What qualifies as a SBR

[indynotch50]

Good afternoon all. So I'm still trying to work out some details about an AR build I want to do. I'm wanting a short barrel rifle, but don't really want to bother with the paperwork of an SBR.
I was actually looking at a using a Magpaul MOE adjustable stock and either a 7.5" to 11.5" barrel and a noveske kx5 or something equivalent. However, after doing some research, it looks like I may be treading in some deep paperwork waters.
Sorry, I'm still kind of a rookie at all this, not to firearms, just to ARs and the endless world of modification.

Thanks,
Chris

 

[1mil-high]

From the ATF website a rifle having a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length;(4) a weapon made from a rifle if such weapon as modified has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length;
"

 

[sgreen3]

That would classify as an SBR anything with a "stock" and a barrel length of less than 16" or a 14.5" barrel with pinned & welded flashider. If you wish to use a shorter barrel as you described you can build it as a pistol and just use an arm brace such as a Shockwave brace..

 

[jd4320t]

Build it as a pistol. Use the Sig brace or Shockwave Blade.

 

[indynotch50]

Yeah probably should have looked there. So if I were to take the 16" barrel off my current AR and replace it with a 11.5" barrel, I have to register the weapon with the ATF and get a stamp?

 

[jagee]

Yeah probably should have looked there. So if I were to take the 16" barrel off my current AR and replace it with a 11.5" barrel, I have to register the weapon with the ATF and get a stamp?

Yes

 

[seedubs1]

If it has a stock on it (if it does, it's a rifle), then yes, you need big brother to grant you permission. Configure it as a pistol, then no.

Yeah probably should have looked there. So if I were to take the 16" barrel off my current AR and replace it with a 11.5" barrel, I have to register the weapon with the ATF and get a stamp?

 

[Bfish]

You will either need to build a pistol, or fill out the paper work, pay your $200 to pass go, and wait... A lot of people decide to go the pistol route instead for reasons of waiting, going across state lines, $200, paperwork etc. But having a lower that you can slap a short barreled upper on is nice. Some people have several uppers for one or two lowers, and others have sbr's out that wazoo. It's really up to you, but don't be intimidated by the NFA. With that being said, even with sbr's having a pistol lower or two is nice for crossing state lines etc. (you have to fill out paperwork to go across state lines with an SBR)

 

[THE BIG SITT]

Rifle= firearm with a stock meant to be shot with two hands
SBR= Rifle with barrel less than 16"

So yes, an AR with a barrel less than 16" and a stock is an SBR. There are work arounds. First, have a 14.5" barrel with the muzzle device permanently attached. This gets you down 1.5", but that probably isn't enough. So build an AR pistol.

An AR pistol can have a short barrel like you'd desire, but not the stock. So it'd look like this:



You can get an "arm brace". There are a few options, the most popular being the Sig Brace:

Or the Shockwave Blade:



Or these Cheek Rests:




Per the ATF, none of the above devices constitute a stock, therefore keeping the AR in pistol configuration. It should be noted however, that the ATF says that using these as a stock means you have constructed an illegal SBR. Now there is a debate as to whether or not that can actually be enforced, but it is worth noting.

As a side note, if you want to put a vertical foregrip on an AR pistol, endure the overall length is over 26". It is some stupid ATF mumbo jumbo, but take my word on it.

 

[indynotch50]

Rifle= firearm with a stock meant to be shot with two hands
SBR= Rifle with barrel less than 16"

So yes, an AR with a barrel less than 16" and a stock is an SBR. There are work arounds. First, have a 14.5" barrel with the muzzle device permanently attached. This gets you down 1.5", but that probably isn't enough. So build an AR pistol.

An AR pistol can have a short barrel like you'd desire, but not the stock. So it'd look like this:

View attachment 48643

You can get an "arm brace". There are a few options, the most popular being the Sig Brace:

Or the Shockwave Blade:

View attachment 48644

Or these Cheek Rests:


View attachment 48645

Per the ATF, none of the above devices constitute a stock, therefore keeping the AR in pistol configuration. It should be noted however, that the ATF says that using these as a stock means you have constructed an illegal SBR. Now there is a debate as to whether or not that can actually be enforced, but it is worth noting.

As a side note, if you want to put a vertical foregrip on an AR pistol, endure the overall length is over 26". It is some stupid ATF mumbo jumbo, but take my word on it.

What is the length of the barrel / forend on the rifle with the shockwave?

 

[jd4320t]

What is the length of the barrel / forend on the rifle with the shockwave?

I'd guess 8-9. That looks like a 7.5" handguard.

 

[THE BIG SITT]

I'd guess 8-9. That looks like a 7.5" handguard.

I would guess you're right. All pictures but the Sig brace picture (mine) are from Google.

 

[cobber]

And remember, if you build it from a rifle, it's always a rifle...

 

[Dead Duck]

Just put $200 more in the kiddie and build a real gun.
Everyone is trying so hard to "Look" like a SBR that you might as well just make one. Make a few. Join the fun.

 

[IndyGlockMan]

if you do build a pistol with a Shockwave blade or a Sig brace, make sure you don't put those braces up against your shoulder.
Putting a "pistol brace" up against your shoulder is a no no.
I have a 10.5" barreled pistol with a Shockwave blade and I am allowed to put it up to my cheek when firing and it's pretty easy.
If you put a muzzle brake on to help with felt recoil, it's not bad at all.
I also built it with a Law Tactical side folder and a Dolos removable barrel system.
Fits nicely in an old laptop bag.

 

[THE BIG SITT]

Just put $200 more in the kiddie and build a real gun.
Everyone is trying so hard to "Look" like a SBR that you might as well just make one. Make a few. Join the fun.

I finally did register my pistol after two years. Every time I'd go to pull the trigger on it, I'd end up using the money towards a new gun.

 

[indynotch50]

Thanks all. I need to do some more research on how to file as a SBR. Do I have to turn the rifle over to someone while that happens?
That part is all very strange to me.

 

[THE BIG SITT]

Thanks all. I need to do some more research on how to file as a SBR. Do I have to turn the rifle over to someone while that happens?
That part is all very strange to me.

Here is my quick and dirty guide to be used to get your feet wet:

1. Build AR as a pistol

2. Shoot enough to ensure everything works

3. Submit paperwork/Efile Form 1

4. Receive tax stamp (6+ months later)

5. Replace pistol buffer tube and arm brace with a proper receiver extension and stock

6. Shoot

7. Shoot some more

PS- You should get your lower engraved with the required info after ensuring the gun works but before you receive your stamp.

 

[Rookie]

If you already have the rifle...

Submit form one.
Wait.
Wait.
Wait some more.
Wait.
Get your stamp.
Get it engraved.
Put shorter barrel on.
Enjoy.

 

[stephen87]

Yeah probably should have looked there. So if I were to take the 16" barrel off my current AR and replace it with a 11.5" barrel, I have to register the weapon with the ATF and get a stamp?

UNLESS you added a 4.5" muzzle device and pinned and welded it. Then it would be considered a 16" barrel.