Wind Farms

[BigMatt]

It looks like I am smack dab in the middle of proposed wind farm territory in Henry County.

Part of me wants to stay out of the fight since it will probably go through anyway. Part of me wants to go to the meeting tonight to voice my opinion.

Aside from my anti-man-made-global-warming stance, the only gripe I have is that it might ruin my view and might affect property values. I also don't like the thought of people I don't work for making money at my expense.

What are the thoughts on wind farms in your back yard? What would you do?

 

[bobzilla]

WE're trying to get the scratch together for our own. It's a great way to use something that is ever-present in certain areas. In this case it's wind. In southern states it's Sun. Coastal states its oceans etc. I don't get the negativity to wind farms that I've seen/heard and I don't get the lower property values. I would think access to renewable power would be a BENEFIT to property values.

 

[Dean C.]

The Anti-Wind Farm people are always great to watch at these meetings, I remember fondly when the crazies came out in force when the Tipton wind farm was put up.

 

[HoughMade]

Let's be clear. There are non-crazy reasons to oppose a wind farm, especially if you live RIGHT THERE. The problem (or entertainment) is that at public meetings, the nutty are prominent and loud.

 

[rhino]

It looks like I am smack dab in the middle of proposed wind farm territory in Henry County.

Part of me wants to stay out of the fight since it will probably go through anyway. Part of me wants to go to the meeting tonight to voice my opinion.

Aside from my anti-man-made-global-warming stance, the only gripe I have is that it might ruin my view and might affect property values. I also don't like the thought of people I don't work for making money at my expense.

What are the thoughts on wind farms in your back yard? What would you do?

If you go, ask them who will pay to decommission the units, remove them, and restore the property when the maintenance costs exceed what they can manage with the combined revenue from power plus the subsidies/tax abatements.

Also, ask them about their insurance coverage for accidents that occur due to improper installation of both the units and the related heavy duty cables that they will bury.

Then ask them about that actual cost per kilowatt-hr compared to the same for a typical coal-fired plant without the benefit of the subsidies and tax breaks.

Then ask them about the costs of the running the boilers at the nearby coal-fire plant continuously (but without actually generating any power) because it's necessary to have them online and ready for when the wind turbines are idle or fail to produce adequate power. If they're doing this for alleged environmental concerns, ask them about it again.

Finally, ask them why they don't install a nuclear plant instead, which would be superior in virtually every relevant way.

 

[KittySlayer]

If you go, ask them who will pay to decommission the units, remove them, and restore the property when the maintenance costs exceed what they can manage with the combined revenue from power plus the subsidies/tax abatements.

Also, ask them about their insurance coverage for accidents that occur due to improper installation of both the units and the related heavy duty cables that they will bury.

Then ask them about that actual cost per kilowatt-hr compared to the same for a typical coal-fired plant without the benefit of the subsidies and tax breaks.

Then ask them about the costs of the running the boilers at the nearby coal-fire plant continuously (but without actually generating any power) because it's necessary to have them online and ready for when the wind turbines are idle or fail to produce adequate power. If they're doing this for alleged environmental concerns, ask them about it again.

Finally, ask them why they don't install a nuclear plant instead, which would be superior in virtually every relevant way.

So you are one of those loud, crazy nuts at the meetings interjecting logic and facts into the situation. I have heard these same facts from guys in the industry as they giggle about how much the greenies are willing to pay for these giant fans.

I bet your carry a gun too.

If you go, ask them who will pay to decommission the units, remove them, and restore the property when the maintenance costs exceed what they can manage with the [strike]combined[/strike] revenue from power [strike]plus the subsidies/tax abatements[/strike]...

FIFY.... when is now.

They should have to put decommission funds in an escrow account before they put up these future metal StoneHenges.

 

[rhino]

So you are one of those loud, crazy nuts at the meetings interjecting logic and facts into the situation. I have heard these same facts from guys in the industry as they giggle about how much the greenies are willing to pay for these giant fans.

I bet your carry a gun too.



FIFY.... when is now.

They should have to put decommission funds in an escrow account before they put up these future metal StoneHenges.

Well, I have been branded a "science denier, adding "loud, crazy nut" to my resume would be nice!

You're right about the maintenance costs. The decommissioning is inevitable. It just depends on when the artificial influx of money ends or fails to be enough to keep the sinking ship from going to Davey Jones' locker.

 

[AngryRooster]

Just going to drop this here.

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...l-discussion/383560-aftermath-whirligigs.html


Unintended consequences and all.

 

[historian]

Finally, ask them why they don't install a nuclear plant instead, which would be superior in virtually every relevant way.

They could, but the greenies won't let them. Cheap, relatively safe, relatively clean technology! CAN'T HAVE THAT!!!!!!

 

[BugI02]

....
Finally, ask them why they don't install a nuclear plant instead, which would be superior in virtually every relevant way.

Bingo. You win the internet for today

 

[wagyu52]

Been almost 10 yrs since the first wind farm appeared in Benton county just up the road. I can tell you that they laid waste to that section of the county. I watched them drag tower sections with bulldozers on county roads, problem was the county officials where unaware of the magnitude of destruction during construction and had no provisions to repair what they destroyed. I think they changed that in the next wind farm projects and made them get a bond or escrow money and rebuild what they tear up.
Anyone that thinks they are necessary and good for the environment should put in a few within eye and ear shot of their house and find out just what kind of pollution they put out.

 

[BogWalker]

We have held them off for some time now in Rush County. They're still trying, but the largest effort has been defeated.

So how much government money are these windmill people getting to siphon off for these BS projects anyways?

 

[Gluemanz28]

I just don't understand why all the hate for FREE energy

 

[actaeon277]

I especially love driving through wind farms as they are idled, so that they can keep a generator running at a big enough load to make it worthwhile.

 

[actaeon277]

[video=youtube;rxlHcSRdbjg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxlHcSRdbjg[/video]

 

[mom45]

So...did you go to the meeting? This is a topic that interests me so I'm curious as to how the meeting went. Was this a Board of Zoning Appeals meeting or Planning Commission? Does your county have a wind ordinance or do all proposed wind farms have to get a variance to be allowed?

 

[HubertGummer]

I've been wondering how efficient (amount of power produced vs. total operating costs) they are compared to other generation means. I would think if they were actually profitable the government wouldn't need to subsidize them.

 

[BigMatt]

So...did you go to the meeting? This is a topic that interests me so I'm curious as to how the meeting went. Was this a Board of Zoning Appeals meeting or Planning Commission? Does your county have a wind ordinance or do all proposed wind farms have to get a variance to be allowed?

OK, I went to the meeting. It was a community meeting. The only people there were opposed to the wind farm. Even though everyone was invited, there were about 300-350 people and no county commissioners, no county councilmen, no reps from Calpine (the company proposing this project).

There were a bunch of people spouting anecdotal evidence about headaches, drowsiness, memory loss - physiological stuff. I can't comment on that since I don't know if it is or is not true.

There were videos of the insides of peoples' houses when the blades "flicker" through the windows. That was very disturbing. I looked at a plat of the proposed sites, and there are 2 proposed within 1/2 mile of my house.

I was mostly interested in the property value stuff, county finance stuff, effect on the surrounding area - basically stuff that affects me.

The main points I gleaned were:

1) Nobody knows who is making the decisions. Everybody says that it is the County Commissioners, but another guy says he talked to Kim Cronk (a county commissioner) and Kim said he doesn't vote on that. I have contacted him through Facebook and he has yet to get back with me.

2) The study that Calpine presented on property value loss were seriously flawed. There are no unbiased studies that present change in property values in a true light. The study they cite takes a sample size of 51,000 homes, and less than 100 were within a mile of a windmill when they were sold. That is less than .2% applicable data. I don't consider that a viable study. Also, the study was commissioned by the Department Of Energy so that illustrates the bias from the beginning.

3) Nobody knows exact locations for the windmills. This could make a big difference on my opinion of a wind farm.

4) The proposed setbacks from property lines are 1.1:1 . That means for a 499 foot tower, it only needs to be 550 feet from the property line.

5) This is only viable through government grants. There are Production Credits, Installation Credits, Tax Abatement, Accelerated Depreciation... All these things are on the backs of the American People. Not to mention loss of property value for the people around the wind turbines.

My first priority is to find out who to talk to about his. I will be contacting the County Commissioners, the County Council, the Sheriff, the Mayor, whoever it takes to get a straight answer. I will also be studying up on real property value data.

I think I have made the decision to get more involved. I am not saying it is good or bad, but I do want the appropriate people to take responsibility for their votes. I don't want this to fly under the radar and no one to be accountable.

 

[JeremiahJohnson]

Is there a business case presented by Calpine...or anyone? Rhino makes a fine point about subsidies, any true business case falls completely apart without them. The coal plants still run, nothing is really gained.

Bottom line, without the technology to STORE energy on the grid/from the grid, periodic influx of energy - like wind - is not helpful or free in any sense of the word.

 

[INPatriot]

Was not the purpose of the industrial revolution and the technological advances that followed doing away archaic means of harnessing energy in favor of more powerful sources of energy that could be stored, distributed and obtained? I will never understand the wet dream many have with reverting to energy sources that peaked in the 15th century.

On another note, I am thankful for the people that grow our food. However, a farmer receiving government subsidies to put up wind turbines, turn corn into ethanol or plant and harvest the crop is welfare as much as the un"earned" income tax recipients at the bottom or the billionaire recipients of corporate welfare at the opposite end of the economic spectrum.

China and India are building coal plants at alarming rates. Russia and the Arab Gulf States as well as the former Soviet satellite states of Central Asia are sucking as much oil and gas out of the ground as they can and Washington DC is killing the coal industry and refuses to harvest the other big energy resources we have.

There does need to be a plan, it would be heinous if there was not a plan. But the bovine scatology that the United States needs to decrease its carbon footprint while other players attempting to assert themselves on the main stage build whatever it takes to get ahead is the political correctness that is creating a one way street to cultural suicide in this nation. Its fantasy to believe any measure the United States takes to cut its emissions make a difference globally when nations such as India, China, Russia and many other developing nations heed no rules. Political correctness, cultural suicide, see above.

Shoot the caribou, use the meet to feed the hungry, drill and frack, get as much natural gas out of the ground, fill the stores to the brim then create more stores and more stores beyond that, be energy independent, keep the coal mines open, create jobs gas, coal and oil jobs and give the people that hate us the middle finger and play by means that make us stronger and not weaker.