OC Creeper!

[Dead Duck]

Let's face it - not everyone that has a license to carry should. I have never been a fan of open carry because it lacks the element of surprise. People are automatically alarmed and alert by the site of it. If he had come to rob the place, you would be the first person he dealt with because of your exposed firearm. Never have understood why someone would want to stand out like this. I always carry my sig p938 - nobody even knows I have it in my pocket holster. The crook would never see it coming.

Here you go - https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...nse/71996-open-carry-argument.html#post803054

 

[maxmayhem]

This is why i conceal carry

Obviously it was nothing...you lived and got some panda express to boot

 

[Bigtanker]

I guess there is another side to the story.

https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/carry-issues-self-defense/390075-weirdos-panda-express.html

 

[AA&E]

My wife and I are sitting in a Panda Express enjoying our Asian fast food the other day, when this guy walks in with his pistol clearly displayed for all the world to see. Great, right? Well normally, but...

I hate to stereotype, but this guy did not look right to me. He was jumpy and shaky, sweaty, and his eyes were darting from side-to-side. Gave me the total creeps. I now sort of know how the non gun-carrying public feels when someone walks into a restaurant or store with an open carry. Of course at the time, I was not carrying at all, and wished that I was. My wife commented as well that this guy looked like a loose cannon ready to go off somewhere.

I tried to justify his behavior... just got off of work, etc., but no matter what I could think of, I just kept coming back to: "Creeper!" I feel terrible for feeling this way, and his behavior is hard to describe in a forum post, but he was *not* normal, and the thought that he was OC'ing made me feel very uncomfortable.

Has anyone else experienced this? Aren't we supposed to be more tolerant of OC situations?

We got up and left.

I saw a guy open carrying in Kentucky just south of Louisville that was obviously strung out on something. Standing right in front of me in line at a gas station sporting needle tracks on both his arms. I had my wife take the kids to the car and kept watch on him. This guy was tweaking pretty hard. I was concerned. Nothing wrong with being situational aware... despite the slack you will take for this post.

 

[Tyler-The-Piker]

why was the spoof thread locked?

 

[LP1]

...Or he was looking for his cat.

I thought that Panda Express served panda.

 

[foszoe]

I thought that Panda Express served panda.

I heard their new limited time only plate is called the Cecil Special. If you order it, you get a free dental checkup.

 

[Vamptepes]

Ran into a guy at the gas station. White trashy thug type. Carrying a mp in a paddle holster hooked to his sagging pants pocket. Thing was ready to fall off. Looked strung out just watched him until he left the store.

 

[t-squared]

why was the spoof thread locked?

Good question...

 

[2A_Tom]

It 22 posts to get there.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Wonder if he was so jumpy and nervous because that was his first time OCing

That's my thought. It'd be interesting to be able to look back and see each of us on our first few go-arounds OC'ing. I was probably looking around a bit more. I think my first place was a Panera Bread... dunno.

 

[Doublehelix]

Lots of great replies here, and I loved the spoof thread, but could not get in a reply before it was locked! LOL! It was great, and extremely well done!

We don't know what was going on inside of this guy's head, and yes, it could have been his first time with an OC, or it could have been anything. I just know that my hackles went up, and it was time to vacate the premises, just in case. Someone said something about my "spidy sense", and I think that is the best description of all. I am sure it was nothing, but this guy looked like he was strung out and jonesing for something, and I didn't want to get in between him and his need, whatever it was. This guy would have creeped me out even if he wasn't carrying.

I tend to be pretty tolerant of most people, and I spend a lot of time in downtown Indy where you can see all kinds of crazy-looking people! I don't consider myself snobbish in any way, and honestly get along with just about anybody from any background. I volunteer once a week in a food pantry, and you can see some crazy things there as well. Most of the time, they just need some loving and to know that someone cares about them. I stop and talk with people that are obviously homeless, and it is amazing how much they appreciate just being noticed, much less that someone would bother to stop and talk to them. I just wanted to throw that in in case someone might thing that I am just a snob. This guy in Panda Express was just plain dangerous. There is no other way to describe him that would translate well in a forum posting.

 

[JettaKnight]

why was the spoof thread locked?

THIS!

I liked the part about breaking up a robbery.

 

[T.Lex]

I thought this was the spoof thread, and I missed the first one.

:confused:

 

[chipbennett]

Let's face it - not everyone that has a license to carry should. I have never been a fan of open carry because it lacks the element of surprise. People are automatically alarmed and alert by the site of it. If he had come to rob the place, you would be the first person he dealt with because of your exposed firearm. Never have understood why someone would want to stand out like this. I always carry my sig p938 - nobody even knows I have it in my pocket holster. The crook would never see it coming.

I wonder how long these specious claims will keep being made?

If you're relying on the element of surprise, then you're already under attack by a criminal. Far better to avoid the attack altogether. Criminals fear armed citizens more than they fear even LEO. Criminals want to commit their crimes with minimal hindrance, time, and attention. Criminals tend to have tunnel vision, and are not likely to notice an openly carried firearm on the person of a bystander. If a criminal does notice an armed bystander, the criminal is more likely to desist, and look for an easier mark.

[The Armed Criminal in America, DOJ 1985 (pdf)]

 

[searpinski]

The guy may have been hypertensive, who knows? He didn't do anything wrong or illegal. I'd say leave him alone and go on about your business.

 

[BiscuitNaBasket]

The guy may have been hypertensive, who knows? He didn't do anything wrong or illegal. I'd say leave him alone and go on about your business.

I think that's exactly what OP did. He left the guy alone and decided it was in his best interest if he and his wife left.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I wonder how long these specious claims will keep being made?

If you're relying on the element of surprise, then you're already under attack by a criminal. Far better to avoid the attack altogether. Criminals fear armed citizens more than they fear even LEO. Criminals want to commit their crimes with minimal hindrance, time, and attention. Criminals tend to have tunnel vision, and are not likely to notice an openly carried firearm on the person of a bystander. If a criminal does notice an armed bystander, the criminal is more likely to desist, and look for an easier mark.

[The Armed Criminal in America, DOJ 1985 (pdf)]

I've been involved in the investigation of several robberies of people who were OC, which I've recounted here before. The Boston Marathon bombers targeted a cop to attempt to get his gun. OC is not a talisman that wards off criminals. It is sometimes the target of the criminals. Do what you want, but if you are relying on the talisman effect, you may be really surprised one day.

 

[chipbennett]

I've been involved in the investigation of several robberies of people who were OC, which I've recounted here before. The Boston Marathon bombers targeted a cop to attempt to get his gun. OC is not a talisman that wards off criminals. It is sometimes the target of the criminals. Do what you want, but if you are relying on the talisman effect, you may be really surprised one day.

I'm talking about bystanders. A police officer is targeted for different reasons. Also, a terrorist has different motives than a run-of-the-mill criminal.

OC is certainly not a talisman; but even if only one criminal is deterred by the presence of an OC bystander, that's one more person than will ever be deterred by a CC bystander. Criminals don't know who may be carrying concealed, because, as we all preach, concealed is concealed.

ETA:

I have no doubt that OCers can be targeted for robberies. But I would assume that, as with most victims, the person presents as an easy mark: poor situational awareness, etc.

The real question, regarding "element of surprise" etc., is: how many times has a criminal, intent on committing some crime, first targeted and shot an OC bystander before committing his intended crime?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

The real question, regarding "element of surprise" etc., is: how many times has a criminal, intent on committing some crime, first targeted and shot an OC bystander before committing his intended crime?

If you count security guards as bystanders, it happens.

Security Guard Fatally Shot During Gun Battle Inside San Bernardino Marijuana Dispensary | KTLA

Or

[video=youtube;OKn1esoxQ0c]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKn1esoxQ0c[/video]

I don't know anything about the providence of this video, but if its a fake its pretty convincing.

Given the relative rarity of both OC among non-security/LE carriers and the relative rarity of business robberies while any given person is there, I think you'll find that the two are simply not occurring at the same time very often. Uniformed security being shot or otherwise neutralized is also rare, but does occur. Armed security does, of course, also offer a deterrent effect. It simply depends on how dedicated the criminals are, and thus my warning to not rely on the talisman effect of the gun.

Most criminal acts do not start out as an attack, they start out as a demand. Give me your money. Get in the car. Open the safe. That's when the element of surprise can make all the difference between win or loss.

Again, I don't care what you do or how you carry. Just have a realistic understanding of the pros and cons based on actual events.

I'm talking about bystanders. A police officer is targeted for different reasons. Also, a terrorist has different motives than a run-of-the-mill criminal.

Generally I would agree, but not in the specific case of Tsarnaev, as the stated motive was to get an additional firearm for the brother who did not have one. They didn't target him because of his uniform like the folks who put the Gadsden flag on the cops they killed, they targeted him because they knew he had a gun and they wanted that gun.