers as adornments to their gardens."

A Brief History of Opium

 

[IndyMonkey]

Do I have to pull the Franklin quote here about those sacrificing liberty to attain temporary safety?

Please do.