What do you actually use for hiking & camping in cold weather?

[teddy12b]

I'm taking some rookies out with me in Oct for a simple overnight. There will be a two mile minimum hike in, maybe 3 to 5 if they're up to it. Then we'll be setting up camp for the night and hiking out some time the next afternoon hopefully after catching a few fish. Its not a great big mighty excursion, but it's something that if done right could lead these guys into doing more stuff outdoors, and likewise if it's an awful miserable experience they may never do it again.

Most of my "camping" experience isn't in cold weather, but in the past I've used a USGI single person tent with full military sleep system on a pt foam pad. That setup is completely four season weather proof and the only downside is the 15 pounds of pack space it takes up. I've also slept outdoors in a hammock with a heavy wool blanket wrapped up inside a USGI gortex bivy. Which is great, until the weather goes terrible even with a tarp.

Those two setups at different ends of the spectrum are about all I've got to go on. I want to point these guys in the right direction and lay some options out in front of them, but this isn't my strong suit. If anyone can layout a setup that's simple and works I'd appreciate it.

I'd really like to know some simple cost effective lightweight ways to get guys a decent nights sleep.

 

[CampingJosh]

Have to have a pad; it's always miserable to sleep on the ground, and cold weather can make it dangerous.

October weather is unpredictable enough that I take a lightweight sleeping bag (45 degree rating, I think) and a bag liner in case it gets colder. Silk liner makes that bag fine down below 40 degrees in a shelter... even colder in a tent.

I always use a travel neck pillow when camping. Inside a mummy bag, it never comes off my neck,and it works no matter how I roll around. It's the best pillow option for the size/weight.

 

[actaeon277]

Remember to layer clothes.

And when sleeping, you want layers UNDER you.
Before going to bed, change underwear. The clothes you wore during the day will have sweat and body oils in it, cooling you off in your bag.
Don't drink a lot before bed, or you'll be up to go to the "facilities".
Bring something to put your boots on in the tent, scrap carpet or plastic.

 

[actaeon277]

Boy Scout Winter Camping Tips

 

[KittySlayer]

A wool cap.

 

[thunderchicken]

Ok you mentioned you are taking some "rookies" for a hike and overnighter. Without knowing them I would say make sure the hike isn't more than they can handle. If their idea of a hike is a paved trail and you put a pack full of gear on them and start hiking rugged trails they will never make it. Also consider their age/ maturity.
Not to toot my own horn but as an Eagle Scout I have years of experience camping in all weather. If this is their first night of camping..keep it simple and make it fun. My tips would be... Make sure they have plenty of good food, make sure you help them do all they can to stay dry (wet feet and clothes =being miserable), wear fresh clean clothes to bed (as stated above body oils and sweat=not so warm nights sleep), sleeping bag and pad are a must, stocking cap of some sort to slep in, if it is cold DO NOT completely cover yourself inside your sleeping bag (condesation inside from breathing can = frost on the bag), use a plastic ground cloth under all bedding, as the more experienced person pack extra stuff in case they forget something or what they bring is inadequate. Also give them a list of what to bring and make sure they know to pack for the weather (extra socks are a must & keep feet dry). If you have a small tent that would be best for shelter oh and keep food out of the tent..nothing like waking up with a raccon eating your snacks in your tent

 

[SmileDocHill]

Plastic under the tent saves the tent. Plastic on the inside of the tent keeps you dry. If your tent isn't brand new I like to put my "ground tarp" inside the tent even though it is cut to size as if used under the tent. This creates a couple inches on all sides where the plastic folds up creating a bowl you stay dry in.
Hike slow trying not to exert anyone. If they are like me and somewhat out of shape it will reduce likelihood of injury but more likely it will prevent them from sweating too much. You don't want to sweat out and have all the clothes you are wearing soaking wet with sweat before making camp. If it is nice and cool you often don't realize you are soaking wet with sweat behind the footprint of the backpack until you take off your pack at camp.
Avoid cotton as much as possible.
Have fun. I'm envious, haven't been on a simple hike and camp in a long time. I work with my son's Boy Scout troop a lot but it is almost ALL base camp camping. The trailer even brings the gear to the camp site.

 

[melensdad]

I'd suggest a few things.

Expectations, make sure they understand that 2 or 3 miles of walking in the woods with a backpack is not like walking 2 or 3 miles on flat city streets. They need to understand that it could take 2 hours to cover 3 miles, depending upon the terrain.

Wet, bring rain gear of some type. We use expensive rain gear and I will never go back to cheap stuff. But for a newbie any sort of rain gear is better than none. Even if it is just a $5 disposable type poncho. But they need rain gear just in case. DOUBLE CHECK the weather, if rain is forecast then reschedule. Newbies will not have fun in the rain. You want them to have fun.

Socks. Wool "light hiking" socks. Nothing but wool. And specifically designed for hiking. Not general use wool socks. Not wool running socks.

Sleeping pad to keep them off the ground. Either a closed cell foam (it pads + insulates) or a backpacking air mattress that has insulation too (most do not) because sleeping on cold ground is miserable.

Not sure what type of tents you are using but single wall tents can be miserable in the fall/winter unless they have lots of ventilation under the eves, ends, etc. But as mentioned by others CONDENSATION is not your friend. A ventilated double wall tent designed for 3 season use would be good. If using a single wall summer style tent then make sure they leave the end flaps open (they can close the bug screen) but the main flaps should be open to allow a breeze to prevent condensation.

Packs? Make sure they use an 'frame' pack (internal or external) with proper hip belt for hauling gear while hiking. Make sure they know how to wear a backpack! Most people don't understand that the shoulder straps are NOT for carrying the weight and are only for load stability. The weight should be transferred to their hips by the pack frame. Same theory as a gun belt ... the heavy belt spreads the weight to carry a heavy gun, mag, flashlight, etc. A properly designed backpack carries the weight on your hips, the frame (most modern packs use some sort of rigid wire frame that is hidden inside the fabric) transfers the weight to the hip belt, which distributes it.

Back to EXPECTATIONS ... make sure they understand that they are carrying stuff for a couple miles to a campsite and that the more they carry the heavier their load the more uncomfortable they will be. You want them to be as comfortable as possible. If they are uncomfortable they will not enjoy themselves.

FWIW, my wife and I hiked roughly 550 miles this summer from Southwest France across Spain to the Atlantic ocean. My daughter and Goddaughter joined us for the last 110. I got 1 blister. My pack weighed about 30# without food but with 2 liters of water. Last summer we crossed England. I've done part of the AT. Been doing this stuff for 35 years, took winter survival training, etc. So I've got a bit of experience ... most of which takes me back to making sure they understand what is expected of them, what they are expected to do, how long they will walk, how much weight they will carry, how comfortable they will be, etc etc etc ​

 

[Cameramonkey]

This is my goto winter solution.

Hampton by Hilton Hotel Rooms and Reservations

 

[teddy12b]

Lots of great advice everyone and please keep it coming. These guys got interested in this hike after hearing about me doing it solo. I've shown them pictures of the trails, my camp setup, and everything I carried. I have a room in the basement that I jokingly call my Army surplus store, and I'm trying to lend out nearly everything they'd need so these guys don't feel like they have to buy anything. Part of my thoughts trying to make sure they enjoy it is that they don't get in trouble with their wives for buying something that they'll only use one time. I've got some large alice packs with external frames, an CFP-90 & kelty coyote 80 with internal frames. Those are pretty huge packs, and even though the guys say they want to distribute the weight of everything equally, I'm going to do my best to bear the brunt of it as a way to make sure they enjoy themselves. Part of wanting to make sure they enjoy themselves is that I'm going to have them over some night and we're going lay out every sleeping option that I've got, and then have them pack it up and carry it a mile. There's a lot of wisdom to be gained in that first half mile of carrying a load especially when you're not used to it.

These guys are in average everyday joe, kind of health, not super fit, not super unfit either. I don't think any of them go to a gym and they're all office/teacher types. I'm an office guy too, but I go to a crossfit gym. I plan on going at the slowest guys pace and taking many stops along the way. For 2 miles one way, I think they're all going to handle that just fine. My biggest concern is their comfort of being able to get a decent nights sleep that night. I don't think the weather is going to merit taking out the full military sleep system, but I think it'll be a good idea to bring it all just for the sake of added layers.

On the topic of the military sleep systems, what ever happened to the good old days of being able to buy a whole like new setup for $60 - $75? I was looking last night for the first time in years and wow the prices on those seem to have gone up quite a bit. I get the supply and demand part, but in hindsight I wish I'd have bought more of them when I had the chance.

 

[Nojoy621]

A tarp, a wooby, and a mre heater.

but on a serious note, comfortable, dry, and warm footwear. That have been broken in, even a short 2 mile hike can be ruined without proper boots.

 

[teddy12b]

A tarp, a wooby, and a mre heater.

I'll be showing these guys a woobie for sure, but if that's all I told them they'd need you'd probably find me in the woods a week later with all the guys saying they don't know what happened, LOL.

 

[Leo]

Camping during cold weather? I use an airline ticket to somewhere warm. Ol' Leo is getting soft these days.

 

[melensdad]

Lots of great advice everyone and please keep it coming. These guys got interested in this hike after hearing about me doing it solo. I've shown them pictures of the trails, my camp setup, and everything I carried. I have a room in the basement that I jokingly call my Army surplus store, and I'm trying to lend out nearly everything they'd need so these guys don't feel like they have to buy anything. Part of my thoughts trying to make sure they enjoy it is that they don't get in trouble with their wives for buying something that they'll only use one time. I've got some large alice packs with external frames, an CFP-90 & kelty coyote 80 with internal frames. Those are pretty huge packs ...

Damn ... by biggest pack is a 50Liter pack and I've used that for 2 month hikes. The empty pack weighs about 2.5#.

My favorite all around pack is a 45L that weighs just over 2 pounds and can comfortably carry 35# and I can push it up to 40# in a pinch.

The mil-spec on those Alice packs is frameless but attachable to an optional frame. They are heavy too. Just over 4# empty PLUS the frame weight so roughly 5#.

Never let any newbie carry a frameless pack. In fact, for any load bigger than 10-12# I would never want to ever carry a frameless pack any sort of distance. Frameless packs are miserable. I've used them. Longest hike I've made with a frameless pack was about 200 miles with an 18-to-20# load and I was miserable the entire time that was hanging on my shoulders. Never again. Lesson learned ... the hard way.

 

[teddy12b]

My alice packs were bought as my cheapskate way of being my own utility tractor. When I bought the land I planted a lot of bare root trees and a 5 gallon bucket full of trees slips easily into the pack so off I'd go with shovel in hand. The CFP-90 was bought more for memory sake. I went overseas with an Alice, but came back with a CFP-90 I'd purchased while there. The kelty I came across an amazing sale on when I was looking for some kind of a pack that I could wear and not look like I'm there to invade. I've been really lucky on finding bargains on those packs, and what usually ends up taking the most room are the wool blankets I like to sleep in.

My wool blankets are my pride and joy, they're 100% Alpaca wool from alpaca4less.com. They're really thick, durable, and oh so soft and comfy. Besides them taking an ember better than anything made of nylon they also hold the heat when wet, so I let them take up all the pack space they want. Just my queen size wool blanket takes up a big part of that Kelty 80 liter pack. They may end up looking stuffed to the rim, but that's just because what goes in them is pretty big an puffy.

Hands down the most comfortable pack is the kelty, so I'll make sure if anyone has a back problem or any hindrance they get that pack. I've used all those packs so I'm good with whatever is left over. Even though those packs are huge, I have to fight the urge to just throw in more items/weight. Having carried the packs before, I try to remind myself I have to carry them with whatever I load in them. The other part of all this is that I've generally stuck to what Uncle Sam has put in front of me to use and that's why most of my gear is USGI. I know how to work with that stuff, but I'm also getting old and smart to realize there's other ways to get the same task done that are a lot more comfortable.

 

[actaeon277]

Bring extra clothes and extra footwear.

 

[KittySlayer]

Gear check - weekend before.

Have them pack all the stuff they think they need a couple weeks beforehand. Then have a gear check session. Spread out all the crap they have packed and tell them what they don't need. Make sure they have not overpacked! Make a shopping list so they have a week to hunt things down, that extra pair of socks, new laces since their current ones are frayed, etc. Look for cotton clothing and have them substitute fleece or wool (think layers).

Make it a Slumber Party!

Kidding aside, have them sleep in the sleeping bag with a pad at home on the floor one night. That way their first night of learning what it feels like in a mummy bag is not a night they need a good rest.

 

[teddy12b]

Kidding aside, have them sleep in the sleeping bag with a pad at home on the floor one night. That way their first night of learning what it feels like in a mummy bag is not a night they need a good rest.

I'm going to make sure and off the gear up to the guys to borrow as much as what they'd like to long before the trip. Sleeping in the bags before would be a great idea. I've never cared for sleeping in a mummy bag and it takes some getting used to.

 

[rosejm]

Gear check - weekend before.

Have them pack all the stuff they think they need a couple weeks beforehand. Then have a gear check session. Spread out all the crap they have packed and tell them what they don't need. Make sure they have not overpacked! Make a shopping list so they have a week to hunt things down, that extra pair of socks, new laces since their current ones are frayed, etc. Look for cotton clothing and have them substitute fleece or wool (think layers).

Make it a Slumber Party!

Kidding aside, have them sleep in the sleeping bag with a pad at home on the floor one night. That way their first night of learning what it feels like in a mummy bag is not a night they need a good rest.

Seconded. You can help them understand that even things they think they'll use everyday, might only get used once a day, or ONLY once on this short trip.

Full-size toiletries for EACH person? Don't need all that, even for a month long adventure.
Complete change of clothes for everyday? Probably not required. Jeans? HELL NO
Personal flashlights/lanterns? Again, not really needed. Spare batteries? Maybe 1 set for the entire group to share.
Only 2 water bottles? You'll want more than that...

Advocate generally for less stuff, and plan to help them carry out about 30% of what's taken in.

Once it's packed up, let them march around the neighborhood for a 30m walk. Or even just up and down your stairs. Even adding just 20% to their body weight will open their eyes.

 

[teddy12b]

Water is going to be a big deal for these guys and especially with the weight of it. I've got enough of these GEN3 Stainless Steel 32 oz. Bottle & Nesting Cup Set - Self Reliance Outfitters? pathfinder 32oz stainless containers with cup & lid combo's to lend one to everyone going. We'll top off our bellies with water before hiking in. Once we've found water, setup camp and gotten a nice fire going we'll drink up and replace what we brought in. Worst case, I have the water purification tabs we can use, but we've avoid that at all costs.

Part of this will be showing them a couple of bushcrafty skills and one of those will be boiling water for drinking. With the nesting cup they'll be able to have an instant oatmeal breakfast, and a hot coco drink before bedtime. I'll probably surprise them with the hot coco drink mixes as a treat.