What kind of LTCH do I need?

[rmabrey]

You can transport without a license from your home to YOUR fixed place of business, meaning a business you OWN

I retract this statement, upon further review of the IC I feel I am incorrect.

 

[merkava1]

Can anyone point to a case in Indiana where a citizen got arrested and convicted specifically and only for carrying a handgun in a secure wrapper to a shooting range [and every range is a veritable place of repair]. The citizen not being wanted, nor on probation, nor with a prior conviction. Not a second cousin's buddy either. Documented public records.

Still waiting...

 

[merkava1]

I retract this statement, upon further review of the IC I feel I am incorrect.

But you are correct NOW rmabrey!

 

[rmabrey]

Still waiting...

Here is a first hand story from a member. If you want documentation youll have to look that up yourself

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo..._self_defense/25254-asking_for_your_help.html

 

[RichardR]

I am not attempting to be argumentative, but your assertions that federal transportation laws will cover an INDIANA citizen are INCORRECT for Intra-state transportation of a handgun. If a person were traveling THRU Indiana, and be legally able to carry a handgun in the location where they started, and the location where they end up, then yes federal interstate transportation laws would apply. This would NOT cover Intra-state transportation such as home to work, and back, or home to the range and back.

INGunGuy

What part of "any place" & "any other place" did you not understand?

Serious question, what part of the above do you not understand? PLEASE PAY CLOSE ATTENTION HERE BECAUSE THIS IS IMPORTANT: there is absolutely NO REQUIREMENT in that federal statute mandating that the "transport" start in one state & that it must end in another.

 

[INGunGuy]

What part of "any place" & "any other place" did you not understand?

Serious question, what part of the above do you not understand? PLEASE PAY CLOSE ATTENTION HERE BECAUSE THIS IS IMPORTANT: there is absolutely NO REQUIREMENT in that federal statute mandating that the "transport" start in one state & that it must end in another.

What part of federal statues dont you understand? They cover INTER-STATE commerce, and NOT intra-state commerce? We are NOT talking about INTER-STATE commerce, we are talking about INTRA-state transport.

I dont know if you have a LTCH, if not I highly recommend you get yours as it will CYA if you are transporting from home to work or vice-versa.

INGunGuy

 

[Timjoebillybob]

I know it was neglectful & not purposeful because it would conflict with this federal law:[FONT=Arial,Helvetica][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica][/FONT]I hope this clarified this issue for everyone.

One or two problems with that. The IN code was enacted before 1986, it was 1983 iirc.

Also since your so big on legislative intent, what was the intent of that provision of the 1986 FOPA? Was in interstate or intrastate transport?

And yes it clarified at least one thing for me, that you have no idea what in the heck your talking about.

 

[RichardR]

What part of federal statues dont you understand? They cover INTER-STATE commerce, and NOT intra-state commerce? We are NOT talking about INTER-STATE commerce, we are talking about INTRA-state transport.

I dont know if you have a LTCH, if not I highly recommend you get yours as it will CYA if you are transporting from home to work or vice-versa.

INGunGuy

That's not the way it works.

A Federal law forbidding discrimination, drugs, etc, trumps an individual State or local law which would allow it, regardless of if that discrimination or drugs were or were not being transported across State lines.

In this case it is a Federal law that forbids a State or local government from prohibiting the transport of lawfully owned firearms by individual citizens, from any place to any other place that they are lawfully allowed to own them.

I honestly cannot believe that I am having to explain this to another adult.

 

[INGunGuy]

That's not the way it works.

A Federal law forbidding discrimination, drugs, etc, trumps an individual State or local law which would allow it, regardless of if that discrimination or drugs were or were not being transported across State lines.

In this case it is a Federal law that forbids a State or local government from prohibiting the transport of lawfully owned firearms by individual citizens, from any place to any other place that they are lawfully allowed to own them.

I honestly cannot believe that I am having to explain this to another adult.

I cant believe I am having to explain to another adult how they are so incorrect, and handing out bad legal information can jam someone up quickly. If you can cite case law where a defendant was found not guilty of unlawful transportation of a firearm under IC 35-47-2 please send it our way.

INGunGuy

 

[RichardR]

One or two problems with that. The IN code was enacted before 1986, it was 1983 iirc.

And the Indiana State Constitution was written in 1851, which in article 32 specifically states:

"The people shall have a right to bear arms, for the defense of themselves and the State".

Also since your so big on legislative intent, what was the intent of that provision of the 1986 FOPA? Was in interstate or intrastate transport?

They specifically stated it's intent: "necessary to restore fundamental fairness and clarity to our Nation's firearms laws". however the lawmakers intent with the "safe passage clause" was to address problems with interstate transport, their intent was not to clarify or supersede a poorly written Indiana statute, However with that said, it does still have that effect.

And yes it clarified at least one thing for me, that you have no idea what in the heck your talking about.

I've tried to explain all of this the best that I could, I am not responsible if you or anyone else can still not understand it.

 

[RichardR]

I cant believe I am having to explain to another adult how they are so incorrect, and handing out bad legal information can jam someone up quickly. If you can cite case law where a defendant was found not guilty of unlawful transportation of a firearm under IC 35-47-2 please send it our way.

INGunGuy

I just cited a federal law that supersedes a poorly written Indiana law, which completely clarified everything.

If you do not understand it by now, chances are that you will never understand it.

 

[sj kahr k40]

Federal law doesn't supersede Indiana law in this case

 

[RichardR]

Federal law doesn't supersede Indiana law in this case

What part of [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Notwithstanding [/FONT] do you not understand?

 

[INGunGuy]

WOW... Just wow... Can we get a lawyer in the house?

INGunGuy

 

[RichardR]

WOW... Just wow... Can we get a lawyer in the house?

INGunGuy

If he disagreed with you, you'd just say that he didn't know what he was talking about.

This is real simple, I'll try explaining it one last time, in real simple terms so that even a small child could understand it.

A.) Here in Indiana you are allowed to legally purchase & own a handgun without a LTCH.

B.) Here in Indiana you are allowed to possess that legally owned handgun at three places, your residence, your fixed place of business & a place of repair, all without a LTCH.

C.) Here in Indiana you are allowed, under both the Indiana statute & Federal statute to legally "transport" that handgun to & from those 3 places at which you are allowed to lawfully possess that handgun, all without a LTCH.

Now see how simple & easy that is to understand?

 

[INGunGuy]

If he disagreed with you, you'd just say that he didn't know what he was talking about.

This is real simple, I'll try explaining it one last time, in real simple terms so that even a small child could understand it.

A.) Here in Indiana you are allowed to legally purchase & own a handgun without a LTCH.

B.) Here in Indiana you are allowed to possess that legally owned handgun at three places, your residence, your fixed place of business & a place of repair, all without a LTCH.

C.) Here in Indiana you are allowed, under both the Indiana statute & Federal statute to legally "transport" that handgun to & from those 3 places at which you are allowed to lawfully possess that handgun, all without a LTCH.

Now see how simple & easy that is to understand?

Please take no offense, but you have no idea what you are talking about, since of your own admittance, you are NOT a lawyer. If a practicing lawyer in the state of Indiana were to get on here and offer pro-bono advice, which they wont, but if they were and to say that a person would be within the law by transporting a handgun to/from home and work, then I would accept that as binding legal advice, but since that is not going to happen, I am not, and no one else on the forum will be that particular test case.

So I ask a general question for any lawyers on INGO, how about some pro-bono advice on whether it is legal to transport a handgun WITHOUT a LTCH to/from home and work.

INGunGuy

 

[RichardR]

Please take no offense, but you have no idea what you are talking about, since of your own admittance, you are NOT a lawyer. If a practicing lawyer in the state of Indiana were to get on here and offer pro-bono advice, which they wont, but if they were and to say that a person would be within the law by transporting a handgun to/from home and work, then I would accept that as binding legal advice, but since that is not going to happen, I am not, and no one else on the forum will be that particular test case.

So I ask a general question for any lawyers on INGO, how about some pro-bono advice on whether it is legal to transport a handgun WITHOUT a LTCH to/from home and work.

INGunGuy

By your interpretation of the statute ..

If someone bought a handgun & took it to their fixed place of business, that business owner could never legally take their firearm home with them, not even if their place of business went out of business, without first applying for & receiving a LTCH.

Or if someone already had a handgun at their residence, but started up a fixed place of business, that business owner would have to either go buy a new handgun or apply for & receive an LTCH?

No offense man but that's really asinine.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

So, SJ, what's the question?

You know my answer . . . get the license.

 

[Bendrx]

I know it was neglectful & not purposeful because it would conflict with this federal law:

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]§ 178.38 Transportation of firearms.[/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political[/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica] subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping,[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where[/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica] such person may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where such person may lawfully[/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica] possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the[/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica] passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a[/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica] compartment separate from the driver's compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked[/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica] container other than the glove compartment or console.[/FONT]

Lets ignore the fact that this is for interstate travel and look at this:

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]from any place where[/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica] such person may[/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica]lawfully possess and carry such firearm[/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica] to any other place where such person may lawfully[/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica] possess and carry such firearm[/FONT]

In Indiana you can't carry a pistol outside of your property without a LTCH. So at best you're going from lawful posses and carry to a location where you cannot lawfully posses and carry. I'm also NOT a lawyer, and this is my take as I read it. Get the LTCH and avoid the risk.

 

[SavageEagle]

I would love to say I'm learning something, but I'd be lying. Bryan! Bryan Ciyou! Where are you?!?

(Scooby-Doo reference for you old fogeys out there. )