What happens when you get to a hospital?

[bwframe]

I think you gotta plan for the worst. If you carry a BUG and or a long gun, you have to prepare to have all confiscated. IIRC doesn't it take months to get your firearms released from Marion County?

 

[gvonpaul]

Great so any of us could potentially be in a shoot out, take the bad guy down, but take a couple ourselves and we get stuck with that one scared EMT who won't come near us and we bleed to death.

Being that the details of a shooting are rarely evident right away, yes. No one has any way of knowing if you are a good guy or a bad guy, and we are advised by our dispatchers not to enter the scene until the police have cleared it. In actuality, we are not allowed to enter the scene until it is safe, otherwise we face disciplinary action. Paramedics and EMTs have no duty to place their lives on the line for public safety.
v

What if, before becoming an EMT he had a felony conviction? This could get worse and worse.

It is my understanding that it is difficult to get a certification if you have a felony conviction.

 

[sbcman]

Being that the details of a shooting are rarely evident right away, yes. No one has any way of knowing if you are a good guy or a bad guy, and we are advised by our dispatchers not to enter the scene until the police have cleared it. In actuality, we are not allowed to enter the scene until it is safe, otherwise we face disciplinary action. Paramedics and EMTs have no duty to place their lives on the line for public safety.
v
It is my understanding that it is difficult to get a certification if you have a felony conviction.

Exactly right on not entering the scene. It can be tough to wait, especially if you work rural areas where I worked and there's a handful of deputies across a county and one trooper across a couple of counties. But, that's just SOP for anything related to gunfights, suicides, domestics, etc. The first priority of anyone in EMS is to make sure the scene is safe for themselves and their partners. EMS doesn't know which side of the fight anyone is on and they aren't paid or trained to sort it out. Best to let the boys in blue do that and make sure the scene is safe. In short, yes, if you've sustained a mortal wound in a gunfight while out in the sticks you could very well bleed out while EMS waits on LEO making the scene safe. Of course, the more aged guys on the unit knew to take it slow on such runs to make sure LEO got there first.

Agreed on the felony stuff. I seriously doubt anyone with a felony conviction will get into EMT school, much less work for an EMS service. I don't remember what background checks I had to go through, but that was 95 and I was 18

 

[rmabrey]

RMabrey is an EMT but he doesn't really post much on INGO anymore. I'll ask him when I run into him at INS.

IMO they just have an officer on scene remove and hold on to your weapon. As long as you have a LTCH You would be fine.

You rang?

Great question! What if you are hurt in the parking lot of a school and the EMT handles your pistol (gun, that is .) He/she would be in possession of a handgun without a license and also in possession on school grounds. What if, before becoming an EMT he had a felony conviction? This could get worse and worse.

For starters, you cannot become an EMT or Medic if you've been convicted of a felony so that is a moot point. Find me a cop that would arrest an EMS working for illegal possessing YOUR firearm while providing you medical care and ill show you a cop that will be unemployed pretty quickly.



Now to address the OP, if your unconscious, your clothes are getting cut off. At that point we will find the gun and it is getting handed to an officer on scene. If your conscious, you better tell me you have a gun, at which point it is going to the officer anyway. Its less about personal safety than it is Me having no desire to be responsible for your gun.

On the subject of you being involved in a self defense shooting and being injured.........well you better hope its not life threatening cause im not going in till the cops say its safe. Dead EMS workers, help nobody. If I get all gungho running in there and the bad guy isn't dead and i get shot......guess who is getting the first ambulance. That's right, me. Now you have to wait for the third ambulance.

 

[bwframe]

Not passing any judgment whatsoever, how many die waiting on a secure scene?

 

[rmabrey]

Not passing any judgment whatsoever, how many die waiting on a secure scene?

None in my experience. PD generally doesn't play around with things like that

 

[vitamink]

#1
If you haven't thanked a medic today, go out and find one and give him/her a big hug. These guys risk some serious **** for little pay and do miraculous things. I am constantly in awe when medics arrive on serious scenes and keep someone together long enough to get them to surgery.

#2 In marion county if you are in an accident, chances are your guns will be released to whatever family member is on the scene or comes to the scene. If you have the ability to talk and wish to release the gun to a friend who has shown up then that'll work too. If that doesn't happen it will be taken to the property room for safe keeping.

 

[Roadie]

#1
If you haven't thanked a medic today, go out and find one and give him/her a big hug. These guys risk some serious **** for little pay and do miraculous things. I am constantly in awe when medics arrive on serious scenes and keep someone together long enough to get them to surgery.

#2 In marion county if you are in an accident, chances are your guns will be released to whatever family member is on the scene or comes to the scene. If you have the ability to talk and wish to release the gun to a friend who has shown up then that'll work too.

If that doesn't happen it will be taken to the property room for safe keeping.

while they test fire it to record ballistic data, then make you dance through hoops to get it back, finally releasing it to you only after you agree to being fingerprinted illegally, then you will get back your roughly treated, fired, rusty gun...

 

[actaeon277]

Not passing any judgment whatsoever, how many die waiting on a secure scene?

One of the two gunman that robbed a bank in full armor, in North Hollywood.
North Hollywood shootout - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Sorry its a mobile device link.

Anyway, the guy with the long name, starting with Mat, bled while they attemped to stop the 2nd gunman.
Of course, his family tried to sue. Maybe, they should have sued the 2nd gunman, he could have given up.

 

[Somemedic]

Not passing any judgment whatsoever, how many die waiting on a secure scene?

Until someone volunteers to put my children thru college and raise them by my value setbodies can be butt deep to a tall indian and I wont go in til the scene has been made safe

 

[gvonpaul]

Not passing any judgment whatsoever, how many die waiting on a secure scene?

In most instances, police arrive first, especially in the case of shootings. We had one last night just around the corner from our station and there were three police officers on scene before we arrived. IMPD is VERY good about making things safe for us and I am deeply appreciative. If I ever have to treat a police officer, he can be assured he will be feeling no pain by the time we reach the hospital. It's the least I can do to show my gratitude.

 

[bwframe]

... If that doesn't happen it will be taken to the property room for safe keeping.

...IIRC doesn't it take months to get your firearms released from Marion County?

To clarify, I'm a lone ranger. There will be no friends or family at the scene. How long will it take to get my firearms released from the property room?

 

[bwframe]

Not passing any judgment whatsoever, how many die waiting on a secure scene?

Until someone volunteers to put my children thru college and raise them by my value setbodies can be butt deep to a tall indian and I wont go in til the scene has been made safe

Sorry, didn't mean to insinuate you should do any different.
I still have the question though. On top of that I live rural. EMS is much closer to me than LEOs might be.

 

[MedicMonty]

None in my experience. PD generally doesn't play around with things like that

^^^^ This

 

[JoshuaW]

I was in a relatively bad accident, and while I denied EMT transportation to the hospital, while we were figuring it all out an officer held my firearm and ammo. I would assume if you are found unconscious, an officer would be called to collect it.

 

[FFM173]

Paramedic here... This is how I would handle it. If the gun was discovered in the ambulance enroute and not earlier by LEO, and most times it would be discovered in the ambulance as we are stripping you. I would unload and take possession of your firearm and retain custody until arrival at the ER. I would also look for your LTCH and keep the two together. I would turn both over to security at the hospital. I would also make contact with a family member to advise them of who has and where your firearm is at. I would also make contact with you after the fact to ensure the firearm was returned to you and to offer assistance with getting it returned to you or a family member.

 

[mrortega]

Paramedic here... This is how I would handle it. If the gun was discovered in the ambulance enroute and not earlier by LEO, and most times it would be discovered in the ambulance as we are stripping you. I would unload and take possession of your firearm and retain custody until arrival at the ER. I would also look for your LTCH and keep the two together. I would turn both over to security at the hospital. I would also make contact with a family member to advise them of who has and where your firearm is at. I would also make contact with you after the fact to ensure the firearm was returned to you and to offer assistance with getting it returned to you or a family member.

No offense but you wouldn't have any authority or control over that once it is handed over to the police or security at the hospital.

 

[FFM173]

No offense but you wouldn't have any authority or control over that once it is handed over to the police or security at the hospital.

You "might" be right, but its the gesture of reaching out and letting you know what happened and who has it. And how would you know if I could or could not assist or ensure in the return of it. Well you dont. So thanks for your worthless input! No offense of course!

 

[Bushido Devil Dog]

Paramedic here... This is how I would handle it. If the gun was discovered in the ambulance enroute and not earlier by LEO, and most times it would be discovered in the ambulance as we are stripping you. I would unload and take possession of your firearm and retain custody until arrival at the ER. I would also look for your LTCH and keep the two together. I would turn both over to security at the hospital. I would also make contact with a family member to advise them of who has and where your firearm is at. I would also make contact with you after the fact to ensure the firearm was returned to you and to offer assistance with getting it returned to you or a family member.

This is exactly what happened when I had a driver-to-driver head-on collision on State Road 67 back in 1993. The wreck knocked me out instantly upon impact, collapsed my lungs, broke every bone in my face , broke my left hip and ankle, and worst of all gave me a bad scratch on my right thumb so I was unable to say a word about my Taurus PT-99 that I was carrying that day.

They gave the pistol, holster, mags, and ammo to my brother in a plastic bio-hazard bag (my blood somehow managed to get on the holster, even though I had two coats on that cold winter day).