Slate: If you send your kids to private school, you are a bad person

[Lex Concord]

Y'all did pick up that we're being lectured about what all high schools everywhere teach and what we should and shouldn't worry about as to our high-school aged kids by someone who was in high school in 2004, didn't ya?

Like I said, I miss the days when I knew everything

 

[level.eleven]

It seems so obvious to me that it was hard to believe you were not aware. I don't really have the time to spend giving a definitive treatise on how the left-wing liberal elite have infiltrated our education system over the past half-century and how their anti-American teachings, bias against the US, democracy, and Christianity, and liberal ideas have permeated the system. It seems that only a liberal could be so blind as not to see it.

No time for a thesis, but here are a few links:

Teaching Them to Hate US | American Renaissance

Are Public Schools Teaching Students to Hate America?

Florida Rep. Ritch Workman Claims High School Textbook Has Pro-Islam Bias

Debate again thrusts CSCOPE into Texas spotlight | www.statesman.com

Uhh. You linked to a White Supremacist site and the Canadian version of Alex Jones.

 

[Streak]

Y'all did pick up that we're being lectured about what all high schools everywhere teach and what we should and shouldn't worry about as to our high-school aged kids by someone who was in high school in 2004, didn't ya?

Where did you pick up where I said what was to be/not be taught? I asked for examples of these claims people have about "liberal ideology" being forced upon our children in the classrooms. I'm genuinely curious and I find it funny that when I ask for examples I get jumped on for not immediately agreeing with the popular thought.

Call me silly, but I thought part of being independent was seeking out answers for yourself and not just taking what others say as gospel.

 

[Streak]

Easy there, Matt. I haven't touched a public school text in decades. I do have specifics from my time, but apparently, as thread king, you have ruled them inadmissible.

Damn I miss the days when I knew everything.

I said I'd prefer to see recent examples as everyone seems to be talking about things that are going on right here and now. I'd love to see the day when people like yourself not instantly go to trashing or disrespecting someone for asking a question. I have picked up a public school book and I have read them. Seeing as how you haven't, perhaps it's just a simple case that I know more about this topic than you do? Or maybe I don't, but again all I asked for was examples.

Will I get anything out of this thread other than rudeness or generalized, blanket statements?

 

[Lex Concord]

I said I'd prefer to see recent examples as everyone seems to be talking about things that are going on right here and now. I'd love to see the day when people like yourself not instantly go to trashing or disrespecting someone for asking a question. I have picked up a public school book and I have read them. Seeing as how you haven't, perhaps it's just a simple case that I know more about this topic than you do? Or maybe I don't, but again all I asked for was examples.

Will I get anything out of this thread other than rudeness or generalized, blanket statements?

Had you chosen to take this tone initially, perhaps your attitude wouldn't have been reflected. If you maintain a position of genuine curiosity, you might find your "inquiry" will bear more fruit.

As far as what I saw in my day (I've read plenty of public school texts, just not recently), abortion as an acceptable means of birth control (no mention of abstinence as a possibility), the acceptance of teen sex as normal, the writing off of the Second Amendment as merely protecting a right for the existence of the National Guard (two sentences out of an entire text on government, and an entire chapter on the Bill of Rights). Those are typically considered liberal ideologies, and the ones that come to mind immediately.

As far as what it's like today, I have friends who are public school teachers; they homeschool their kids and many of the reasons are the "liberal" ideologies espoused in those schools in which they teach. It's in the texts, the teachers, and inherent in the system.

Regarding the inherent "liberalism" (i.e. anti-individual statist bent) if you are truly curious, you can research the origins of "free" public schooling and the Prussian model.

 

[Streak]

Like I said, I miss the days when I knew everything

Had you chosen to take this tone initially, perhaps your attitude wouldn't have been reflected. If you maintain a position of genuine curiosity, you might find your "inquiry" will bear more fruit.

As far as what I saw in my day (I've read plenty of public school texts, just not recently), abortion as an acceptable means of birth control (no mention of abstinence as a possibility), the acceptance of teen sex as normal, the writing off of the Second Amendment as merely protecting a right for the existence of the National Guard (two sentences out of an entire text on government, and an entire chapter on the Bill of Rights). Those are typically considered liberal ideologies, and the ones that come to mind immediately.

As far as what it's like today, I have friends who are public school teachers; they homeschool their kids and many of the reasons are the "liberal" ideologies espoused in those schools in which they teach. It's in the texts, the teachers, and inherent in the system.

Regarding the inherent "liberalism" (i.e. anti-individual statist bent) if you are truly curious, you can research the origins of "free" public schooling and the Prussian model.

Sadly that's the downfall of text-based communication. I truly was just curious, so I'm sorry to everyone if I came off otherwise.

I know my school system taught abstinence and when my little brother was going through middle school they did the same (it wasn't ever really touched on in HS). As for teen sex being "normal", I guess we need to define what you mean by teen. 13/14, probably not. 15/16-19 -- yeah I'd say it's as normal now as it was during the hippie era.

I personally don't have a problem with two consenting teens having safe, protected sex -- it's a part of life and young love has been a reoccurring theme since...forever.

The Second Amendment thing you may have a point on -- I can't remember it all that much and the books I saw didn't touch much on each part of the Constitution all that much (with the exception of the Freedom of Speech which had a page and a half dedicated to it).

The Bills of Rights is a liberal thing? That's literally the first time I've ever heard that said...

 

[Lex Concord]

The Bills of Rights is a liberal thing? That's literally the first time I've ever heard that said...

No, the fact that, in a Government text with a full chapter on the Bill of Rights, the only mention given of the 2A was that it didn't protect an individual right, only that of the National Guard.

Text-based communication does have its limitations.

 

[Jerchap2]

Back to the OP, an interesting take on it by Herman Cain: "I don't want to join in piling on with more outrageously outraged outrage, since the arguments that Ms. Benedikt's column is garbage write themselves. I would rather shine a light on what she said as a pretty good summation of basic liberal thought in America. In fact, it's the same kind of thinking that gave us ObamaCare."

Politics: Slate editor explains: If you send your kids to private school, you're a bad person | Best of Cain

 

[Streak]

Back to the OP, an interesting take on it by Herman Cain: "I don't want to join in piling on with more outrageously outraged outrage, since the arguments that Ms. Benedikt's column is garbage write themselves. I would rather shine a light on what she said as a pretty good summation of basic liberal thought in America. In fact, it's the same kind of thinking that gave us ObamaCare."

Politics: Slate editor explains: If you send your kids to private school, you're a bad person | Best of Cain

Believe it or not, Obamacare came from Romney's healthcare plan in MA. That plan was derived from a conservative think tank (Heritage Foundation if memory serves).

How the Heritage Foundation, a Conservative Think Tank, Promoted the Individual Mandate - Forbes
Heritage Rewrites History - WSJ.com

Obama's original healthcare plan was much like Canada's. That would've been bad too as I still think there's a place for privatized healthcare. However I'd love to have seen a system put in place much like the UK's. There you have your public health insurance with the option of tacking on private. You have private hospitals (who must take the public health insurance with emergency ER cases) and private doctors for those who think they're waiting too long and can justify the expense.

What America had was doomed to collapse as illegals, uninsured, underinsured were passing their costs on to those who had insurance. Oddly enough it doesn't mean hospitals didn't go and do things like garnish wages and the like.

I would love to a see a mixed private/public system put in place. Everyone wins, costs go down, and the quality of care doesn't have to suffer.

 

[jamil]

People who use private restrooms are bad people. Not quite open carry bad, but leave the seat up and not flush the toilet bad. So, pretty bad. If everyone used public restrooms instead of private restrooms, the quality of pubic restrooms would improve dramatically. Because, well, we all know that everyone using something automatically makes it better.







Disclaimer: I personally have no problem with OC. But this is a gun forum and I had to think of something some folks here might identify as "bad".

 

[jamil]

Believe it or not, Obamacare came from Romney's healthcare plan in MA. That plan was derived from a conservative think tank (Heritage Foundation if memory serves).

How the Heritage Foundation, a Conservative Think Tank, Promoted the Individual Mandate - Forbes
Heritage Rewrites History - WSJ.com

Obama's original healthcare plan was much like Canada's. That would've been bad too as I still think there's a place for privatized healthcare. However I'd love to have seen a system put in place much like the UK's. There you have your public health insurance with the option of tacking on private. You have private hospitals (who must take the public health insurance with emergency ER cases) and private doctors for those who think they're waiting too long and can justify the expense.

What America had was doomed to collapse as illegals, uninsured, underinsured were passing their costs on to those who had insurance. Oddly enough it doesn't mean hospitals didn't go and do things like garnish wages and the like.

I would love to a see a mixed private/public system put in place. Everyone wins, costs go down, and the quality of care doesn't have to suffer.

I thought you said your school didn't teach with a liberal bias.

We have a mixed private/public system now. So what? More public? More private? How would you change the ratio?

I would like to see a free market system. I'd like to tell my doctor he charges too damn much and I'm going elsewhere. But elsewhere essentially doesn't exist in today's US health care system.

 

[Lex Concord]

I know my school system taught abstinence and when my little brother was going through middle school they did the same (it wasn't ever really touched on in HS). As for teen sex being "normal", I guess we need to define what you mean by teen. 13/14, probably not. 15/16-19 -- yeah I'd say it's as normal now as it was during the hippie era.

I personally don't have a problem with two consenting teens having safe, protected sex -- it's a part of life and young love has been a reoccurring theme since...forever.

That's your opinion, and you're welcome to it. That it happens is a fact; that there's nothing wrong with it or that it shouldn't be avoided is a "liberal" ideology. It's not the discussion of the action in schools, but the judgement of the acceptability or unacceptability of action X that makes the teaching slanted one way or the other.

 

[Streak]

That's your opinion, and you're welcome to it. That it happens is a fact; that there's nothing wrong with it or that it shouldn't be avoided is a "liberal" ideology. It's not the discussion of the action in schools, but the judgement of the acceptability or unacceptability of action X that makes the teaching slanted one way or the other.

Abstinence is taught, but America's values are changing (as is most of the rest of the world). The Christian belief of sex before marriage isn't ideal and I don't think it ever really was fully accepted. Why do you think VD and other STDs were so prevalent during WWII, Vietnam era, and whatnot?

Truly if anyone thinks teaching only abstinence is useful, well I have magic beans to sell them. Safe sex is a viable alternative and pushing the idea that sex should be something one does when they're comfortable doing it. It should go without saying that adults preying on children don't factor into this.



I do, however, understand and agree with your underlying point. Education in general should be about facts.

 

[jamil]

Abstinence is taught, but America's values are changing (as is most of the rest of the world). The Christian belief of sex before marriage isn't ideal and I don't think it ever really was fully accepted. Why do you think VD and other STDs were so prevalent during WWII, Vietnam era, and whatnot?

Truly if anyone thinks teaching only abstinence is useful, well I have magic beans to sell them. Safe sex is a viable alternative and pushing the idea that sex should be something one does when they're comfortable doing it. It should go without saying that adults preying on children don't factor into this.



I do, however, understand and agree with your underlying point. Education in general should be about facts.

America's values are changing because of what? Also, abstinence is it's not a uniquely Christian concept.

 

[Streak]

America's values are changing because of what? Also, abstinence is it's not a uniquely Christian concept.

I don't think I'm qualified to say why America's values are changing. I do believe they are -- and it's not necessarily saying it's all for the bad either.

I would agree that no sex before marriage isn't UNIQUELY Christian, but Christianity was a main driving power for the cultural attitude towards sex in America. I would like to point out that there aren't a lot of other religions out there that promote sex before "marriage" and there are plenty of religions over the ages that promoted sex in general. Most of the anti-sex before marriage religions are the Abrahamic religions.

But either way the attitude sex before marriage that America held until the few decades was a result of Christianity.

 

[Mark 1911]

The German government just yesterday seized all four children from a homeschooling family. How far are we from this kind of stormtrooper activity in the US? Boston Marathon bombing aftermath would suggest very close:

HSLDA | Children Seized in Shocking Raid

 

[jamil]

I don't think I'm qualified to say why America's values are changing. I do believe they are -- and it's not necessarily saying it's all for the bad either.

I would agree that no sex before marriage isn't UNIQUELY Christian, but Christianity was a main driving power for the cultural attitude towards sex in America. I would like to point out that there aren't a lot of other religions out there that promote sex before "marriage" and there are plenty of religions over the ages that promoted sex in general. Most of the anti-sex before marriage religions are the Abrahamic religions.

But either way the attitude sex before marriage that America held until the few decades was a result of Christianity.

Then what does Christianity have to do with whether abstinence or safe sex is "ideal"?

You may not have noticed, but you've already identified why America's values are changing. You said, "Safe sex is a viable alternative and pushing the idea that sex should be something one does when they're comfortable doing it"

Pushing that idea is exactly what has happened over the last 50 years. The problem is, 50 years ago, the other side of the argument had some say in the matter. They don't anymore. "Ideal" is an opinion, which means that others may have different opinions. But the only opinion you hear in the mainstream, is exactly the one that you believe. Do you think that's a coincidence?

 

[hoosierdaddy1976]

watch out everyone, i'm a teacher and i'm coming for your kids! if only my principal would let me wear a hat and sunglasses in the building...

[video=youtube_share;DbsMZecRgbI]http://youtu.be/DbsMZecRgbI[/video]

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Oh good god: Sex between students and teachers should not be a crime - The Washington Post

 

[hoosierdaddy1976]

Oh good god: Sex between students and teachers should not be a crime - The Washington Post

sorry, but i feel you're really fishing on this one. how does the opinion of one woman (who never was a teacher by the way) hold any sort of sway over society's norms?