INGO Lowers *haters please read*

[vitamink]

Was it REALLY a "group buy" when I bought 78 of them?

 

[Vigilant]

Was it REALLY a "group buy" when I bought 78 of them?

Yeah...about that, they mistook your order, and you are actually getting 7/8 of a receiver? Sorry for any inconvenience this may have caused! Thank you for shopping with VUPDblue Screw You! Have an INGOY day sir!

 

[vitamink]

Oh well, I was planning to melt them down and fashion an aluminum crown anyways.

 

[Vigilant]

Oh well, I was planning to melt them down and fashion an aluminum crown anyways.

7/8 of a receiver would make a fair tiara, it's close, almost the same thing really!

 

[Double T]

I need one next go round. Regardless. Am I mad that I missed out on the buy? Heck yes. Am I going to cry like a butthurt internet noobile? No. I simply wasn't online when the posting was up. I will be next time

 

[Caleb]

Wait....where's this ingo lower group buy?!!

 

[indyjohn]

fustercluck.

word.

 

[jfed85]

You know what they say, "haters gonna hate".

Personally, Im just thankful for all of your effort VUPD and appreciate this opportunity.

Never in my life would I have thought I would put cash money in and envelope and mail it out to someone from the internet whom I've never met on nothing more than a "promise".
But this isn't just the internet, this is INGO...Its different here. I had to explain that to my wife, she thought I was crazy.

SO again, Thanks VUPD for all of your work with this group buy, and let the haters hate...

 

[1DOWN4UP]

​l could not drive all the way to Indy for a lower,so I drew a little INGO and taped it to a Anderson. I think it is cooler anyway.

 

[SwingW/theWing]

You know what they say, "haters gonna hate".

Personally, Im just thankful for all of your effort VUPD and appreciate this opportunity.

Never in my life would I have thought I would put cash money in and envelope and mail it out to someone from the internet whom I've never met on nothing more than a "promise".
But this isn't just the internet, this is INGO...Its different here. I had to explain that to my wife, she thought I was crazy.

SO again, Thanks VUPD for all of your work with this group buy, and let the haters hate...

i didn't hesitate to send cash for a couple reasons. I've done stupid things that have cost me far more than the price of two lowers and with as proud as INGO is with their name I really didn't have any trust issues. Now my wife started losing her mind when I said I mailed cash. "You can't do that...it's illegal" I wish she took a picture of my face when she said that as I can only imagine the dumb look I had. I told her to think of all those grandparents mailing that illegal birthday money. Nonetheless, I am grateful to have been able to get in on this buy and look forward to seeing the final product. What is the turn around time for a 100 lower receivers?

 

[Bill of Rights]

I feel the need to explain a few things in order to preserve my sanity.

First off, I have been looking forward to INGO lowers coming to fruition since about 2009 when it was first talked about. The ride has been like a roller coaster over the years trying to get this done, with insurmountable obstacles, greedy "middle men" and just plain ol' *******s getting in the way.

Since I have been an INGOer, I have put together 5 group buys for AR lowers and one for Mosin Nagant rifles. None were without their hiccups, but they all were successful in the end. My point is that I have a small amount of experience with these things, which is why I volunteered to tackle the current INGO Lower group buy.

We posted a "feeler" thread with a poll, trying to gauge interest in a lower receiver group buy. The thread was not binding whatsoever. When opening up the official group buy thread, I chose to put a limit on it because of several reasons, the biggest ones being that I have never worked with BCI before and I didn't want to be holding potentially 30k to 40k of INGOers' money and have this turn into a fustercluck. 100 lowers, which is a little under ten grand, seemed to me to be a manageable amount while still getting as many people the opportunity to participate in this go-round as I can.

I chose one single FFL to handle this project for a couple reasons. One, and most importantly, because it is the closest FFL to me physically. I will need to make more than 1 trip to the shop when the product starts rolling in and I simply don't want to have to go all over the place. It's my responsibility and I will make it easier in the areas I can control. Also, I have known Kimball for many years and I trust him, and his shop is somewhat centrally located and easy to get to right off a major highway.

A big issue seems to have been picking out special serial numbers. The logistics of that is difficult at best because I want to guarantee sequential numbers to whomever buys multiples. Also, if any are kicked out as blems during manufacturing, that throws a potential wrench into whomever I promised a certain number to and could screw up the remaining stock for sequential numbers.

There have been many upset members asking why weren't site supporters given first shot or why weren't those who posted in the "feeler" thread given first shot. Again, time, effort and logistics. It simply takes too much time for me to PM everyone who posted in the feeler, and even if I did do that, the folks who have been long time members here and didn't post would have been upset. Then I'd have to wait for every single person's reply before this could go forward. Also, not everyone who voted in the poll posted in the thread. It would have been impossible to personally get with everyone from that thread to determine YES or NO to every single person. It's a no-win situation.

Lots are upset about the payment arrangement. Here's why it is like it is. I have no way to collect credit cards. PayPal is anti-gun and could potentially shut us down in a heartbeat, holding everyone's funds hostage for 6 to 9 months. Square would have been the same. I could have set up a traditional merchant processor, but then there would be added cost to the members in the form of fees. Also, I don't want the exposure of maintaining a CC account for no other reason than to do these group buys. It's not hard to get a PMO and drop it in the mailbox, plus I can keep better records of everyone's info and order. It is more work on my end as well because I have to get all the $ transferred into one fund before I can send it to BCI to get the ball rolling.

I feel like I was very up-front with the rules and guidelines for this project, and at no time was my intent to not include anyone. Quite the opposite in fact, I have done my best to get this initial round going forward so that future rounds will go faster and smoother. Of all the complaints I have gotten, the bottom line for all of them seems to be "you didn't include ME". I'm sorry if you did not get in on this initial order, but by no means are we finished. I'm working on finding FFL partners in the extreme North and extreme South of the state so that more members can be included. I am also working on getting another centralized order going.

At no point have I asked for or accepted any compensation for organizing this. At no point has RobbyMaq asked for or accepted any compensation for creating the artwork for this. We are doing it because the membership asked for it and we want to help.

All the complaining makes going forward seem less and less desirable, so I wanted to put some kind of explanation out there to hopefully clear up why things are happening the way they are. I never dreamed that going forward with this project would have created the **** storm that it has.

And yet, you didn't say that you wouldn't have done it. Thank you for explaining where you were coming from on all this, Nick. Those of us who know you know that you don't make decisions without solid reasoning and rationale behind them. They may be fast decisions, but that doesn't mean they aren't planned. (and usually correct) Rep has been added.

I made a wise crack about requesting one without a Ser.# in the feeler thread.

Between the lines of Nick's rules, there was the ability to do that. You had to pick it up from the ATF personally, though.

I'm so mad about this that I'm going to that "Other" gun forum in Indiana and organize a group Hi-Point buy.

Wait... There's ANOTHER GUN FORUM IN INDIANA?!?

LOL

NO, not really.

Guys, I know you're being sarcastic, but let's be honest here. Yes, there is another forum. We've never pretended otherwise, even when there were two others. There is room for everyone, and if someone doesn't find what they're looking for in a forum or the management thereof, they are welcome to lo ok elsewhere to find what they want or to create it themselves. As a group, we welcome their presence as a contrast to INGO and how we run it.

Speaking personally, and without my "mod hat" on, I will say that I've looked at their site a couple of times as a visitor, and I didn't find what I liked there. A maxim is that criticism is only given in private (and only constructively) and praise is given in public, thus I won't speak ill of anything, including discussing specifics; that's not important. What's important is that people have options. In my mind, the success INGO enjoys is sweeter because the option exists, in that people are not here only because there's nowhere else to go for the content they seek, they're here because they choose to be. Still speaking personally, but with the mod hat back on, that makes me proud to be a part of INGO's moderator team, and proud to count among my friends guys like Nick, who, while he admittedly has been wanting this to happen, took the reins of this GB selflessly and without compensation. PaulF already detailed some of the finer points of his actions in doing so, some of which I'd not considered (such as "invitation only" even being a thought)

Was it REALLY a "group buy" when I bought 78 of them?

Only if, for you, MPD is not a reference to a LEA.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[Dirtebiker]

Nick, no explanation is necessary.
I read the feeler, missed the official thread. Big deal!
I'll try to catch the next on.

Even though it doesn't seem like it by all the stupid complaints, but your effort IS appreciated by most of us!
THANKS!

 

[chezuki]

VUPD,

I know from experience the running a group buy SUCKS. It's something I'd never volunteer for again. The fact that you also know the annoyance but were willing to do this anyway form benefit of the members is certainly commendable. I sincerely hope that everyone who got in on this will put forth the effort to make this as painless as possible for you not only for your sake, but for the sake of those who missed this one and are anxiously holding you aren't too burnt out to consider another.

I sincerely thank you for doing this.

 

[KDUBCR250]

Just wanted to say thank you for stepping forward to do these type of things. Chances are the people who have issues would have had them regardless. Once again thank you.

 

[jsharmon7]

So what I'm getting from this is that I can't hand pick my own lower and special serial number, have it delivered directly to my home with a lemon-scented towelette included, and be billed at my convenience? Further, I'm very special and important here on INGO and I demand to know why that wasn't taken into account. I bet if I went to the INGO-sponsored NFA shoot I'd have to provide my own ammo AND load my own mags like some peasant. I thought this was America, is this not America?

 

[Caleb]

Wait....where's this ingo lower group buy?!!

...

 

[churchmouse]

So what I'm getting from this is that I can't hand pick my own lower and special serial number, have it delivered directly to my home with a lemon-scented towelette included, and be billed at my convenience? Further, I'm very special and important here on INGO and I demand to know why that wasn't taken into account. I bet if I went to the INGO-sponsored NFA shoot I'd have to provide my own ammo AND load my own mags like some peasant. I thought this was America, is this not America?

I want the towelette with mine as well.......great idea.......

 

[Birds Away]

So what I'm getting from this is that I can't hand pick my own lower and special serial number, have it delivered directly to my home with a lemon-scented towelette included, and be billed at my convenience? Further, I'm very special and important here on INGO and I demand to know why that wasn't taken into account. I bet if I went to the INGO-sponsored NFA shoot I'd have to provide my own ammo AND load my own mags like some peasant. I thought this was America, is this not America?

Life seems so unfair.

 

[GLOCKMAN23C]

So what I'm getting from this is that I can't hand pick my own lower and special serial number, have it delivered directly to my home with a lemon-scented towelette included, and be billed at my convenience? Further, I'm very special and important here on INGO and I demand to know why that wasn't taken into account. I bet if I went to the INGO-sponsored NFA shoot I'd have to provide my own ammo AND load my own mags like some peasant. I thought this was America, is this not America?

I want the towelette with mine as well.......great idea.......

Unfortunately all we have are baby powder scented towelettes.

 

[Birds Away]

Unfortunately all we have are baby powder scented towelettes.

See....unfair.