I got pulled over last night...

[Chefcook]

When the officer approached my vehicle I kept my hands on the steering wheel and said good evening officer what seems to be the problem. He asked me if I knew why he pulled me over to which I responded No sir. He then asked me for my credentials, I provided them. The next question was where I was going? I responded, sir what is the reason you pulled me over, am I free to go? The officer then asked me where I had come from. I am sorry sir is there a problem or am I free to go? The officer then got a little irate and asked me if i had any weapons in the vehicle. I answered yes sir. I have a Kimber .45 on my hip and my Sig P238 in the small of my back. He took 3 steps back and assumed a defensive position. Asking me to slowly carefully exit the vehicle. Once out he had me disarm myself laying my weapons on the roof of my car then asked me to walk backwards towards him till I could be cuffed and subdued for his and supposedly my safety. He then searched my vehicle unloaded my weapons confirmed my LTCH before allowing me to recover to a citizens point of view. I have very mixed feelings about this encounter. The officer was polite and he did not try to abuse me in any way however, I do not feel he had the right to disarm me as he did. Nor do I feel he had the right to cuff me for my own protection. I understand the threat our officers face everyday. And I cheer them on for the sacrifice they make in taking and putting their lives on the line. I however refuse to allow any man to disarm me, unless I have committed a crime. This is a fine line a very grey area for me...

 

[Rookie]

The only thing I would have done different is lock the vehicle upon exiting...

 

[Chefcook]

My feelings about this encounter are mixed. On one hand I feel I betrayed myself and my political views by allowing myself to be disarmed. I gave up my rights to avoid persecution, because I knew I was credentialed. It made me realize we really dont have any rights beyond what the power's that be feel like giving us based on their whims.. That is not freedom, its slavery...

 

[Rookie]

It won't let me edit...

I would have locked the door upon exiting, and I would have told the officer that I was feel my weapons are safest where they where. I would have calmly explained to him that I would not be comfortable removing my weapons, he would have to do it. I would also explain that I do not consent to search or seizure.

Now, if he wanted to remove them himself, that would be his choice, but I would not assist him in violating my rights. If he chose to, I would be asking for his supervisor.

Personally, it sounds like you didn't cooperate the way he wanted (good for you not answering his irreverent questions) and it threw him off his game...

 

[Chefcook]

It won't let me edit...

I would have locked the door upon exiting, and I would have told the officer that I was feel my weapons are safest where they where. I would have calmly explained to him that I would not be comfortable removing my weapons, he would have to do it. I would also explain that I do not consent to search or seizure.

Now, if he wanted to remove them himself, that would be his choice, but I would not assist him in violating my rights. If he chose to, I would be asking for his supervisor.

Personally, it sounds like you didn't cooperate the way he wanted (good for you not answering his irreverent questions) and it threw him off his game...

Yea thats funny I had written years ago how I would do exactly as you stated but in the confrontation I did not i acted differently, I chose to take the easy way and try and walk away easy... I question myself because i was willing to compromise my values based simply on the fact i knew I was credentialed... That is so far away from my belief. I feel like a chump and a sell out... I have no defense for anyone that would say so...

 

[Hammer]

What did he pull you over for?

 

[misconfig]

Yea thats funny I had written years ago how I would do exactly as you stated but in the confrontation I did not i acted differently, I chose to take the easy way and try and walk away easy... I question myself because i was willing to compromise my values based simply on the fact i knew I was credentialed... That is so far away from my belief. I feel like a chump and a sell out... I have no defense for anyone that would say so...

Don't sweat it dude, you can't always prepare for the situation until it happens. The sad thing is, the law isn't on our side - once you're targeted you've gotta ride it out; if you don't you either get killed, beat or thrown in jail for the night.

The game is rigged.

 

[finity]

IMO, the cop abused his authority.

He had no reason to treat you like he did. HE was the criminal in this case.

I would tell you to file a complaint but you know as well as I that it will lead absolutely nowhere. The cop did it for his safety, donchaknow.




The cop did it because you dared to challenge his authority in an area where he had no authority. Where you are going, what you are doing, etc is none of his business & you called him on it. He had no choice (in his mind) than to put the boot down a little tighter on your neck. Just so we don't get to "uppity".

I guess they don't read new cases (http://www.ai.org/judiciary/opinions/pdf/06031001fsj.pdf) to cops that restrict their abilities to trample on citizens rights.

 

[lovemachine]

It almost sounds like if you had answered his irrelevant questions, and participated in his small talk, this never would have happened.

Granted, you dont HAVE to answer every question, but by responding to his questions like you did only opened this up. In MY experience, if you're polite to the officer, do the small talk thing, you'll be able to get away with no ticket AND nothing else.

Notice I never said anything about admitting you're carrying.

BUT, if everyone thinks I'm wrong about this, then I apologize, and will shutup

I AM sorry this happened. And I do hope you file a complaint. The officer didn't have any right in acting the way he did.

 

[finity]

The game is rigged.

Yup.

 

[finity]

It almost sounds like if you had answered his irrelevant questions, and participated in his small talk, this never would have happened.

Granted, you dont HAVE to answer every question, but by responding to his questions like you did only opened this up. In MY experience, if you're polite to the officer, do the small talk thing, you'll be able to get away with no ticket AND nothing else.

Notice I never said anything about admitting you're carrying.

BUT, if everyone thinks I'm wrong about this, then I apologize, and will shutup

& open yourself up to any further investigation?

Cops are trained (as one of them recently admitted) to get people to do things they don't want to do (like allowing them to search their vehicles, etc with no PC). I assume this also means they can get you to say things you don't want to say. The cops job is to try to find things to arrest you for. That's it.

Why make their jobs easier by answering questions they don't have the authority to make you answer. It's not personal. Just like it's not personal if they arrest you for doing something illegal - even if you didn't know that it was.

It's better to just keep quiet.

Most of us would find it very hard to do so seeing as we've been conditioned to answer those questions from authority figures since we were born. The cops know it & use it to their advantage.

I find it concerning that you are trying to blame Chef for being treated like he was when he was merely exercising his Constitutional Rights to keep quiet. It's not HIS fault the cop went on a power trip just because he wouldn't submit to unecessary question.

 

[Drako]

Call me ignorant (as I'm sure you can see, I'm a noob) but is it legal for him to search your car unless you consent?
I allowed my car to be searched once and it was obnoxious. I will not consent to that ever again.... The entire experience left me feeling as if I had actually done something wrong.

I also think handcuffing you was pushing it.....


But I really don't know much about the laws and protocol.... I'm sorry it happened though

 

[lovemachine]

Don't get me wrong. I'm not blaming anything on Chief. I do think it was wrong what happened to him.

But maybe I read his OP the wrong way. I got the feeling he could have come off as rude, to the officer.

I'll go back and read the OP again.

And I do understand what your saying, and I also agree.

& open yourself up to any further investigation?

Cops are trained (as one of them recently admitted) to get people to do things they don't want to do (like allowing them to search their vehicles, etc with no PC). I assume this also means they can get you to say things you don't want to say. The cops job is to try to find things to arrest you for. That's it.

Why make their jobs easier by answering questions they don't have the authority to make you answer. It's not personal. Just like it's not personal if they arrest you for doing something illegal - even if you didn't know that it was.

It's better to just keep quiet.

Most of us would find it very hard to do so seeing as we've been conditioned to answer those questions from authority figures since we were born. The cops know it & use it to their advantage.

I find it concerning that you are trying to blame Chef for being treated like he was when he was merely exercising his Constitutional Rights to keep quiet. It's not HIS fault the cop went on a power trip just because he wouldn't submit to unecessary question.

 

[Rookie]

I'm sure the cop did think he was either rude or hiding something when he refused to answer irrelevant questions.

 

[trnsplntfrmohio]

when can we start defending ourselves against these kind of cops?

 

[Rookie]

Probably never. Officer safety don't ya know.

 

[ghitch75]

ok i'll ask too.....why where you pulled over??????????

 

[jeremy]

I would send Letters to his Supervisor, Chief/Sheriff, Mayor/County Commissioners asking for a discussion with them over the Officers behavior...

Caveat, in my County I have the Sheriff on Speed Dial and do use it on occasion...

 

[finity]

Don't get me wrong. I'm not blaming anything on Chief. I do think it was wrong what happened to him.

But maybe I read his OP the wrong way. I got the feeling he could have come off as rude, to the officer.

I'll go back and read the OP again.

And I do understand what your saying, and I also agree.

You say you agree but then you seem to imply that it was Chef's actions that caused him that outcome.

Rudeness to a cop is no justification for the cop to trample on his rights. People are rude to me at times (just like anybody else) but that doesn't mean I can legally disarm them, handcuff them & search their stuff. I just have to deal with it as professionally as possible & move on. That's what the cop should have done. If the cop can't handle someone exercising their rights without going on a power trip then they probably made the wrong career choice.

 

[JetGirl]

Rudeness to a cop is no justification for the cop to trample on his rights.

If the cop can't handle someone exercising their rights without going on a power trip then they probably made the wrong career choice.