BATFE To Ban Common AR-15 Ammo

[dusty88]

The radio blurbs this morning implied that all AR15 ammo is being banned. The anti-gunners are practically having orgasms at that possibility.

I think that politically speaking, it IS just as bad as if all AR15 ammo were being banned because the ATF is basically using whatever opportunity they can to try to make law. The president obviously won't stop them, and Congress can't change the law without a 2/3 override. The only way this ban gets stopped is if the pressure causes some kind of Washington deal.

 

[jimbobcooters]

Just got this reply from Luke Messer

Dear Braedon:

Thank you for contacting me to share your opposition to the recent proposal by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) to ban specific types of ammunition. I appreciate hearing from you.
As you know, the ATF proposal would ban 223 M855 "green tip" ammunition by revoking its "armor piercing ammunition" exemption. Under the draft framework, manufacturers would be prohibited from producing and selling 5.56 mm projectiles for M855 cartridges, which are commonly used in AR-15 rifles. Previously, this ammunition was declared as "armor piercing ammunition", but was granted an exemption since it is primarily intended to be used for sporting purposes. Under the ATF's proposal, the exemption for sporting purposes will become much narrower and ultimately affect many law-abiding citizens who use this ammunition for recreational purposes.

The Administration has been attempting to ban the AR-15 rifle for years, only to be stopped by Congress. I am outraged at this backdoor attempt to ban certain ammunition that is clearly meant to suppress the acquisition, ownership, and use of AR-15's and other 223 caliber general purpose rifles. I joined over 100 of my colleagues in sending a letter to ATF Director Todd Jones expressing our serious concern with the proposed framework and emphasizing that the proposed ban will interfere with Second Amendment rights by disrupting the market for ammunition that is used for sporting and other legitimate purposes.

This draft proposal is just that, a draft. The ATF is accepting comments until March 16, 2015 on this indefensible attempt to bypass Congress and impose gun control. Should a permanent ban be attempted after the comment period, I and my colleagues in Congress will fight the effort by this Administration to strip away the rights of Americans. I am a champion of the Second Amendment and oppose efforts to weaken its guarantee that American citizens have the right to keep and bear arms. I have consistently voted to protect Second Amendment rights and have promised my opposition to any legislation or executive action that would prevent the legal ownership of and arbitrary limits on the use of certain firearms or ammunition. You may be certain I intend to continue to vigorously defend the rights of law-abiding citizens to exercise their Second Amendment rights as the debate on this issue continues.

Again, thank you for the benefit of your views.


Sincerely,

Luke Messer
Member of Congress

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Eh, it's easy "clickbait" for radio shows.

Thanks, Rush.

He isn't one to get granular and detailed about these things.

 

[jwh20]

I'm a member of the GOA and received this email which makes it quick and easy to write your Congressman and Senators on this topic. I'll also add that if you're not a GOA member, you may want to consider it. While I am an NRA member, I find that the GOA is much more focused on protecting gun rights and also seems to be more aggressive at times. Anyway, click the link and you can quickly write notes to Washington DC on this topic:

Will Obama be Forced to Swallow a Repeal
of the AR-15 Ammo Ban?​

ACTION: Click here to contact your Senators and Represenatative and urge them to support a repeal of ATF’s AR-15 ban. And tell them to vote against the DHS funding bill -- specifically, urging your Senators to vote against any cloture motion that would facilitate it.
ATF’s ban on common AR-15 ammo
As GOA activists know, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) recently proposed a ban on “green tip” AR-15 ammo.

---

Not a GOA member yet? Make sure to join Gun Owners of America!

---

The ban is completely lawless and unconstitutional, and there are legislators who want to fight the ban.
At least one Republican office is considering an amendment to block Obama's illegal AR-15 ammunition ban by attaching it to the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) funding bill.
But if you’ve been watching the news, you know that there is a royal battle right now over this bill because of Obama’s Executive Amnesty, something that GOA has reported on before.
Executive Amnesty threatens gun owners’ rights
To provide some context, Barack Obama initiated the controversy by unconstitutionally and unlawfully using “executive action” to give amnesty to 5,000,000 people illegally in this country.
How do we know it's illegal? Because Barack Obama himself had said repeatedly that it would be illegal, and now a federal court has said the same.
And, to give you a sense of what stake the Second Amendment community has in this battle, we will quote liberal anti-gun Oregon Democratic Congressman Kurt Schrader, who confidently opined that this fight “will decide who is in charge of this country for the next 20 or 30 years.”
In other words, if you add another 5-8,000,000 anti-gun voters to the rolls, we can kiss the Second Amendment good-bye.
But, to get back to our story, Obama "decreed" an amnesty last year which he himself had pronounced unlawful.
And his primary (unspoken) defense was that the Police Chief (Eric Holder) worked for him and the newly-packed federal courts would, generally, do what he told them to do.
In December, Republicans had their best chance to defeat Obama’s Executive Amnesty. But as many of you will remember, House Speaker John Boehner caved and said that Republicans would fight the battle in February.
Well, we warned Republicans in December that the fight to kill the anti-gun amnesty would be a lot harder if they put it off until February (this week).
After all, we know that if Republicans send Obama a DHS funding bill with NO monies for amnesty, that the President will veto it. And this, of course, means that the Department of Homeland Security sends all non-essential employees home.
How does that help the cause, knowing that in order to defeat amnesty, we’re refusing to pay our border agents? We simply chop off our nose to spite our face.
McConnell Surrenders and Retreats
Making the best out of a less than ideal situation, the House of Representatives has now used its “power of the purse” to do one simple and obvious thing: The House-passed appropriations (money) bill funded all of America’s security operations, with the sole exception of Obama’s admittedly unconstitutional amnesty. And it sent the bill to the Senate.
Enter Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid. Reid has been whining about Republican filibusters for the last six years. But, now that the shoe is on the other foot, Reid has no problem with blocking the Senate from even proceeding to the bill.
And this was the case even though Republicans were prepared to allow Reid to offer amendments -- a courtesy Reid never gave Republicans when he was in charge.
And, incidentally, even though it is Reid who is filibustering, a “lap-dog” press has no problem paradoxically blaming the GOP for holding up the bill.
So McConnell surrendered. His “compromise” would send Barack Obama a “clean” appropriations bill which fully funds Obama’s illegal amnesty. Sure, he has a “sham” companion bill, but that bill will be vetoed and the veto sustained.
Furthermore, in order to avoid forcing Democrats to vote on “uncomfortable” issues, McConnell is offering to use a parliamentary tool to shut out all pro-gun amendments.
Why is this important? It’s important because at least one Republican office is considering an amendment to block Obama’s illegal AR-15 ammunition ban. McConnell’s “compromise” would prevent this amendment from being offered.
So, now that McConnell is lying on the floor (metaphorically) and allowing Obama to kick him in the face, Reid should be satisfied, right?
Wrong.
Harry Reid has just announced that he won't accept McConnell's surrender until House Speaker John Boehner surrenders as well.
ACTION: Click here to contact your Senators and Representative. Tell them to vote against the DHS funding bill -- and specifically urge your Senators to vote against any cloture motion that would facilitate it.

 

[Ericpwp]

D. A.
Dickinson, ND
February 27, 2015
Signature # 61,102

no signatures early feb 27th - early mar 2nd

K. M.
Saint Cloud, FL
March 02, 2015
Signature # 61,103

 

[1775usmarine]

Says 68k and some change now.

 

[hornadylnl]

I think the panic is starting to spread a bit. Having trouble finding 7.62x39 in quantity at any decent price. Still out there with some looking, but definitely less available than a week or two ago.

There is almost no Wolf 7.62x39 listed on Ammo Seek. Not seeing much of any Wolf on any of the major ammo sites. Is this a supply issue with Wolf or due to a run on 7.62x39?

 

[Ericpwp]

69,728

It could be batching all of the back logged signatures. I just hope ALL are counted. The count froze after some news groups started running with it. It is not a complex website. It should be running real time. There is either shenanigans afoot, of some MAJOR incompetency.

 

[actaeon277]

Executive Order M855 | Dennis Santiago

Executive Order M855

This writer appears to be against it, not because it's wrong, but because it detracts from the President's ability for other accomplishments.
In other words, it will just rile up the gun owners, but accomplish little in terms of "protection".

 

[Ericpwp]

From huff po?

 

[oldpink]

Eh, it's easy "clickbait" for radio shows.

Thanks, Rush.

He isn't one to get granular and detailed about these things.

Maybe if you had actually heard the portion of Limbaugh's broadcast in which he explained the nature of this travesty of a ban, you wouldn't claim that he doesn't try to provide details.
He was also right that this is a backdoor ruse to eventualy get ALL high powered ammo banned.

E.G.
Obama's ATFE: We must ban this dangerous ammunition that can penetrate bullet-resistant vests.
Gun owners: But just about any ordinary 5.56/.223 ammunition will do that.
Obama's ATFE: Upon further testing, you are right. We'll now ban all 5.56/.223 ammo, with consideration for not banning any fragmenting bullets used for varmint hunting, but we make no promises for that last either.
Gun owers: Why is 5.56/.223 ammo the demon here, when anyone with a modicum of ballistics knowledge will tell you that standard .30-30, .270, .30-06, and just about any average powered centerfire rifle load will blow through both sides of all bullet-resistant vests except for the unwieldy, and rarely ever worn for that reason, Type III or higher vests?
Obama's ATFE: Upon further testing, we have discovered that nearly all centerfire rifle rounds will totally wreck your average bullet-resistant vest, and those rounds can be fired out of certain handguns (Thompson/Center Contender, Savage Striker, Remington XP100, etc.), therefore we have to ban all high-powered rifle ammunition. Enjoy your rimfire ammo, assuming that you'll have an easier time finding it than before we banned nearly all other types of ammo.

 

[BFG]

Petition = 70301 (How long does it take to get the email verification?)

 

[warthog]

I have written and written and emailed and emailed until my fingers are sore plus I have made a few calls to boot. One thing I do know, the fools out there buying up all this gouger priced ammo and bullets are sure going to feel foolish if this gets knocked down. So far none of the LGS's near me have raised prices in anything but the M855 they may have and there is only one store that does. He hasn't raised it much though, Ian is always the fair riced guy around here. I don't blame him for raising a little, he is in business after all.

I did listen to Rush and frankly this was one of the very few times he has gotten things right. Very few times...as they say, even a brken clock is right twice a day.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Bearing ArmsATF's "Armor-Piercing" Ammo Ban May Spectacularly Backfire, Renew Interest In Military-Style Rifles - Bearing Arms

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Maybe if you had actually heard the portion of Limbaugh's broadcast in which he explained the nature of this travesty of a ban, you wouldn't claim that he doesn't try to provide details.
He was also right that this is a backdoor ruse to eventualy get ALL high powered ammo banned.

E.G.
Obama's ATFE: We must ban this dangerous ammunition that can penetrate bullet-resistant vests.
Gun owners: But just about any ordinary 5.56/.223 ammunition will do that.
Obama's ATFE: Upon further testing, you are right. We'll now ban all 5.56/.223 ammo, with consideration for not banning any fragmenting bullets used for varmint hunting, but we make no promises for that last either.
Gun owers: Why is 5.56/.223 ammo the demon here, when anyone with a modicum of ballistics knowledge will tell you that standard .30-30, .270, .30-06, and just about any average powered centerfire rifle load will blow through both sides of all bullet-resistant vests except for the unwieldy, and rarely ever worn for that reason, Type III or higher vests?
Obama's ATFE: Upon further testing, we have discovered that nearly all centerfire rifle rounds will totally wreck your average bullet-resistant vest, and those rounds can be fired out of certain handguns (Thompson/Center Contender, Savage Striker, Remington XP100, etc.), therefore we have to ban all high-powered rifle ammunition. Enjoy your rimfire ammo, assuming that you'll have an easier time finding it than before we banned nearly all other types of ammo.

Oh, I don't disagree with Rush's take on the whole subject. I, too, believe it's a ruse.

However, Rush either knowingly omitted the type of ammo this is, or didn't think it was important. He led listeners to believe this is a ban on AR-15 ammo.... rather than "this specific type of ammo"

 

[actaeon277]

Bearing ArmsATF's "Armor-Piercing" Ammo Ban May Spectacularly Backfire, Renew Interest In Military-Style Rifles - Bearing Arms

EVERY time they come up with this stupid stuff, MORE guns/ammo get bought.

 

[KellyinAvon]

70,787

 

[BogWalker]

There is almost no Wolf 7.62x39 listed on Ammo Seek. Not seeing much of any Wolf on any of the major ammo sites. Is this a supply issue with Wolf or due to a run on 7.62x39?

That's what I'm wondering. Was the importation of ammo from Russia curtailed due to their involvement in Ukraine? I'm not seeing any of the other non-Russian manufacturers either though. Except, of course, the expensive brass cased stuff.

 

[hornadylnl]

That's what I'm wondering. Was the importation of ammo from Russia curtailed due to their involvement in Ukraine? I'm not seeing any of the other non-Russian manufacturers either though. Except, of course, the expensive brass cased stuff.

CTD is showing Tulammo in stock but no Wolf.

 

[warthog]

545 is still available, 7N6 isn't and it was ridiculously inexpensive too. That was stopped when he stopped all things Russian ostensibly because of what is going on in the Ukraine. Truth is though he could care less what they do as they aren't fellow Muslims. He just wanted to see if he could [pull off something like this and he did it without much shouting from the NRA. The GOA shouted but even then, there wasn't a lot of outrage because it wasn't a very popular ammo. This is the unfortunate trouble, no one wants to get involved if it isn't something they are effected by, they are but it isn't immediate so they will "do it later".