Price differences in AR-15s

[critter592]

In general terms what is the difference between an AR-15 in the $600 / $1000/ $1500-2000 range. I know, you get what you pay for. But what's the difference? Accuracy? Life limit? Reliability?

 

[sloughfoot]

Marketing. Perceived value.

The parts are made by just a couple of suppliers.

All AR's are just as good as every other one. No matter what the hype and marketing.

Your $600 AR will be just as accurate, reliable, and will last just as long as the $2000 AR.

 

[Booya]

Marketing. Perceived value.

The parts are made by just a couple of suppliers.

All AR's are just as good as every other one. No matter what the hype and marketing.

Your $600 AR will be just as accurate, reliable, and will last just as long as the $2000 AR.

with only a few minor exceptions I completely agree with this.

 

[Jarhead77]

I have to generally disagree....the cost should reflect many variables no one seems to have mentioned...what's the lower made from? Polymer? Forged? 80% er "custom" from Frankenstein Armory? who made it? What's their service like? Accessories? Rails? Flat top? Handle? What type of barrel? Twist? Flash suppressor? Each of these will effect cost and can effect reliability, accuracy, etc...

 

[Trigger Time]

There are big quality differences as you go into the custom guns. This is a fact, however at some basic level using quality parts you achieve reliability.
There are ****ty AR's out there that still cost a lot. But there are damn fine AR's that wouldn't give you trouble at $600.

The question that is more important to me is what do you expect out of your gun? Do you know how to properly maintain it and how often do you want to clean and maintain it and what kind of ammo are you going to shoot out of it. Do you want to roll on the ground with it or do you just want to shoot paper targets from a bench?

one thing I do feel that a gun I consider reliable should do is shoot whatever I feed it. Steel case or brass case, it shouldn't matter. Doesn't mean I will shoot anything through it but the option is there.
i don't want a finicky gun at any price.

 

[djhuckle]

How much does the Military pay? Theirs work. An inexpensive AR isn't a "cheap" AR. Educate yourself on the parts and if you see a rifle with good parts at a good price, go for it. Do you need a billet lower/upper? $ Fluted barrel? $ Match grade barrel? $ Trigger upgrade? $ Noveske, BCM, Daniel Defense, or Wilson on the rollmark? $$ Look around and you can get a real Colt for $700 sometimes. What kind of car do you have? A Ford Taurus SE, SEL, Limited or SHO? Each gets you from A to B but one is more luxurious and one is faster, but they all work fine. I'm sure your car gets you around.

 

[tradertator]

How much does the Military pay? Theirs work. An inexpensive AR isn't a "cheap" AR. Educate yourself on the parts and if you see a rifle with good parts at a good price, go for it. Do you need a billet lower/upper? $ Fluted barrel? $ Match grade barrel? $ Trigger upgrade? $ Noveske, BCM, Daniel Defense, or Wilson on the rollmark? $$ Look around and you can get a real Colt for $700 sometimes. What kind of car do you have? A Ford Taurus SE, SEL, Limited or SHO? Each gets you from A to B but one is more luxurious and one is faster, but they all work fine. I'm sure your car gets you around.

You had me up to the Ford Taurus example

There are a ton of reasons why some cost more than others. Materials, workmanship, fit / finish, warranty, etc..... For some though, reputation, demand, and advertising are also a big factor. I agree that just because one cost more than another doesn't necessarily make it better, but saying they are all the same is simply ridiculous.

 

[jd4320t]

I wanna see the $700 Colts.

 

[venenoindy]

How much does the Military pay? Theirs work. An inexpensive AR isn't a "cheap" AR. Educate yourself on the parts and if you see a rifle with good parts at a good price, go for it. Do you need a billet lower/upper? $ Fluted barrel? $ Match grade barrel? $ Trigger upgrade? $ Noveske, BCM, Daniel Defense, or Wilson on the rollmark? $$ Look around and you can get a real Colt for $700 sometimes. What kind of car do you have? A Ford Taurus SE, SEL, Limited or SHO? Each gets you from A to B but one is more luxurious and one is faster, but they all work fine. I'm sure your car gets you around.

when ever you see a Colt for $700.00 let me know, if I had a nickel for every time I read how you can get a Colt for cheap.

 

[tradertator]

I wanna see the $700 Colts.

when ever you see a Colt for $700.00 let me know, if I had a nickel for every time I read how you can get a Colt for cheap.

PSA has brand new 6720's for $799 (http://palmettostatearmory.com/index.php/colt-ar-15-5-56nato-16-carbine-pencil-barrel.html). The chances of finding a used one for $100 less doesn't seem that impossible.

 

[M67]

Not all ARs are created equal, pick up several inexpensive ones then pick up several expensive ones and you'll notice the difference.

Some budget ARs use cheap and crappy receiver extensions and castle nuts (yes there is a difference, if your castle nut is a cheap one, they can tear when you tighten and looses them cause they're a lot softer than they should be).

There's a big difference in how the barrels are made, what finish they use (none, phosphate, nitride, chrome lined), rifiling, and if they make their own barrels or they license them out. If the gas ports are the proper size per the barrel length used.

Another factor is their turn down ratio for parts, some companies have high standards and their turn down ratio is a lot more than say a rifle from PSA who's standards are looser.

BCGs can be made from different materials and they can be made sloppy.


Damn near anyone can put an AR together, just like Century can put together an AK and some companies can put together a 1911; but there are companies that can actually build an AR (like some actually build AKs and 1911s) where they use quality parts and they put it together right the first time.

There is a difference between cheap ARs and expensive ones but only you can determine if you can justify the price increase with your use/want level.

Same goes for bolt actions, pistols, etc. Not all are created equal.


Oh, I don't "properly maintain" my ARs compared to some people who hose them down after every 5 rounds. I have one that has 2k rounds through it and haven't cleaned it, that crud has been building for 2 years and it's smooth as silk and extremely reliable. For years people have been saying how you have to baby an AR for it to work right, so I keep using my rifles as test rifles for my own curiosity and to say how durable these rifles can be (one friend with a lot more money than I have put 10k through one of his ARs before he cleaned it, it was still running fine but he was amazed it would run that long (got him to use Slip2000) and he was curious how dirty it was).

 

[critter592]

Thank you all!

My intention is to have an AR-15 so that I have at least one rifle. I do not plan on rolling in dirt. Probably shoot once a month at square range. Probably not shoot anything further than 50 yards.

 

[seedubs1]

(Not talking about varmint, or other odd AR's built for a specific application in this post, just your standard 14-18" rifle)

There seems to be a large jump in quality between the $500 AR's and AR's that are $750-1200. You typically don't get a full auto BCG, forward assist, dust cover, or other mil-spec (or better than mil-spec) components on the low end rifles, where you do on the mid-range rifles. Those features, to me, are quite worth the price increase.

The jump from the quality $800-1200 AR to the $2k+++ AR's doesn't seem like much to me. Most of that seems to go to neat/cool features and bling that isn't necessary (although there is some cool stuff out there).

But honestly, I got EVERYTHING I wanted in my $800 build. I got a 4150 melonite 1:7 twist 5.56 barrel from a known GTG manufacturer, a mil-spec BCG from Toolcraft (a DOD contractor), a lpk with KNS pins, a BCM buffer tube kit, a matched forged upper/lower set that has a very nice tight fit between receivers and with the barrel, a very nice free float handguard, etc, etc, etc... it's a really nice gun, and I just don't see what I get more out of a rifle from one of the super expensive boutique brands other than a different stamp on the side.

So from a standpoint of it being a tool, I don't see the need to go to the uber high end AR's. I just can't justify it. Now, if I had unlimited funds, would I buy some of the uber high end rifles? Heck yeah.

 

[critter592]

Any opinions on BCI in Bremen, IN?

SQS15 Rifle: Domestic Defense Model - BCI Defense BCI Defense

 

[phylodog]

I received a good bit of knowledge on the M16/AR15 platform from a gentleman who spent a career testing, evaluating and designing components and systems for USNSWC. He would disagree strongly with the assessment that there are only small differences between the components being utilized across the industry.

 

[flatlander]

Marketing. Perceived value.

The parts are made by just a couple of suppliers.

All AR's are just as good as every other one. No matter what the hype and marketing.

Your $600 AR will be just as accurate, reliable, and will last just as long as the $2000 AR.

Good for you if you're willing to bet your life on it. I'm not. Look at what chokes and pukes in high round count classes and then tell me they are all the same. I'd bet the higher end ARs will out shoot, out last and stay shooting a whole bunch longer than the bargain ARs. I've owned Olympics, Bushmasters Colts and BCMs. I know what has worked for me and what hasn't.

Bob

 

[Cerberus]

Marketing. Perceived value.

The parts are made by just a couple of suppliers.

All AR's are just as good as every other one. No matter what the hype and marketing.

Your $600 AR will be just as accurate, reliable, and will last just as long as the $2000 AR.

I could not disagree with this more. The second sentence alone is about 15 years out of date, even then there were more than a couple.

 

[cop car]

Good for you if you're willing to bet your life on it. I'm not. Look at what chokes and pukes in high round count classes and then tell me they are all the same. I'd bet the higher end ARs will out shoot, out last and stay shooting a whole bunch longer than the bargain ARs. I've owned Olympics, Bushmasters Colts and BCMs. I know what has worked for me and what hasn't.

Bob

My sub $600 AR15 is more reliable, will last longer, shoot better and for a longer period of time than 90% of the $1500+ guns that are out there. Mine is as mil spec as they come. These milled and custom fit $1200-3000 rifles are great when everything is perfectly clean and shooting amazing ammo, but their stainless barrels and tight tolerances that make them shoot well will wear out really fast and have issues with dirt. You wouldn't believe what I have seen $500 military rifles survive and still shoot decent. Don't kid yourself, 99% of us (myself included), the rifle out shoots us. Ie you clamp it in a vice and shoot it 30 rounds and it will have a tighter grouping than you shooting it or a rifle of higher tolerances and accuracy. Enough of that though....


Things to watch for with AR15s


Barrel - a way a lot of brands save money is by using non treated or coated barrel. Not saying that non chrome lined is bad. In fact a lot of people prefer a meloninted or phosphate treated barrel. But usually those are more expensive, cheap ones usually have a chrome lined or bare steel barrel. Another barrel thing to watch out for is the profile. Most cheapies are pencil profile. Nothing wrong with a pencil profile. Makes the rifle a lot less nose heavy and easier to wield. But most of the "better" brands use mid profile or gov profile.


Lower - non aluminum lowers are showing up more and more. Jury is still out on that one. I'll stick to nice aluminum mil spec personally.


Buffer tubes - be careful of non mil spec buffer tubes. They almost have gone extinct. But it's something to watch for


lower parts - I've heard of people using non mil spec parts. Dangerous. That is the most important part of an AR15, makes it work or not work


upper receivers - again non mil spec stuff out there. Have to watch out for it. Other money cutting things are no forward assist (I don't care what anyone says. It's needed. Try to quietly charge your AR15, it didn't seat the bolt did it?) No dust covers is another one of those things that I would way rather have than not have. A lot of cheap ones are slick side.. No forward assist, no dust cover and no shell deflector. There are very good reasons why all those items are on the military rifles. Slick side rifles have their place though, if you wanted a super thin, light and simple rifle.


Front sight block - good ones are f marked. Forged. And pin on. Taper or straight. Some people like bolt on gas blocks, myself and Uncle Sam both think its not sufficient in holding the sight block in combat and especially long term combat situations.

Bolt carriers - a good one will be chrome lined, properly staked, and not over staked. Full auto vs non full auto doesn't really matter IMO. But mine has the auto bcg, keeping mil spec as possible.


Pistol grips, rails, trigger guards, etc etc etc. all vary. Usually in the gun world, cheap stuff is crap. There are some exceptions and some of the cheap crap works.. For now. But if you are building a rifle to defend yourself do you really want to have your Chinese $50 quad rail fall off as you slam your rifle into a door frame as you are trying to run to or away from something or someone? I don't, that's why I cough up the money for quality stuff that is proven and made out of quality materials. I'm sure I will get plenty of arguments about all this though ha

 

[flatlander]

Do a search for "Filthy 14".
My personal experience, since I have not used 100% of ALL ARs out there as it seems others have, is that you get what you pay for. Again, IN MY EXPERIANCE, is that YOUR $600 gun may work for you but I'd bet money if you'd stack it head to head, round for round, yours would choke and puke before the mid/ upper tier weapons.
YMMV and we will just leave it at we agree to disagree.

Bob

 

[cop car]

Do a search for "Filthy 14".
My personal experience, since I have not used 100% of ALL ARs out there as it seems others have, is that you get what you pay for. Again, IN MY EXPERIANCE, is that YOUR $600 gun may work for you but I'd bet money if you'd stack it head to head, round for round, yours would choke and puke before the mid/ upper tier weapons.
YMMV and we will just leave it at we agree to disagree.

Bob

If there was that much of a difference in parts and real world durability sf teams and seals wouldn't still be having $500 M4s they deploy with. Yes they have some other weapons in their inventories, but not a single one of them have "high end" AR15s.. You don't bring a garaged babied Ferrari to race in NASCAR...