Shotguns for Home Defense - Myths and Realities

[Sailor]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrxkjRXk7m8"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrxkjRXk7m8[/ame]

 

[Kirk Freeman]

That was actually reasonable and logical. Something must be wrong.

 

[figley]

He seems to have drunk a cup of humility somewhere in the past few months. His last few videos have been less arrogant, and made more sense.

In this one, I was right there with him, up until he advocated the shotgun over a rifle for HD. That, though, could be considered a personal preference. (even though he's wrong)

 

[Dragon]

Wow, yeah. His videos are getting much better. I won't say it's totally changing my opinion about him, but this an improvement. Also I'll say, I'm not judgmental enough to say anything personal about him, it's just the attitude portrayed in video on the internet.

 

[Tommy2Tone]

I really enjoyed that video. Nothing seemed like BS. Gave reasoning for his preferences. I do like the idea of a 20 gauge. That maybe one of my next purchases.

 

[figley]

I do like the idea of a 20 gauge. That maybe one of my next purchases.

Some folks have gone to 20 for deer, citing its weight, manageability, and ballistics at longer distances, while having to give up nothing in game-taking effectiveness.

For HD purposes, I've pondered the idea. Ol' Painless proved 20ga might be a sufficient choice for HD. The Box O' Truth #22 - 20 Gauge Shotgun - Page 1

If it helps you to put shots on target, quickly, and effectively, it might be a good fit for you.

 

[223 Gunner]

I think this video was done well.

 

[jve153]

around 2:30 he talks about using an ar15 with ball ammo if you are worried about over penetration. that goes against a lot of what i have read/seen from reading and shooting my ar. having shot through a number of decent sized trees, its hard for me to fathom that bullet just coming apart in wallboard. can anyone explain this in a little more detail so that i may understand it?

 

[223 Gunner]

around 2:30 he talks about using an ar15 with ball ammo if you are worried about over penetration. that goes against a lot of what i have read/seen from reading and shooting my ar. having shot through a number of decent sized trees, its hard for me to fathom that bullet just coming apart in wallboard. can anyone explain this in a little more detail so that i may understand it?

I"m interested in this as well. I would think as fast as a .223 bullet travels out of an AR, that it would go right though walls.

 

[esrice]

That was actually reasonable and logical.

He seems to have drunk a cup of humility somewhere in the past few months. His last few videos have been less arrogant, and made more sense.

Wow, yeah. His videos are getting much better.

I really enjoyed that video. Nothing seemed like BS.

I think this video was done well.

Man, a guy stops wearing tight Affliction t-shirts and and people quickly change their tune.

 

[churchmouse]

Everyone has an opinion based on something they feel, believe or have experienced. I would not use an AR in my house unless it was the only thing I could get to. I have shot through a Motor home in a wrecking yard. All the way through it, front to back. The round went through the front cowling, the passenger seat, the parts and pieces on the way through the bathroom and out the back. It was a 55 gr. PMC Ball round. Nothing special.
No way an AR should be used at home unless you want to kill a car.
.45 ACP loaded with Glaser rds. and a 12 gauge auto-loader.

 

[jeremy]

So Zoub would you care to comment on this Video....

 

[greyhound47]

Wow. That was actually interesting and well-reasoned. Old age must be agreeing with him. Good vid.

 

[figley]

around 2:30 he talks about using an ar15 with ball ammo if you are worried about over penetration. that goes against a lot of what i have read/seen from reading and shooting my ar. having shot through a number of decent sized trees, its hard for me to fathom that bullet just coming apart in wallboard. can anyone explain this in a little more detail so that i may understand it?

To get the discussion started:


:: Ammo Oracle

Here, after my own learning, is my understanding:

The key is fragmentation, a counter-intuitive behavior of projectiles, in rifle ballistics, a velocity threshold at which a bullet will "come undone" upon contact with soft tissue. Ol_Painless put 5.56 through the Box O' Truth, and it did penetrate drywall. There has been much debate over this issue. My own understanding is that 1. continuous soft tissue is much more conducive to bringing about fragmentation, than is a thin, dry barrier, 2. a single over-penetrating projectile is less dangerous than nine of them, and 3. a long gun is more accurate than a handgun.

A .224", 55gr, cannelured projectile (XM193) has a reliable fragmentation point at anything above 2700fps. For some longer bullets, that threshold is lower, due to increased surface area. The cannelure (band around the bullet) aids in separation of the copper jacket at the beginning of fragmentation, which is brought about by the "yaw" of the bullet, upon meeting resistance. My best analogy of yaw, is the way a traditional toy spinning top falls to the side as it slows down. Surface tension, due to the bullet now traveling through the tissue sideways, acts upon the weak spot (cannelure), to rip the copper jacket from its soft lead core.

Your Wolf, Tula, or other .223 ammo, which may or may not use a cannelured bullet, and may or may not be loaded hot enough to maintain a velocity in excess of 2700fps, will penetrate an automobile (again, a thin, dry barrier). I've done exactly that, which is part of what sent me back to researching the mystery that is fragmentation.

On another note, Mk318 62gr OTMRP ammunition, is designed to penetrate, and is referred to as being, "barrier blind". This says to me that it was designed to solve a problem XM193 (or XM855?) could not, which is the penetration of barriers, while being lethal on the other side.

 

[IndyMedic]

Good Video He made a lot of good points, although I would never use a rifle in my house.

I haven't seen many of his videos but I didn't this one was too bad.

 

[Hookeye]

Que's will be better.

 

[kawtech87]

Man, a guy stops wearing tight Affliction t-shirts and and people quickly change their tune.

Nah I still hate Yeager, but this was a much better than normal video for him.

I didnt see one shoulder twitch, and I didnt get called an "assclown" for OCing my 1911.

 

[JetGirl]

LOL!!! "I hope you like my shirt". OK, that was good. At least the dude has a sense of humor about himself.

 

[gunman41mag]

My home defense shotguns are semi-auto 12 gauge with rifle sights

 

[fullmetaljesus]

This guy annoys me, but i have to say, it was a decent video. And like you guys, i dont like the idea of firing a rifle in my house. I want to hit just the intruder not my neighbors.