When do you shoot?

[Mikeh82]

Ok guys, I had a weird dream the other night and I keep thinking about it... Im going to give the scenario that was in the dream..

Im in rural area with my family in the car.. We come up to a 4 way stop. We make the stop and proceed through the intersection.. While doing so a car comes through the stop and hits the front end of our car. I check on everyone in my car and they are all fine..
I then get out to check on the other driver. While getting out of my car the man exits his car cussing and yelling and getting in my face as he makes his way towards me.. I tell the man he needs to calm down and I dont know why he is mad, after all it is his fault..
The man then says fu@# this im gonna get my gun out of the car and kill all of you...

Ok, now what do you do from here? Do you yell commands at the guy with your gun pulled? if he keeps walking towards the car, do you shoot? Do you wait for him to show a gun?

Also what do you think the legal point is on this?

 

[Indy_Guy_77]

retreat retreat retreat

eject eject eject

bail out bail out bail out


IF it were me in this situation, and provided that EVERYONE of mine were out of our vehicle...

Discretion is the better part of valor.

Yes, I realize that Indiana has no "duty to retreat" law.

But what if the feller ducks back into his car to get his cell phone and has THAT in his hand as he turns back around to face you. And you shoot him.

very bad juju on you. Remember, we aren't LEO. There'd be 100 more scrutiny on you/me/us than on a LEO...and they're raked over the coals.

GTFO, man. GTFO.

If that's NOT possible...

I'd put a few vehicles between him and me and may very well draw and keep at low-ready in case he decides to carry out his threat.

Wouldn't every really know, though, until actually in that situation described.

-J-

 

[BillyJoe]

I started thinking the other day, that it would be a good idea to carry one of those FLIP video recorders in every car (something to record events as they go down). However, we all know the video camera isn't going to save anyone in the here and now (just evidence later). So in this scenario, best I can speculate, I would retreat w/ the family - either in my car (if it still works) or on foot. I can be charged with leaving the scene of an accident, but I will have a good reason to - living.

Of course call to the cops would've been done before I initially step out of my car.

 

[excop78]

Get to cover and see . . .

Lots of people talk about killing and most are bluffing. Get behind your car for cover, tell your family to get down, and wait to see what happens. If you have to defend yourself, the phrase "in fear for my life" needs to be repeated often and make sure the responding officers write it in the report. As a former LEO, that would be how I hope I would handle it.

 

[HICKMAN]

Force on Force training is good with scenarios like this.

If you haven't taken a course yet, I'd highly advise it.

 

[LEaSH]

Ultimately, I would retreat if possible and draw if not and fire when I saw a weapon in his hand.

It's impossible to know what kind of situation and timeframe these scenarios play out, but I'm only hoping that I would have a level head.

 

[bigiron]

if the car is in any way driveable, i'm gone. if not, distance. i wouldn't allow him out of my line of sight even if i had to follow him around his car. if he reached inside his car i would draw and prehaps give a command or two. if he comes up with anything black or shiny hes gonna meet Jesus. i would much rather be judged by 12 in this situation. retreating with 3 small kids and a wife who are going to be shaken up will be impossible. this would be a very tough situation to be in.

 

[SemperFiUSMC]

If he went to his car and it looked like he had something in his hand when he came out he would have just taken his last breath. He communicated a threat and demonstrated the ability to execute that threat. That is enough to justify the use of deadly force. I would go home, eat ice cream, and not give him a second thought. If that sounds cold blooded, it is, but I don't take threats against me or my family lightly.

I would take cover, but not retreat. If he just had a 22 rifle he can shoot more accurately further than I can with my 357 sig. I'm dead. If he has a shotgun I'm in worse shape. I'm staying close enough that I can take him down if necessary.

Remember, the only fair gunfight is the one you win.

 

[CSK22]

Personally I would keep my drivers door open and tell my family to lay down. I'd keep my body behind my drivers door and pull my weapon from my holster(not all the way but enough that if I need to point and aim i can do so between the frame of the door and the car. I would tell him to "stop" and "I'm already calling the police about the accident". (either you could or your wife/child)

From there is where it could get interesting

 

[SemperFiUSMC]

Oh, and the last thing I would do would be to communicate with him in any way. He has established the parameters of our meeting. I would not tell him I'm calling the police, I have a gun, or anything. Telling him you have a gun changes his strategy. Calling out to him gives away your position. The two seconds it takes for him to locate you is 5 - 8 shots. My sole thought and focus would be to kill him before he killed me. You are not under the same handicaps as LEOs. You just have to justify to a reasonable person standard why you feared for your life.

If you can't take a life if you are threatened without running away, getting backed into a corner, or trying to negotiate your way out of a bad situation you should probably carry mace instead..

If he went to his car and it looked like he had something in his hand when he came out he would have just taken his last breath. He communicated a threat and demonstrated the ability to execute that threat. That is enough to justify the use of deadly force. I would go home, eat ice cream, and not give him a second thought. If that sounds cold blooded, it is, but I don't take threats against me or my family lightly.

I would take cover, but not retreat. If he just had a 22 rifle he can shoot more accurately further than I can with my 357 sig. I'm dead. If he has a shotgun I'm in worse shape. I'm staying close enough that I can take him down if necessary.

Remember, the only fair gunfight is the one you win.