Why are so many people scared of "cocked and locked"?

[palerider0485]

1911's should be carried cocked and locked, a few posted ago someone pointed out the the 1910 didnt have the thumb safety and the half cock was refered to as the safety position. 1911's or 1910's were not made to be carried in the half cock position, half cock is a built in safety in case hammer would follow slide forward from failure of sear hammer ingagement, when loading firearm or while shooting. which hammers can and do follow slides. If the hammer was being manually cocked and slipped out of fingers hammer should rest in half cock position. so having said that, the 1910 should have been carried with the hammer all the way down, you can carry a 1911 hammer down aswell firing pin dos not rest on primer. i perfer cocked and locked tho, people are affraid because they dont understand the mechanics of firearms, they arent dumb or anything, theres just alot to know,

 

[palerider0485]

condition 0 loaded mag, loaded chamber, safety disengaged,........condition 1 cocked locked ready to rock...... condition 2 hammer down on live round............condition 3 loaded mag empty chamber...........condition 4 empty chamber empty mag.

 

[dhw9am]

There was a woman in a Starbuck's, who was carrying a gun in her purse. Somehow, it discharged striking the person at
the next table in the leg.
I only shoot with a limited number of my friends, whom I know are safe gun people. For these few people, cocked and locked is acceptable.
However, there are many people out there, that are careless, thoughtless morons. For those people, carrying a gun in any condition, is unacceptable.

 

[Scout]

1911's should be carried cocked and locked, a few posted ago someone pointed out the the 1910 didnt have the thumb safety and the half cock was refered to as the safety position. 1911's or 1910's were not made to be carried in the half cock position, half cock is a built in safety in case hammer would follow slide forward from failure of sear hammer ingagement, when loading firearm or while shooting. which hammers can and do follow slides. If the hammer was being manually cocked and slipped out of fingers hammer should rest in half cock position. so having said that, the 1910 should have been carried with the hammer all the way down, you can carry a 1911 hammer down aswell firing pin dos not rest on primer. i perfer cocked and locked tho, people are affraid because they dont understand the mechanics of firearms, they arent dumb or anything, theres just alot to know,

Thanks, I was going to ask if the hammer being down could be bumped and cause an AD.

Some of you would probably change your minds with a holster like this.
Russian Spetsnaz Makarov Holster - YouTube

Back on topic, I'm sure that the movies have a lot to do with it, anyone who pulls a gun cocks it. No one ever pulls a cocked and locked firearm.

 

[churchmouse]

Thanks, I was going to ask if the hammer being down could be bumped and cause an AD.

Some of you would probably change your minds with a holster like this.
Russian Spetsnaz Makarov Holster - YouTube

Back on topic, I'm sure that the movies have a lot to do with it, anyone who pulls a gun cocks it. No one ever pulls a cocked and locked firearm.

In the movies guns are repeatedly cocked before they are fired. Sound effects guy's work overtime to get the pump action of a shotgun into a scene many times.

 

[Wyzer]

It boils down to the old "Ford or Chevy or Dodge" situation.

People who are educated about their firearms, understand how their firearm can and should be carried.

Those who have an understanding about firearms, often look to "others" to find out how and when their firearms can be carried.

Then the remainder look to the "truth" from the Internet, TV, and movies, so they can "think" they understand how a firearm works/reacts/etc./etc..

 

[Amishman44]

It seems like every time someone sees me carrying my 1911 they always say "woah did you know that thing is cocked" and then they go on to tell me how unsafe it is that I'm just asking to shoot myself and how they're so much more responsible than to carry with a cocked and locked 1911. I don't open carry but sometimes my shirt will come up where it can be seen. I especially love it when the person that says it to me is has a glock or xd, because it gives me a good chance to make them feel like an idiot when I ask them if they don't think they're gun is "cocked". I've even had people tell me that if I'm carrying with one in the chamber that I should at least have the hammer down so it can't go off . I just don't get where people get this fear from, lots of misinformation out there.

I, personally, am not scared of 'cocked-n-locked' 1911 pistols...that's the way they were DESIGNED to be carried! However, in the interest of safety, we have three smaller children (ages 8, 5, & 4) in the house and I'm concerned that I might brain fart one day, lay one down and have one of them inadvertently pick it up! The ability to simply press the safety down, grip and fire the gun is too much for me to risk the lives of one of my children over a pistol style! The wife and I have matching Gen II Glock pistols...and we keep/carry with an empty chamber! I will take the risk that I have the 1/2 second to chamber a round to defend my self rather than have a pistol that one or my children can pick up and pull the trigger and injury/kill another! It's our choice...and we train that way!

 

[palerider0485]

i like the makarov video, im no expert on makarovs but im pretty sure that alot of them were made with out safetys and made to be carried hammer down on a live round. a few post ago scout asked about an AD happening from carrying hammer down if hammer was bumped, its not impossible but i dont see it happening, less likely to happen hammer all the way down then in half cock, in half cock if you drop gun and sear brakes your hammer has some travel time which may or may not be enough for an AD. hammer all the way down, if you drop gun on hammer, hammer is already forward all it can move, and firing pin is still sitting off the primer. 80's series 1911s have a firing pin block safety and then only way firing can strike primer is if trigger is held in rear position.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

The ability to simply press the safety down, grip and fire the gun is too much for me to risk the lives of one of my children over a pistol style! The wife and I have matching Gen II Glock pistols...and we keep/carry with an empty chamber! I will take the risk that I have the 1/2 second to chamber a round to defend my self rather than have a pistol that one or my children can pick up and pull the trigger and injury/kill another! It's our choice...and we train that way!

Wouldn't it be safer and smarter to train to not leave your loaded firearm laying around where a child could play with it unattended? Seems like relying on a child not being able to rack the slide isn't much of a step up over relying on them to not deactivate a safety, and there's already threads about why carrying without one in the chamber is a bad idea. I wish I had the link to the video of the guy who shoots at two carjackers in his window, killing one, and how quickly that happened. He was fighting them off with his left hand, if he'd carried on an empty chamber he'd likely be dead.

 

[Wyzer]

Wouldn't it be safer and smarter to train to not leave your loaded firearm laying around where a child could play with it unattended? Seems like relying on a child not being able to rack the slide isn't much of a step up over relying on them to not deactivate a safety, and there's already threads about why carrying without one in the chamber is a bad idea. I wish I had the link to the video of the guy who shoots at two carjackers in his window, killing one, and how quickly that happened. He was fighting them off with his left hand, if he'd carried on an empty chamber he'd likely be dead.

Are you referring to this video ? (Warning Graphic Video)

I also have to your post, BehindBluel. Train them, train them, train them, then when that is done, repeat. I know I have also had to teach my children about electrical outlets, climbing on large and tall pieces of furniture, cutlery, etc., and weapons are no different.

Of course, this is IMHO, and in your house, you do what you do, period.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Are you referring to this video ? (Warning Graphic Video)

Yup, that's it. Rep inbound, thanks.

 

[metaldog]

It's the "cocked" part that scares them.

 

[88E30M50]

I think the fear of carrying in condition 1 comes, in part, from societies movement away from first hand knowledge of materials and mechanics. Couple that with the throw away culture that accepts junk that fails within 2 years and you get people that are frightened by a cocked and locked pistol. In the back of their mind rests the knowledge that stuff fails. Stuff does not last. They think that the best designed stuff only works for a couple of years before it wears to the point of needing replacement. The idea that a 1911 is kept from going off by a small bit of metal that (in their minds) is going to wear down and fail, scares the heck out of them. They look at their wonder toys that only last a year or two before needing replaced and just cannot come to grips with the idea that anything mechanical could be safe enough to trust.

In the past, many of us had basic shop classes in high school that taught us about different materials and what they could and could not do. Many of us took jobs or worked in the military in jobs that taught us more about the mechanical properties of metal and polymers. Most folks today totally lack that background and just don't trust mechanisms. They've been brought up in a digital world where there are programs that allow things to happen and protect things from happening. They just cannot get their arms around the concept of a small bit of metal like a sear being trusted to keep the hammer from popping a round off. These are some of the same folks that think we need smart guns with programming to keep bad things from happening.

In my opinion, that's the basic reason a lot of folks don't trust guns to not go off. They are just clueless when it comes to all things mechanical.

 

[churchmouse]

Are you referring to this video ? (Warning Graphic Video)

I also have to your post, BehindBluel. Train them, train them, train them, then when that is done, repeat. I know I have also had to teach my children about electrical outlets, climbing on large and tall pieces of furniture, cutlery, etc., and weapons are no different.

Of course, this is IMHO, and in your house, you do what you do, period.

That video is real world folks. Real world.

My kids have been around firearms their entire lives. They have used them since they were of an age we deemed them capable. I could leave my EDC on the table (I didn't) and they would never give it a second look. They were aware of what they were designed to do.
And the same with outlets/knives/hammers/etc and so on.

 

[jwh20]

It seems like every time someone sees me carrying my 1911 they always say "woah did you know that thing is cocked" and then they go on to tell me how unsafe it is that I'm just asking to shoot myself and how they're so much more responsible than to carry with a cocked and locked 1911. I don't open carry but sometimes my shirt will come up where it can be seen. I especially love it when the person that says it to me is has a glock or xd, because it gives me a good chance to make them feel like an idiot when I ask them if they don't think they're gun is "cocked". I've even had people tell me that if I'm carrying with one in the chamber that I should at least have the hammer down so it can't go off . I just don't get where people get this fear from, lots of misinformation out there.

It's actually all a really sneaky plan by the bad-guys union to help give them more of an advantage in any lethal-force-required scenario. They realize that if lawful carriers are locked-and-loaded that they stand a much greater chance of injury or death than it the carrier has no round in the chamber. Since a dead or injured bad-guy can't "work" it really hurts in the dues collection process.

 

[ashby koss]

No one is scared of a Glock though. Cocked and no safety...must be because Glocks are just better.

They can read your mind, and can assess the target before discharge!

 

[HoughMade]

The way I heard it on INGO, a manual safety is the most dangerous thing any gun could ever have, so it's not the "cocked" part that's scary. It's the "locked" part, apparently.

 

[Tombs]

You guys have never heard of the old C&S SFS system Safety Fast Shooting Kit

Lets you have the hammer down on a cocked and locked hipower or 1911, when you depress the safety the hammer snaps back automatically. It's really slick to see in person lol.

Are you referring to this video ? (Warning Graphic Video)

I also have to your post, BehindBluel. Train them, train them, train them, then when that is done, repeat. I know I have also had to teach my children about electrical outlets, climbing on large and tall pieces of furniture, cutlery, etc., and weapons are no different.

Of course, this is IMHO, and in your house, you do what you do, period.

That video is a good example of what I try to explain to people.

If you have time to chamber a round, you are not acting in self defense.
If you ever get into a situation where you need to deal with a active shooter, the sound of racking your gun may end up getting you killed as well. In the very least, you'll certainly realize exactly why everyone tells you to carry with a round in the tube.

A 1911 with a firing pin block is one of the safest handguns I can imagine while still being fast and intuitive. DA/SA would be my second pick, if you need a precise shot it doesn't take long to get the hammer back on a sig or H&K. H&K does give you the option of carrying 1911 style, I prefer to convert them to V3 to avoid a possible fumble though.

 

[longbarrel]

Is it really scared, or is it a lack of understanding?

Unfortunately, it is probably a little of both. The biggest problem imo is that a lot of people are sheep and have **** for brains.

 

[427TriPowered]

loaded chambered cocked locked in thumblock holster... takes a micro second to open the thumblock and drop the safety in a single fluid motion... safe and fast... the 1911... the worlds best pistol platform...